Watch UFC 245 Exclusively on ESPN+

Catch Every Moment of UFC 245 Experience UFC PPV events like never before with ESPN+ and save over 25%!

Expand Minimize
  1. nzrocketman's Avatar
    I just skimmed through this article when trying to look into the lumia 1020. then I spent the last 60mintues reading the comments that are bashing the author for a poorly written piece bashing Window Phone 8

    Nokia
    08-04-2013 04:40 PM
  2. Ray Adams's Avatar
    Sad, but true. Wp8 is in Stone Age. Despite my love to Microsoft solutions and having all WP devices starting from htc hd7, I still cannot recommend it to other people. WP brings unique path to use phone, but it's sometimes looks like alien technology. Microsoft must not dive to deep in unknown places of oceans. They must implement every possible feature or no one will buy phones. Android now has bigger percentage than iPhone and look what apple did!? With iOS 7 they brought a lof of simple features, but everyone needs it!
    08-04-2013 05:12 PM
  3. Reflexx's Avatar
    There are some decent points. But some are dumb.

    He says that the OS is a problem and spends most of his time complaining about apps. Apps are not the OS. Geez.

    I'd agree that the app ecosystem needs growing. But that is happening right now.

    The OS is sensational, but it is missing some things that others have. It also contains things that others dont have.
    08-04-2013 05:13 PM
  4. metalchick719's Avatar
    The title of that article pretty much says it all. The guy has no clue about WP8 and most likely didn't even play around with the 1020 he wrote about, other than the camera.
    snowmutt and Jazmac like this.
    08-04-2013 05:25 PM
  5. thomas wojcik's Avatar
    Venture beat? Never heard of "em and won't lose any sleep over the article.
    Bartdog likes this.
    08-04-2013 05:25 PM
  6. Noahma's Avatar
    I like how he Is saying that the OS is not updating fast enough.......

    Well, Windows phone 8 for all intents and purposes is NEW. The underpinnings are completely new, nothing of the old survived. Sure the face of the OS looks the same as 7.x but the base is new. There was an update for the OS 3 months after release, another due anytime now. Another due a few months from now. and one due Q1 2014. That is 4 releases with new features / updates to the core within a year. Apple generally releases two updates per year, a mid year bug fix, and the feature release in the fall. Android somewhere around the same (although there are many devices that have never seen an update (damn carriers) .

    Patience is the key, I realize some have been here since the beginning of 7 but this was a MAJOR overhaul of the OS, which has some stuff that is needing to be worked out to get some of the missing items from the last iteration, and add new features.
    08-04-2013 06:56 PM
  7. drbanks's Avatar
    His first two gripes: uploading to YouTube and no native instagram? Oh, sure, that's 90 of what anyone does with a smartphone.

    (sarcasm)
    08-04-2013 07:02 PM
  8. OzRob's Avatar
    There are some decent points. But some are dumb.

    He says that the OS is a problem and spends most of his time complaining about apps. Apps are not the OS. Geez.

    I'd agree that the app ecosystem needs growing. But that is happening right now.
    Apps may not be the OS, but these days the apps maketh the OS. And while the WP app ecosystem is growing, the locked down API prevents app developers from filling the gaps left in the OS by Microsoft. For example, there is no way through the API for a developer to change the phone volume or turn wifi on/off (or change any other system setting) programatically. There is no way through the API for a developer to manipulate file downloads such as email attachments.

    So the app ecosystem can grow as much as it likes, but some fundamental gaps and missing features will persist until Microsoft deigns to gift them to us. And that IS an OS problem.
    08-04-2013 07:26 PM
  9. aximtreo's Avatar
    Apps may not be the OS, but these days the apps maketh the OS. And while the WP app ecosystem is growing, the locked down API prevents app developers from filling the gaps left in the OS by Microsoft. For example, there is no way through the API for a developer to change the phone volume or turn wifi on/off (or change any other system setting) programatically. There is no way through the API for a developer to manipulate file downloads such as email attachments.




    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    OK, do me a favor. Give me the apps that are missing that you absolutely have to have and use a great percentage of the day. Don't give me the well worn list seen here but those that cause you to loose sleep over. I for one can't come up with such an app or apps. Yes there are a couple of areas that I would like to have the capability to do but those I would only use 1% of the day. Are you telling me that you and others use Instagram and Utube hours upon hours per day. If so, you need to go to the OS that offers those capabilities to you now and come back to WP when it has grown to your satisfaction. Not necessarily pointing a finger at you but just speaking to those that dwell on what the OS doesn't have rather than what it does have.

    So the app ecosystem can grow as much as it likes, but some fundamental gaps and missing features will persist until Microsoft deigns to gift them to us. And that IS an OS problem.
    Last edited by aximtreo; 08-04-2013 at 09:11 PM. Reason: formatting
    08-04-2013 09:10 PM
  10. mase123987's Avatar
    I think I will pass and not give the writer page hits if it is that bad.
    08-04-2013 09:52 PM
  11. OzRob's Avatar
    @aximtreo

    Not sure why you're (badly) quoting my post in relation to missing apps - I've actually said that lack of apps IS NOT the problem with WP (and for the record, I don't use Instagram or YouTube).

    That notwithstanding, it's only natural for people to focus on what's not in the OS because that's what limits what they can do with the phone. That's what creates barriers to using the phone they way want to.

    And you're right - those that need those missing features and functions (whether supplied by the OS or an app) should be moving to other platforms that give those features and functions. That's what I've done. And, sadly for WP in general, that's what a number of others have and are doing. But if you believe that everyone should also just stop complaining about the missing features and functions, then you're doing a disservice to WP, because WP needs to keep as many people as possible that decide to give it a go in the first place. And I believe that's only going to happen if people keep the pressure on to have the missing features and functionality addressed by Microsoft as soon as possible. Sure, particular features or apps might not be important to you, but they may be to others. And WP needs to appeal to as many people as possible if it's going to be developed and capitalise on the potential it has. Otherwise it'll just end up being a footnote in history of smart phone development.
    08-04-2013 10:02 PM
  12. fatclue_98's Avatar
    @aximtreo

    Not sure why you're (badly) quoting my post in relation to missing apps - I've actually said that lack of apps IS NOT the problem with WP (and for the record, I don't use Instagram or YouTube).

    That notwithstanding, it's only natural for people to focus on what's not in the OS because that's what limits what they can do with the phone. That's what creates barriers to using the phone they way want to.

    And you're right - those that need those missing features and functions (whether supplied by the OS or an app) should be moving to other platforms that give those features and functions. That's what I've done. And, sadly for WP in general, that's what a number of others have and are doing. But if you believe that everyone should also just stop complaining about the missing features and functions, then you're doing a disservice to WP, because WP needs to keep as many people as possible that decide to give it a go in the first place. And I believe that's only going to happen if people keep the pressure on to have the missing features and functionality addressed by Microsoft as soon as possible. Sure, particular features or apps might not be important to you, but they may be to others. And WP needs to appeal to as many people as possible if it's going to be developed and capitalise on the potential it has. Otherwise it'll just end up being a footnote in history of smart phone development.
    You make some very valid points and it's refreshing to read a contrasting POV without coming off as either a fanboy or hater. That being said, users have been clamoring for file managers, separate messaging ringtones, ability to attach PDFs to emails, attachment download folders and the list goes on since the inception of WP7. NoDo brought us cut-and-paste as well as custom ringtones. Mango brought us internet sharing and the end of the disappearing keyboard, Tango brought us headaches and 7.8 was a slap in our face as far as updates go. The reboot (WP8) really should have addressed these basic omissions. Notice I'm not mentioning apps because that's an entirely different animal. I'm talking about basic baked-in functionality that we took for granted from the WinMo days. When a Treo 650 from 2004 can outplay you out-of-the-box, your OS has issues.
    maj71303 likes this.
    08-04-2013 10:22 PM
  13. tungha's Avatar
    I like how he Is saying that the OS is not updating fast enough.......

    Well, Windows phone 8 for all intents and purposes is NEW. The underpinnings are completely new, nothing of the old survived. Sure the face of the OS looks the same as 7.x but the base is new. There was an update for the OS 3 months after release, another due anytime now. Another due a few months from now. and one due Q1 2014. That is 4 releases with new features / updates to the core within a year. Apple generally releases two updates per year, a mid year bug fix, and the feature release in the fall. Android somewhere around the same (although there are many devices that have never seen an update (damn carriers) .

    Patience is the key, I realize some have been here since the beginning of 7 but this was a MAJOR overhaul of the OS, which has some stuff that is needing to be worked out to get some of the missing items from the last iteration, and add new features.
    lots of updates BUT still not what the user want. Patience? Please, this is 2013 and your competitors will not wait.
    08-04-2013 11:27 PM
  14. despertador's Avatar
    I've thought about this recently, and please don't flame me for sharing my opinion... I think that some (note some) of the features not implemented in the WP OS yet weren't implemented on purpose. Why? I think that Microsoft just does it to keep their OS all simplistic. I think it's part of the design really. I've looked at a lot of those WP feature concepts and all of them looked very cluttered/non-simplistic. One thing is, most people approved those concepts, saying that they were pretty good. But maybe that's why so many are dissatisfied? I can see why MS wouldn't want to implement in the way of the concepts, but others have their opinions of them looking good. Maybe it's a disagreement between the Creator vs. the User...

    Have you guys kinda noticed how you think WP's design is much, much better than Windows 8's? Windows 8 seems kinda rushed to me. Some of the design choices I wonder, and it just doesn't have the same beautiful feel as Windows Phone. Can't explain why, but it would be awesome if someone sees what I mean, because it's hard to explain.

    I believe that Windows Phone is taking so long implementing these basic features because of how they want to think it out first. WP feels very polished, and you feel that when you press the Windows key during a call or go open the suspended apps or even when you put your phone on standby (pressing power button to turn off display). Observe the Even the lock screen; to see what I mean, grab your Windows Phone and tap the screen. See how the OS tells the user what to do, and how it does it in a unique way, instead of having flashing white arrows telling you to swipe. The basic feature of orientation lock (the feature that all OSs have) will have to be thought out carefully. It shouldn't flash a circle with a lock icon to show you can lock (UC Browser) as that's too intrusive. Maybe hidden in a gesture? (If they do, they better let the user know in an intuitive fashion somehow) Or maybe MS won't actually think too hard about it and bury it in the Settings. MS will do it in some way or another.
    a5cent likes this.
    08-05-2013 04:48 AM
  15. John20212's Avatar
    Apps may not be the OS, but these days the apps maketh the OS. And while the WP app ecosystem is growing, the locked down API prevents app developers from filling the gaps left in the OS by Microsoft. For example, there is no way through the API for a developer to change the phone volume or turn wifi on/off (or change any other system setting) programatically. There is no way through the API for a developer to manipulate file downloads such as email attachments.

    So the app ecosystem can grow as much as it likes, but some fundamental gaps and missing features will persist until Microsoft deigns to gift them to us. And that IS an OS problem.
    "these days the apps maketh the OS" ???
    Perhaps for Android and iOS where the OS is nothing more than an app launcher, WP is great because you don't need any damn apps to use key phone and social messaging features + you have native Xbox Live, Music, Video support, not to mention integrated Office Word, Excell, Powerpoint and Onenote; and you don't need any stinking apps to use other features people care about like facebook, twitter, etc. because its key features are baked into the OS.

    I like that Microsoft has created a real Phone OS and not just another app launcher.

    "missing features will persist until Microsoft deigns to gift them to us. And that IS an OS problem."
    I actually like that Microsoft has not given up control of key OS features to everyone. I don't want developers to have a free reign to design an app that can severaly compromise the OS by manipulating setting I don't want anyone to access except the OS. Responsible OEMs should perhaps have a littile more control, but we already see that with Nokia, who have picked up and sorted out a few limitations until Microsoft does it themselves.
    Yeah sure, it means that we need to wait for some features to be added by Microsoft (or Nokia) but at least its not a free for all like Android.
    Bartdog, MFmonster, a5cent and 1 others like this.
    08-05-2013 05:10 AM
  16. MFmonster's Avatar
    Apps may not be the OS, but these days the apps maketh the OS. And while the WP app ecosystem is growing, the locked down API prevents app developers from filling the gaps left in the OS by Microsoft. For example, there is no way through the API for a developer to change the phone volume or turn wifi on/off (or change any other system setting) programatically. There is no way through the API for a developer to manipulate file downloads such as email attachments.

    So the app ecosystem can grow as much as it likes, but some fundamental gaps and missing features will persist until Microsoft deigns to gift them to us. And that IS an OS problem.
    The applications alone do not make up the operating system. I may get on board with the API argument if you care to get more specific. I have mixed feelings on the topic. Each OS has quirks and between my 5 phones, four different OS's, WP8 is the easiest and most functional OS for ME. My HTC One is a slick device and I love it. My WP8 devices do my same needed functions and even more efficiently on many tasks. There are applications I had to download on the One to be able to do some of the functions baked in the WP8 OS people hub. There are many applications I don't download for android devices because of the long list of permissions the application requests. I personally find myself never using most applications I download. Probably because I have a lot of devices, a family, and they are a luxury.

    Yes, WP8 is missing some key functions, in my opinion, that I enjoy on ios and android such as a notification hub. I love toasts and live tiles, but it is nice to have a notification hub. Does that feature break the OS, not at all. It is just nice to have. The only other function that is nice is different ring tones. Sometimes people get way to dramatic about a missing feature like the device does not function without it. Just silly. It does not mean WP should not grow and add some features just some perspective is needed.

    It comes down to this..."to each his own". We need choice and WP8 is a great choice that will get better.
    08-05-2013 09:43 AM
  17. snowmutt's Avatar
    I think I will pass and not give the writer page hits if it is that bad.
    Now, I feel bad for going to the link!!!

    Never again, mase123987, I promise......
    mase123987 and Bartdog like this.
    08-05-2013 12:29 PM
  18. Bartdog's Avatar
    Now, I feel bad for going to the link!!!

    Never again, mase123987, I promise......
    I'm searching for the comments in disqus so I can go snark w/out adding to page views.
    08-05-2013 01:37 PM
  19. o0Nighthawk0o's Avatar
    I'm searching for the comments in disqus so I can go snark w/out adding to page views.
    Hmmmm, Disqus? Isn't that a WP exclusive app?
    08-05-2013 02:45 PM
  20. TechFreak1's Avatar
    This guy needs to pull his head out his own behind lol then maybe he would learn a thing or two. Right clicked and copied the link location into the address bar.. not even going to waste my time going through the comments right now. I can imagine there is more than a turf war going on there lol...
    08-05-2013 05:05 PM
  21. nikhilr51's Avatar
    Just read the article, I agree with him 100%

    He's taken the time (unlike other reporters) to try out the 3rd party apps for instagram, facebook and youtube uploading.
    Unfortunatly the instagram apps had problems (true), facebook is terrible and youtube didnt work for him (I cant comment on that as i dont have a 1020).

    I respect the author for his article and he seems to be very much "in the know" regarding WP.

    The WP supporters in the comments make me mad, crap like linking to a video of 3rd party app 6tagram and saying "AND here is the Windows Phone instagram app under testing - again the best on any platform". How do you know its the best on any platform if its not out yet, also its not an official app.
    08-06-2013 02:33 AM
  22. NosRokanaske's Avatar
    I read it somewhat thoroughly and i see where he is coming from and i do agree with him to some extent. Right now WP8 is kinda stuck in an infinite loop when it comes to apps.
    Why aren't developers making more apps for WP8? Because there isn't a big and stable/growing ecosystem.
    Why isn't there a big and stable/growing ecosystem? Because developers aren't making apps. And repeat.
    It kinda sucks and really it is up to developers at this point to take a risk and make something for WP8 to see if they get a response. At the same time developers dont want, not really dont want but why should they, to dedicate time and effort on making an app that may or may not be successful on a platform when there are 2 other platforms, iOS and Android, where they most likely will be successful or at least gain user base that will help them become successful by going that route. Halfbrick did take a risk with releasing Fruit Ninja, fully updated to my knowledge, on WP8 but i am pretty sure they knew it would be successful because people were asking for it. I dont think Android's version is even up to date (I checked my Nexus 7 and it didnt seem like the iOS or WP8 version at all).

    For me personally, i dont really care what platform i am on because i do pretty basic tasks on my smartphone. I usually only text, web browse, and check my emails. I don't really do anything apart from that and having apps to consume time its just a bonus. But there are people who do use those major apps FB, YouTube, Instagram, and Vine to some extent. There are people interested in WP8 for sure, but because it is lacking those "core" apps, most people just end up sticking with Android or iOS because it has the apps they are always using. There are very good third party apps, but the general consumer doesn't want third party apps simply because it does seem kinda sketchy no matter how good the reviews are. You guys may not agree, but i really believe that not having those apps is holding WP8 back. Its kinda ****ty to say this, but once WP8 does get those apps, then people will start adopting. I love my 920 and probably won't move away from WP8 for a while, but this is the direction it has to go.
    08-06-2013 04:26 AM

Similar Threads

  1. can anyone post uncompressed video samples?
    By Shayx in forum Nokia Lumia 1020
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 08-11-2013, 04:35 AM
  2. WPCentral Podcasts (Dave/James pass this to Daniel)
    By mase123987 in forum Site Feedback & Help
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 08-05-2013, 09:11 PM
  3. So is this really a Nokia 909??
    By IMStrugglin in forum Nokia Lumia 1020
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 08-05-2013, 03:20 AM
  4. Sold my 920, went back to android. good riddance wp8.
    By Pelle Lbergh in forum Phone Wars
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 08-03-2013, 04:55 PM
  5. Recommendations for a good Flickr app.
    By RetroGlide in forum Nokia Lumia 920
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 08-03-2013, 02:56 PM
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD