09-25-2014 02:41 AM
27 12
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  1. untitled007's Avatar
    Anyone here annoyed by the free space at the top of the screen when pressing the windows button? i think ms should adjust it, it just it almost available for 1 tile , its too low, thwy should move it a bit higher, and its kinda annoying looking at a big white space at the top after pressing win button
    Guytronic likes this.
    12-31-2013 10:17 PM
  2. Nogitsune Micah's Avatar
    You mean the top where the time is? It doesn't bother me as I barely notice it.
    jfa1 likes this.
    12-31-2013 10:25 PM
  3. WanderingTraveler's Avatar
    It's roughly half a tile.

    It's there to provide space for the toast notifications, to have proof that you can indeed scroll, and as some sore of space for the Start Screen to breathe.

    While I'd personally let it slide, it is getting annoying (the space and all these threads about the space)
    12-31-2013 10:25 PM
  4. Mr Lebowski's Avatar
    If you use dark background it's just black so the big white space is not even noticed.

    I might hate it if I used the light background, so I don't.
    12-31-2013 10:29 PM
  5. tgp's Avatar
    It's there to provide space for the toast notifications, to have proof that you can indeed scroll, and as some sore of space for the Start Screen to breathe.
    Yes I've heard it's to make space for the toasts, but I guess I don't quite follow Microsoft's reasoning. The toasts appear for a few seconds, but yet they keep that space blank. To me it doesn't matter if it covers half a tile for a few seconds. I must be wrong...
    Spicymikey likes this.
    01-01-2014 12:00 AM
  6. Jupast's Avatar
    It is annoying, there should be an option to lock the Tiles up into place.

    The Toasts thing probably isn't the main reason. The best one i've heard for the gap being there is so the half tiles at the bottom are a pointer to new users that they can scroll down. Once people know of course, they're stuck with it.
    01-01-2014 01:30 PM
  7. jmerrey's Avatar
    One thing I noticed on the 1520 is that space is reduced by quite a bit. Maybe it's an optical illusion though...
    01-01-2014 03:15 PM
  8. Wide opeN's Avatar
    I'm new to WP, and believe the answer to my question is no, but I'll ask anyway: is there anyway to make the network and signal indicators persist!?

    Has there ever been any discussion around this on the part if Microsoft!?
    01-01-2014 05:51 PM
  9. WanderingTraveler's Avatar
    I'm new to WP, and believe the answer to my question is no, but I'll ask anyway: is there anyway to make the network and signal indicators persist!?

    Has there ever been any discussion around this on the part if Microsoft!?
    There's no way to always keep then there. Unless, of course, the app you're in is coded to do so.
    01-01-2014 06:19 PM
  10. neo158's Avatar
    I'm new to WP, and believe the answer to my question is no, but I'll ask anyway: is there anyway to make the network and signal indicators persist!?

    Has there ever been any discussion around this on the part if Microsoft!?
    You've already answered the question, the answer is no. The reason behind this is that Microsoft want you to concentrate on using the phone not the status of it all the time.

    I also prefer to have the gap at the top, it just looks weird with no gap there!!
    xandros9 likes this.
    01-01-2014 06:40 PM
  11. jfa1's Avatar
    Yes I've heard it's to make space for the toasts, but I guess I don't quite follow Microsoft's reasoning. The toasts appear for a few seconds, but yet they keep that space blank. To me it doesn't matter if it covers half a tile for a few seconds. I must be wrong...
    Nope you are entitled to your opinions.
    tgp likes this.
    01-01-2014 06:56 PM
  12. SwimSwim's Avatar
    It is annoying, there should be an option to lock the Tiles up into place.
    I disagree. Well, I agree with the point of getting rid of the "gutter," so to speak, but it shouldn't be a toggle. The settings are crowded enough and completely lacking organization as it is.

    The Metro design is supposed to be fluid, elegant and simple, and while it is on the surface is terms of looks, I must admit, at times it's far more unintuitive to use than necessary. Seriously, I feel like we're only two toggles away from being as messy and over crowded as Android!!!

    Windows 8.1 settings do a far better job of organizing everything, and so until Microsoft gets Windows Phone on par with that, NO MORE TOGGLES!!!
    01-01-2014 07:19 PM
  13. Squachy's Avatar
    I'd prefer to remove the gutter as well. I always thought the toasts were just an overlay anyways. I mean, they still show up in any other program you use that doesn't have that gap. Besides, if they removed that gap you can actually fit an additonal full row of small tiles onto the screen.

    Those status indicators...theres no reason they shouldn't be displayable full time. The indicator space is always there in every app.
    01-01-2014 09:50 PM
  14. neo158's Avatar
    I'd prefer to remove the gutter as well. I always thought the toasts were just an overlay anyways. I mean, they still show up in any other program you use that doesn't have that gap. Besides, if they removed that gap you can actually fit an additonal full row of small tiles onto the screen.

    Those status indicators...theres no reason they shouldn't be displayable full time. The indicator space is always there in every app.
    I have to disagree, why would removing the "gutter" make any difference?

    As for the status indicators, this isn't Android so we don't need to see the status of the phone every 5 seconds. The phone alerts you with icons in the status area when you need to be alerted of no signal or a low battery anyway. Not only that but the indicator space isn't in EVERY app otherwise you would have access to the status indicators in every app, which you don't.
    01-01-2014 10:43 PM
  15. Jupast's Avatar
    I disagree. Well, I agree with the point of getting rid of the "gutter," so to speak, but it shouldn't be a toggle. The settings are crowded enough and completely lacking organization as it is.

    The Metro design is supposed to be fluid, elegant and simple, and while it is on the surface is terms of looks, I must admit, at times it's far more unintuitive to use than necessary. Seriously, I feel like we're only two toggles away from being as messy and over crowded as Android!!!

    Windows 8.1 settings do a far better job of organizing everything, and so until Microsoft gets Windows Phone on par with that, NO MORE TOGGLES!!!
    Ummm, well in the unlikely event this did happen, it wouldn't be until WP 8.1 anyway. I wasn't suggesting Microsoft were going to add this tomorrow.

    Maybe by 8.1 they'll have organized Settings better. I agree, at the moment, they're a mess.
    01-01-2014 11:39 PM
  16. Angry_Mushroom's Avatar
    It is an odd thing, and I've wondered about it more than once. Frankly it isn't bothersome enough to actually complain about. Certainly won't if they change it. Since I do keep my screen on dark settings, I really don't notice it.
    01-02-2014 03:47 AM
  17. neo158's Avatar
    I disagree. Well, I agree with the point of getting rid of the "gutter," so to speak, but it shouldn't be a toggle. The settings are crowded enough and completely lacking organization as it is.

    The Metro design is supposed to be fluid, elegant and simple, and while it is on the surface is terms of looks, I must admit, at times it's far more unintuitive to use than necessary. Seriously, I feel like we're only two toggles away from being as messy and over crowded as Android!!!

    Windows 8.1 settings do a far better job of organizing everything, and so until Microsoft gets Windows Phone on par with that, NO MORE TOGGLES!!!
    Why shouldn't it be a toggle, options are great and I don't want to see WP going the iOS one size fits all route. That would go completely against what WP is, a phone that's as unique as you are!!

    I do agree that Settings is a mess and needs tidying up a bit, maybe the categories idea from Android with a Metro twist.
    01-02-2014 08:58 AM
  18. Paul May's Avatar
    I agree that I think it should be a toggle. It is annoying with the White background, it's not so noticeable with the black so it doesn't bother me as much. Options are always good to have in my opinion.
    01-02-2014 07:55 PM
  19. SwimSwim's Avatar
    While options are good, you've got to be careful with adding too many toggles for everything. I also hate Apple's, "We know what's best" mantra, but I also hate how much of a mess Android is. Sure, you can make Android something that is truly yours, but it comes at the cost of being a mess of options and menus.

    Hence why I like the hybrid approach in Metro. Not being forced to look exactly the same as everyone else, but also not having an overwhelming amount of options, sliders, switches and toggles.

    Seriously, when it comes to something like the gutter, that's such a small design detail that it's not even worthy of a toggle. Save that for the big stuff, perhaps like if you want your Start Screen to be extra wide?

    Choice is good, but too much can be overwhelming and a bad thing. Take a look at Android for a prime example of how choice can become a big mess, real fast. (Thankfully, newer versions of Android ease this pain, but it's still too messy at times [similar to how Windows 8 often still bounces you back to the desktop, outside the clean Metro environment]).
    01-02-2014 10:55 PM
  20. tgp's Avatar
    Choice is good, but too much can be overwhelming and a bad thing. Take a look at Android for a prime example of how choice can become a big mess, real fast. (Thankfully, newer versions of Android ease this pain, but it's still too messy at times [similar to how Windows 8 often still bounces you back to the desktop, outside the clean Metro environment]).
    While I agree that Android could be called a mess, I don't think there's any bigger mess in the mobile world than WP's Settings menu. And it's not nearly as functional as Android's. The Android Settings menu is at least organized in a logical way. But there is a lot in there which makes it more difficult to be intuitive. And to be fair to Android, the Quick Settings enable quickly toggling the most used settings without even going into the menu. That probably cuts using the Settings menu in half at least.
    01-02-2014 11:26 PM
  21. SwimSwim's Avatar
    While I agree that Android could be called a mess, I don't think there's any bigger mess in the mobile world than WP's Settings menu. And it's not nearly as functional as Android's. The Android Settings menu is at least organized in a logical way. But there is a lot in there which makes it more difficult to be intuitive. And to be fair to Android, the Quick Settings enable quickly toggling the most used settings without even going into the menu. That probably cuts using the Settings menu in half at least.
    I agree with that 100%. I hope Windows Phone 8.1 really helps to address this this, and make it more organized like Windows 8.1. Still, even if the settings get reorganized (and for the love of God, I hope they do), I don't think the gutter is major enough to deserve its own toggle.
    01-03-2014 12:25 AM
  22. Paul May's Avatar
    I think WP would benefit from having collapsible menus. Group them in logical sections and make them collapsible so that you don't have to scroll endlessly through all the settings. The phone could even remember which settings you leave open for next time so they don't auto collapse when you exit. This way it sees what settings you use the most and hides the others until you need them.
    One section could just be called Customization in which all those settings can be changed. Anyone not wanting to see those options can essentially leave it collapsed and not worry about that section and not have to scroll through those options in the menu.
    Or even allow the user to group the settings for themselves with their relevance of importance to them. Truly make your device an extension of you, settings and all.
    neo158 likes this.
    01-03-2014 12:45 PM
  23. neo158's Avatar
    I think WP would benefit from having collapsible menus. Group them in logical sections and make them collapsible so that you don't have to scroll endlessly through all the settings. The phone could even remember which settings you leave open for next time so they don't auto collapse when you exit. This way it sees what settings you use the most and hides the others until you need them.
    One section could just be called Customization in which all those settings can be changed. Anyone not wanting to see those options can essentially leave it collapsed and not worry about that section and not have to scroll through those options in the menu.
    Or even allow the user to group the settings for themselves with their relevance of importance to them. Truly make your device an extension of you, settings and all.
    I actually like this idea, it would certainly make navigating settings a much better experience.
    01-03-2014 01:17 PM
  24. manicottiK's Avatar
    The various settings could be grouped and presented as a long list selector (just as the People app groups people by initial). Then, tapping a group header would display a list of all of the groups to let the user quickly scroll to the relevant section of settings. This has the advantage of not creating a new UX metaphor.
    01-03-2014 02:43 PM
  25. Spicymikey's Avatar
    It is annoying, there should be an option to lock the Tiles up into place.

    The Toasts thing probably isn't the main reason. The best one i've heard for the gap being there is so the half tiles at the bottom are a pointer to new users that they can scroll down. Once people know of course, they're stuck with it.
    I agree. If any of these reasons are true then I think it's strange logic. To "waste" space at the top ALL the time so that you don't overlap a tile for a FEW SECONDS when a notification displays seems idiotic. Also, the idea that its there so the bottom tiles cutoff for a visual queue seems equally flawed. Once you've had the phone for 30 seconds you get the idea that its a scrolling list. If they wanted to do it for that reason then add a "screen bounce" when you first power it up to let people know it scrolls.

    I'm hoping the fix this in 8.1. Actually the best solution is to add a way to set your startup position yourself. Maybe you don't even want the windows button to scroll you back to the top. Maybe there is some middle spot in your list you want to be the "home" position. Add some gesture, etc. that makes Windows remember this particular position as your default home resting position
    02-22-2014 09:28 AM
27 12

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