11-29-2013 08:46 AM
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  1. ncxcstud's Avatar
    Sweet! I was telling my wife about my pre-marital conversations with a couple today about the 'cost' of me having 5 1.5 hour conversations + constructing the liturgy + writing a sermon + officiating their wedding and how it'll end up being about 350-400 dollars. Her first response to that was, "Well, I guess that's money you can put in your XBOX One account."

    I love this woman! Woot!
    Vallos likes this.
    08-19-2013 09:28 PM
  2. lce123's Avatar
    Why even buy an Xbox or a PS4 without getting their online services as well?
    Why complain, that's just cheap...
    DavidinCT likes this.
    08-23-2013 07:46 AM
  3. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    Some people aren't big on multiplayer, plain and simple. If you're someone with cable who prefers campaigns (games like BioShock and Borderlands and Skyrim), LIVE might not be a big deal to you.
    08-23-2013 10:56 PM
  4. Kellzea's Avatar
    Some people aren't big on multiplayer, plain and simple. If you're someone with cable who prefers campaigns (games like BioShock and Borderlands and Skyrim), LIVE might not be a big deal to you.
    True, but if you ccan afford an xbox one, then 31.99 per year is not a big deal either.
    08-24-2013 05:18 PM
  5. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    True, but if you ccan afford an xbox one, then 31.99 per year is not a big deal either.
    By that logic, if I can afford an Xbox One, I should just light $60/year on fire because I can afford to. If you don't make use of the service's features, it's not "not a big deal" (which I know is a double-negative). Having money doesn't mean that you shouldn't keep some level of fiscal responsibility in-mind.
    08-24-2013 08:06 PM
  6. Kellzea's Avatar
    By that logic, if I can afford an Xbox One, I should just light $60/year on fire because I can afford to. If you don't make use of the service's features, it's not "not a big deal" (which I know is a double-negative). Having money doesn't mean that you shouldn't keep some level of fiscal responsibility in-mind.
    sigh, but your argument is that you WOULD make use of the services it provides, you just don't want to pay for them. Or more precisely, don't think you should.
    08-25-2013 07:08 AM
  7. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    sigh, but your argument is that you WOULD make use of the services it provides, you just don't want to pay for them. Or more precisely, don't think you should.
    Where did I say that? I didn't say that I want freely-available services or anything. Heck, in all actuality, there AREN'T free services. What Microsoft is doing is making you pay a fee ON TOP OF the subscription fee for things like Netflix, and that's where people get annoyed.
    08-25-2013 09:41 AM
  8. Kellzea's Avatar
    Where did I say that? I didn't say that I want freely-available services or anything. Heck, in all actuality, there AREN'T free services. What Microsoft is doing is making you pay a fee ON TOP OF the subscription fee for things like Netflix, and that's where people get annoyed.
    that's what i just said. You don't want to pay for the access. Xbox live gold is for all online activities bar sending messages. Its not just for playing online games, its basically paying to access the servers. You don't want to pay it. So don't. But its 31.99 a year. That's pittance, the services you gain are worth far in excess of what you pay.
    "not wanting to play online games" is a complaint for the sake of it, because your paying for so much more than that.

    People keep arguing that ie, iplayer, Netflix et al should be free to use as "you already pay a subscription" but by that logic the entire xbox one should be free, as why should you have to pay for something to watch your subscription on?

    Your not paying twice for Netflix, and quite frankly buying an entire games console just to watch Netflix is pretty stupid. 31.99 per year is simply a steal for what you get.
    08-25-2013 12:20 PM
  9. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    that's what i just said. You don't want to pay for the access. Xbox live gold is for all online activities bar sending messages. Its not just for playing online games, its basically paying to access the servers. You don't want to pay it. So don't. But its 31.99 a year. That's pittance, the services you gain are worth far in excess of what you pay.
    "not wanting to play online games" is a complaint for the sake of it, because your paying for so much more than that.

    People keep arguing that ie, iplayer, Netflix et al should be free to use as "you already pay a subscription" but by that logic the entire xbox one should be free, as why should you have to pay for something to watch your subscription on?

    Your not paying twice for Netflix, and quite frankly buying an entire games console just to watch Netflix is pretty stupid. 31.99 per year is simply a steal for what you get.
    No, you're being excessive with that analogy. The console is not a purchase to watch Netflix. That is not what it was built for, it was built to play games. There were additional software features, such as Netflix, that were built for the console, but Microsoft did not build a NetfliXbox. We're talking about paying for the device to watch it on, along with paying for the service. However, that's not enough, and you now have to pay for access to what you paid for access to. It's like having to pay a fee to get into a movie theater so you can get in to buy a ticket.

    What YOU consider a "pittance" is not what everyone considers to be one. You can say "you can afford the console, so you can afford the subscription" all you want, but the Xbox One itself is not an annual investment. You're paying for a console that is expected to last 5-10 years. The original 360 (with a HDD) was $300, but that was $300 for a console whose life cycle has been 8 years (plus however long the additional support it receives is). Someone might be getting Christmas money from multiple relatives to afford the console. A person might have saved up for a couple of years to make this purchase.

    You're basically assuming that anyone who can afford the console is buying it as a "why not?" throwaway of spare change, but it's a serious investment for others. Yes, it might be fair to question those people's financial judgment, but you're drawing an unreasonable conclusion that there is some sort of financial threshold for the console, and that the Xbox LIVE subscription is part of that. If a 12-year-old kid gets Christmas money for the console and buys it, that doesn't mean that he's also going to get random money to pay for Gold every year as well.

    I got my 360 as a gift last Christmas. I get Gold as a birthday present every year. I'm in school full-time, and I'm coming up on the hardest courses offered in my program, and I haven't been able to get a job at the moment. I already have the console, it was a gift, but if I was told that I was no longer going to get the Gold subscription as a gift for my birthday, I wouldn't be able to afford it. You're putting everyone who has a gaming console in a nice, little box and saying that they all have the same financial situation, and that's where your argument falls apart.
    DavidinCT likes this.
    08-25-2013 01:38 PM
  10. Kellzea's Avatar
    I can see your point, and yes, you are right in that having the console doesn't automatically make a live sub financially viable. I will concede that.

    My analogy was purposefully over the top though, as the most used argument is "i shouldn't have to pay twice to watch Netflix"

    My point is that you don't have to pay twice for Netflix. You pay once for Netflix and once for the live sub, the live sub then allows you to use all of the live functions.

    You don't HAVE to buy gold, but if you don't, you cant use the online functions.

    People who want an offline console can have one. Don't buy the sub, but if you want an online console then you pay for live.

    Its an easy model. This "well i want to do x and y online, but i don't wanna z" is people wanting their cake and eating it.

    Pay or don't, but arguing that its unfair is pretty dumb. Its clear what you are paying for. You are paying for live. Not Netflix twice
    08-25-2013 04:42 PM
  11. Kellzea's Avatar
    Sorry for double post. Quick one

    I see it like this, in the uk you pay road tax when you have a car. Its like people buying a car and saying, well i only drive to the shops. That's the only thing i do, i shouldn't have to pay to use all of the roads, i only use one of them. I don't want to use motorways. I shouldn't have to pay.
    08-25-2013 04:45 PM
  12. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    Taxes are a REALLY bad example, because taxes are often moronic. My last license registration fee was increased $2.00 from last year's, and they said it was for park maintenance. What park maintenance has to do with my vehicular actions, I do not know. I don't agree with the idea of taxing everyone for everything, regardless of use. If I don't have kids to send to school, I shouldn't be forced to pay education taxes that pay overpriced union teachers and go towards the pathetic curriculum in public schools. I shouldn't have to pay taxes to feed and house rapists and murderers, either.

    That's not the point of this thread, though. Like I said, paying for access you paid to get access to already is where it becomes silly. You don't pay for access to a movie theater to buy tickets. You don't pay for access to Netflix on PC, PS3, or mobile devices either, beyond the initial subscription cost for the Netflix service. The point here is that Microsoft is the exception to the rule here, charging for a service (access to non-gaming features) that no one else charges for. Yes, it is their right to (just as it is my right to skip paying for it), but that also does not mean that I have to agree with the system and abstain from suggesting improvement. I'm not saying that anyone DESERVES Netflix on Xbox, only that I find it silly that Microsoft decides to put the service behind a paywall that no other company does.
    08-25-2013 04:59 PM
  13. Kellzea's Avatar
    It sounds very much like your saying you deserve Netflix on xbox.

    Taxes are the price we pay for society, you wouldn't be at collage if it wasn't for the taxes other people pay. So taxes are a great example, you not liking them doesn't mean they arnt needed.

    To quote the west wing "where did people get this idea that they should only pay for the things of which they approve? many people don't like tanks, even more don't like congress"

    taxes are the price of a free society.

    But back to xbox. I say again, you pay for the live services, all of them, in one package. It is NOT, not, i repeat not a second payment for Netflix. Its a suit of services, its not pay as you go or pick and mix.

    What if i don't want a hdmi cable with my xbox, i already have one, why should i have to pay for another one. My console should be slightly cheaper.

    I don't like mcdonalds frys, but i love the burgers and drinks, so i want a large burger and large drink, buy only want small fries. Why should i pay full price for a large meal.

    When i park at my local shopping complex i have to pay the same as everyone else, but i only go in one shop. I shouldn't have to pay as much as the people who use all the shops.

    I pay for Netflix subscription, but my isp charges me to go online to use it, its like paying to go in and pay..........
    08-25-2013 05:38 PM
  14. VAUROS's Avatar
    I'm definitely getting an Xbox One. I've recently switched over from Android/Google to a pure Microsoft ecosystem with Windows 8 and Windows Phone 8. I am looking forward to the promise of Windows 8 integration with Xbox One and especially integration between Xbox One and WP8. I really think MS needs to offer some really robust integration between the gaming and mobile platforms in order to create a stronger selling point for WP8. If they can offer things that you can only get on WP8 in regards to Xbox One integration, a lot people might actually switch to WP8 because of Xbox One.
    michfan likes this.
    08-25-2013 05:49 PM
  15. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    It sounds very much like your saying you deserve Netflix on xbox.

    Taxes are the price we pay for society, you wouldn't be at collage if it wasn't for the taxes other people pay. So taxes are a great example, you not liking them doesn't mean they arnt needed.

    To quote the west wing "where did people get this idea that they should only pay for the things of which they approve? many people don't like tanks, even more don't like congress"

    taxes are the price of a free society.

    But back to xbox. I say again, you pay for the live services, all of them, in one package. It is NOT, not, i repeat not a second payment for Netflix. Its a suit of services, its not pay as you go or pick and mix.

    What if i don't want a hdmi cable with my xbox, i already have one, why should i have to pay for another one. My console should be slightly cheaper.

    I don't like mcdonalds frys, but i love the burgers and drinks, so i want a large burger and large drink, buy only want small fries. Why should i pay full price for a large meal.

    When i park at my local shopping complex i have to pay the same as everyone else, but i only go in one shop. I shouldn't have to pay as much as the people who use all the shops.

    I pay for Netflix subscription, but my isp charges me to go online to use it, its like paying to go in and pay..........
    The thing is, taxes AREN'T needed. Well, they shouldn't be. Society's gotten to a point where people are so lazy and dependent upon them (not to mention the bloating of government related to that matter) that getting rid of them is tough.

    And again, Microsoft is the ONLY service provider who acts in this manner. No one is asking for Netflix for free (in fact, I don't have Netflix at all), it just sucks that after paying for the TV (to view the content), the console (to receive the content), the Internet (to transfer the content), and the Netflix subscription (to provide the content), you are then asked to pay for Xbox LIVE as well, which doesn't have the greatest hand in this matter.

    Again, it's not so much that we are expected to pay for the services, it's that Microsoft is charging more than the competition for the SAME service. Could you imagine if all PCs started requiring a browser fee each year?
    08-25-2013 08:43 PM
  16. Kellzea's Avatar
    All pcs require an isp subscription to access the internet, they also require the purchase of an os to use the system. Not to mention the system in the First place.

    All things are "behind a pay wall" its just that people don't like this one. And that's fair enough, everyone is entitled to their opinion, but if you don't like it, don't pay it. That is your free choice.

    I imagine the % of people who have an xbox and a Netflix sub, but will never ever ever play online games, use the browser, play xbla games or get dlc, use Skype and or voip over gold is ridiculously small. And that's what annoys me, most people who are complaining buy gold for the online functions anyway. So they are complaining because its something to complain about, and that's just dumb. Its a suite of services, i wish people would stop acting like its a double sub.

    Back to taxes, there has never been a civilized society that did not have a system of taxation. Certain taxes are dumb, that's undeniable, carbon taxes, green taxes, fat taxes, pence per unit taxes, fuel duty and inheritance tax to name a few.

    But a few bad taxes doesn't make the idea of a tax bad, it makes the law maker who made THAT tax, a moron, and the house that voted it through, also morons.

    Taxes pay for roads and the police. Without roads you have no infrastructure, no business, no movement, no modern world. Without police you have no law, and consequently no freedom. (as people will simply take it from you unless you kill them).

    A tax system is the very corner stone of civilization, its necessary. However unfortunate. It just is. There is no other way.

    (even barter systems have taxes, the person that oversees the trades to make sure they are fair, and sets the trade ratios of certain commodities, would take a small cut for his part in securing the deal)
    08-26-2013 05:59 AM
  17. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    This is not the same. This is taking the console, which has all of those costs (for the hardware, software, and Internet access), and adding ANOTHER fee on top of it.
    08-26-2013 10:13 AM
  18. newavengers12's Avatar
    I am getting the Xbox ONE... And already have bought (payed in full) for COD Ghosts, Battlefield 4, Dead Rising 3, Forza 5 and Ryse. I think I'll have a great DAY ONE!
    08-26-2013 02:21 PM
  19. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    Man, you're definitely in on it. I can't bring myself to focus on 5 games at once, so I tend to let them drop in price or come out used. Part of why I am waiting (beyond the price of the console) is that I have SO MANY games left to play on 360 that I don't need to touch any One games for some time.
    08-26-2013 03:49 PM
  20. Kellzea's Avatar
    Man, you're definitely in on it. I can't bring myself to focus on 5 games at once, so I tend to let them drop in price or come out used. Part of why I am waiting (beyond the price of the console) is that I have SO MANY games left to play on 360 that I don't need to touch any One games for some time.
    yeah im the same, im still going through fallout new Vegas. Rise son of Rome does make me wee a little though.
    08-26-2013 04:35 PM
  21. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    yeah im the same, im still going through fallout new Vegas. Rise son of Rome does make me wee a little though.
    I haven't touched New Vegas yet myself. I've got the Game of the Year edition of Fallout 3, and I haven't even played the DLC from it yet (I beat the regular campaign long ago, before I bought this version). I'm only a third or so of the way through BioShock 2 as well (the game is SO SLOW that it bores me), and I have Assassin's Creed: Brotherhood and Revelations to beat before I even consider getting III. Then I have barely scratched the surface of Forza 4, and I have plenty to do in multiple NBA 2K and MLB 2K games (as far as career modes and Achievements are concerned). I REALLY have a lot of games to work on, hah.
    08-26-2013 04:59 PM
  22. martinmc78's Avatar
    I haven't touched New Vegas yet myself. I've got the Game of the Year edition of Fallout 3, and I haven't even played the DLC from it yet (I beat the regular campaign long ago, before I bought this version). I'm only a third or so of the way through BioShock 2 as well (the game is SO SLOW that it bores me), and I have Assassin's Creed: Brotherhood and Revelations to beat before I even consider getting III. Then I have barely scratched the surface of Forza 4, and I have plenty to do in multiple NBA 2K and MLB 2K games (as far as career modes and Achievements are concerned). I REALLY have a lot of games to work on, hah.
    That is indeed a lot of gameplay to get through - you'll be getting an Xbox One sometime in 2016
    08-27-2013 02:08 AM
  23. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    That is indeed a lot of gameplay to get through - you'll be getting an Xbox One sometime in 2016
    Ehh, it just depends on my level of commitment to finishing those games, vs. finishing guns in Black Ops II. I could probably knock out BioShock 2 in a day, but the game just struggles to hold my interest. I only have on-campus class 2 days a week, so I don't have much to commit my person to at the moment.
    08-27-2013 05:09 AM
  24. psudotechzealot's Avatar
    So Keith Wallace, are you getting a Xboxone or not?
    08-27-2013 06:15 AM
  25. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    Probably, just not for a bit. I've got a LOT of games to play on the 360 as it is, and I haven't been working because of school (which I am hoping to resolve this semester), so I couldn't pay for one at launch. That'd mean I'll probably get one next summer or something, since that would coincide with my college graduation and my birthday.
    08-27-2013 11:28 AM
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