06-14-2013 04:40 AM
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  1. Reflexx's Avatar
    I was going to comment about this but, I decided I didn't want another infraction..... :)



    Really ? So, on release, Sony sells 4 million PS4s, and Microsoft only sells 1.2million X1s. Think about it. Who will get that next exclusive ? Oh, wait, they are releasing it for the PS4, not the X1...Oh, no !!! This publisher that did games for the 360 is going exclusuve to the PS4. So that is very important to all gamers... Like it or not.

    Personally, I would not care too much as I will have them both at one point. A lot of peole would care.
    I don't think it's that simple.

    We do know that both Sony and MS are willing to PAY publishers for exclusives. It may not be enough to offset a huge difference in sales for top franchises though.

    But a smaller amount of consoles sold doesn't necessarily translate to less money for the game publishers. This is especially true since the publishers will be getting a cut from used game sales with the ONE.

    To take your numbers (which I think are way off from what it will be in actuality)

    If Sony sells 4 million consoles, the dev will be depending on the sales that happen in the first month or two. They'll hope that a large portion of those 4 million will want to buy the game NEW. (which is a gamble considering the reason many people are praising the PS4 is because they want to buy USED game discs that they can also lend to their friends)

    If the XBOX ONE has 1.2 million consoles out there, the devs will be looking at a more long-term strategy. How many initial full price sales will they get in the first 2 months? Then over the next year or so, how much will they make from used game sales?
    06-13-2013 02:21 PM
  2. tk-093's Avatar
    Has Microsoft actually said anything like this ? Where you can verify via the Smartglass app ? This is a good workaround, does not solve my major issue with it but, it could solve a lot of people's temp issues. Tethering is not a option as I wont be willing to pay an extra $20-30 a month to Verizon to enable it on my phone and I am sure a lot of others feel the same.
    No, they have not said anything like that. I'd like to take credit for it, but I'm pretty sure I got the idea from somebody else.


    It seems like a heck of a way to get it done though, doesn't it? If they don't fracking do that I guess I'm going to get a job there and get it done... It's seems like a simple solution. And if a device can connect via WiFi Direct, you even can take the bar code crap out of the picture. (I admit I don't know much about WiFi direct however)
    DavidinCT likes this.
    06-13-2013 02:28 PM
  3. Marty Larsson's Avatar
    Theirs a lot of people saying that the restrictions etc don't matter, so if Xbox One was released at a cheaper price & without the 24hr internet check in etc, i think for sure Xbox One wee would be hearing nothing but good news about it and how better it is than the ps4. Clearly Microsoft have done this for a reason knowing their was going to be some kind of backlash due to the DRM etc i think their is more than meets the eye Ill reserve my judgement on the xbox one when its released but for now im thinking of jumping ship for the first time to ps4 :|
    06-13-2013 02:33 PM
  4. spaulagain's Avatar
    Theirs a lot of people saying that the restrictions etc don't matter, so if Xbox One was released at a cheaper price & without the 24hr internet check in etc, i think for sure Xbox One wee would be hearing nothing but good news about it and how better it is than the ps4. Clearly Microsoft have done this for a reason knowing their was going to be some kind of backlash due to the DRM etc i think their is more than meets the eye Ill reserve my judgement on the xbox one when its released but for now im thinking of jumping ship for the first time to ps4 :|
    I think the every 24 hour online check is what's getting everyone angry about it.
    Marty Larsson likes this.
    06-13-2013 02:46 PM
  5. DavidinCT's Avatar
    Ok, I might have to process it more since my brian is on shutdown this week, but what you said makes sense.

    It does just address one type of scenario. It would not help anybody who just bought the new Halo game, gets home and finds out their internet is down, or the situation you mentioned above about people not having Internet at all. So that might be a workaround for somebody with it already installed, but then they need to come up with a workaround for the other options.

    I'm really hoping they will use SmartGlass to be that 24 hour check-in option if needed.

    p.s. I am enjoying this discussion.
    Yea it does not solve the New game and No internet so cant use it but, right now, you can't now anyway. My thought to allow that option will allow that one kid who knows this is how it works, to run to a friends with internet to install it, then he can play his game with out worrying about needing a perm internet connection. Same with people with crappy internet. All they would need is a internet connection when they install the game. If my internet goes out, I can play the games that I own (already installed) and have the disc without preying my internet comes back in 24 or 48 hours.

    Giving my case to, Physcial disk should rule...

    Yea, I am enjoying this chat too but, If Microsoft was actually listening and would even think about adding these thoughts, MAYBE everyone could be happy and make a better system in the long run, it would be much better. :)

    No, they have not said anything like that. I'd like to take credit for it, but I'm pretty sure I got the idea from somebody else.


    It seems like a heck of a way to get it done though, doesn't it? If they don't fracking do that I guess I'm going to get a job there and get it done... It's seems like a simple solution. And if a device can connect via WiFi Direct, you even can take the bar code crap out of the picture. (I admit I don't know much about WiFi direct however)
    This would almost solve (for most people) my other thought, as that temp internet connection to verify the game for install. This would be a great way to get it done, no question. As long as we dont need to tether to do it...
    06-13-2013 02:49 PM
  6. NaNoo123's Avatar
    If the XBOX ONE has 1.2 million consoles out there, the devs will be looking at a more long-term strategy. How many initial full price sales will they get in the first 2 months? Then over the next year or so, how much will they make from used game sales?
    although i agree with your reasoning, i see that as being the case short term.

    As the more people who has the console means more of their friends will buy into it also. So the gap could grow.

    And i think middle to long term its going to be about digital not disk, so the amount of actual consoles sold becomes even more important.
    Both Sony and ms is counting on that in my view.
    DavidinCT likes this.
    06-13-2013 02:58 PM
  7. tk-093's Avatar
    This would almost solve (for most people) my other thought, as that temp internet connection to verify the game for install. This would be a great way to get it done, no question. As long as we dont need to tether to do it...
    Yeah, I mean for us just sitting here arm chair QB'ing it, it seems like a no brainer. Tethering should not need to be required because you could either (1) Go the barcode on the screen route and have SmartGlass transmit the info.. or (2) have the XB1 connect to the smartphone via WiFi direct.

    The XB1 wouldn't need to go "online", just give some info to the smartphone, and have the smartphone go online, then send back the info back to the device.

    I'm actually starting to get myself worked up a bit and if they don't do this, I'm gonna be grumpy. If the only option is to simply connect to your home broadband, or have to pay for tethering to your smartphone, then I will consider that a failure. Don't get me wrong. I'm still going to get the XB1 simply because in my mid 30's I've got A,B, X, Y burned into my brain and there is no way I could adjust to a PS4 controller. HAHA.

    I have to get some work done, so I think I need to sign out for a while, so i'm not ignoring ya!
    06-13-2013 03:01 PM
  8. DavidinCT's Avatar
    I'm actually starting to get myself worked up a bit and if they don't do this, I'm gonna be grumpy. If the only option is to simply connect to your home broadband, or have to pay for tethering to your smartphone, then I will consider that a failure. Don't get me wrong. I'm still going to get the XB1 simply because in my mid 30's I've got A,B, X, Y burned into my brain and there is no way I could adjust to a PS4 controller. HAHA.

    I have to get some work done, so I think I need to sign out for a while, so i'm not ignoring ya!
    Agreed. I hope they give something here. They need to do something to make gamers happy, I know nothing they can do will really make everyone happy (with all the limits this DRM is putting on users) but, this would be a nice work-around for people. Allowing a game that was already installed to be played if internet is lose as long as the orginal disc is in the drive would be a very acceptable workaround for this problem and even verfiying it via Smartglass would almost solve the problem for a ton of people (not everyone but, it would be a nice step)

    I have a PS3 and playing "The Last of US" now (awsome game, If Naughty Dog came to X1, I would not get a PS4) on the PS3 so getting a PS4 is not a big deal to me. As I have both now, I will have both PS4 and X1 at some point. I do use my 360 a lot more than my PS3 tho...

    No worries, I will be off line for a while too...
    06-13-2013 03:12 PM
  9. anon(6038817)'s Avatar
    Actually, I might wait until after the Xbox One hits the shelves and if the price of the 360 comes down far enough, I might just pick one up.
    06-13-2013 03:48 PM
  10. nunyazz's Avatar
    Comparisons with electricity are stupid, if the power goes out nothing is working. If you lose internet for a long period for any reason then hardware which is fully capable of functioning, doesn't.
    I can't remember the last time that my internet was down, especially for an extended period of time.
    06-13-2013 03:50 PM
  11. Reflexx's Avatar
    although i agree with your reasoning, i see that as being the case short term.

    As the more people who has the console means more of their friends will buy into it also. So the gap could grow.

    And i think middle to long term its going to be about digital not disk, so the amount of actual consoles sold becomes even more important.
    Both Sony and ms is counting on that in my view.
    And if things move even more and more to digital, what's to stop XBOX ONE market share from increasing?

    I think one of its strengths is that it's aimed at a more casual audience. Some people may not feel comfortable spending $399 on a dedicated video game console. But those same people might be okay spending $499 for a Video Game Console + a multimedia hub + futuristing media controls.

    I can see Sony winning over many of the younger gamers. But the average "gamer" is in his mid-thirties right now. Most people like stuff like fantasy football and fantasy basketball, while the E3 crowd, "gamers", and video game bloggers hate that kind of stuff.
    curseoftheninja likes this.
    06-13-2013 05:07 PM
  12. Reflexx's Avatar
    Agreed. I hope they give something here. They need to do something to make gamers happy, I know nothing they can do will really make everyone happy (with all the limits this DRM is putting on users) but, this would be a nice work-around for people. Allowing a game that was already installed to be played if internet is lose as long as the orginal disc is in the drive would be a very acceptable workaround for this problem and even verfiying it via Smartglass would almost solve the problem for a ton of people (not everyone but, it would be a nice step)

    I have a PS3 and playing "The Last of US" now (awsome game, If Naughty Dog came to X1, I would not get a PS4) on the PS3 so getting a PS4 is not a big deal to me. As I have both now, I will have both PS4 and X1 at some point. I do use my 360 a lot more than my PS3 tho...

    No worries, I will be off line for a while too...

    Naughty Dog makes some awesome games. I look forward to see the next gen iterations of Uncharted and The Last of Us.
    DavidinCT likes this.
    06-13-2013 05:08 PM
  13. Etios's Avatar
    I was interested in getting Xbox-one even with the 24hr check-in BUT they are releasing it in Asia in Late 2014. So, Sony PS4 will be my only option.
    06-13-2013 05:56 PM
  14. DavidinCT's Avatar
    Naughty Dog makes some awesome games. I look forward to see the next gen iterations of Uncharted and The Last of Us.
    Wow, you said something that I totally agree with you on !

    Yea, wish they would come over to the dark side....We have cookies ! :)

    All kidding aside, the Uncharted series is one of my all time favs. One of the best series of games I have ever played (all 4 of them, yea, I picked up the Vita to play it). Worth owning a PS3 just for that series alone.

    If they release a Uncharted 4 for the PS4...I will go out and grab a PS4 that day if I don't already have one by that point...just for that game..

    and the Last of US is pretty epic so far but, only an hour or 2 into it...
    06-13-2013 06:16 PM
  15. Bicpug's Avatar
    I'll be interested to see how they handle an online device coming to the end of its lifespan, such as the x360 as MS start reducing support for the games. They can't just turn off all the supporting servers and tell people none of the games relying on online DRM/servers will work anymore. The obvious thing is to release a new dashboard that allows such games to function as stand alone but we'll see.
    06-13-2013 06:20 PM
  16. ncxcstud's Avatar
    I think it's been said, somewhere at least, that Microsoft plans to support the 360 for at least another 3 years...
    06-13-2013 06:25 PM
  17. NaNoo123's Avatar
    And if things move even more and more to digital, what's to stop XBOX ONE market share from increasing?

    I think one of its strengths is that it's aimed at a more casual audience. Some people may not feel comfortable spending $399 on a dedicated video game console. But those same people might be okay spending $499 for a Video Game Console + a multimedia hub + futuristing media controls.

    I can see Sony winning over many of the younger gamers. But the average "gamer" is in his mid-thirties right now. Most people like stuff like fantasy football and fantasy basketball, while the E3 crowd, "gamers", and video game bloggers hate that kind of stuff.
    I'm pretty sure ps4 will also have media capabilities. I believe ps3 has the highest Netflix user base in usa.

    Anyway i was commenting on what difference install base makes.
    Short term smaller user base may not necessarily mean less money going to publishers due to reasons given, middle to long term i think it would.

    I personally think for the price that consoles initially come out for its the gamers that drive those sales.
    PS3 was bit different at the time, blu ray players weren't much cheaper etc

    Xbox1 is compelling no doubting that from me, especially as an all round package.
    06-13-2013 06:45 PM
  18. curseoftheninja's Avatar
    I can see Sony winning over many of the younger gamers. But the average "gamer" is in his mid-thirties right now. Most people like stuff like fantasy football and fantasy basketball, while the E3 crowd, "gamers", and video game bloggers hate that kind of stuff.
    This is my thought exactly. I love games, but being married, 27, and in graduate school I don't have the time I once did. A system that plays games (when I have the time) but ALSO does multimedia is what I want. I think Microsoft is taking advantage of a great opportunity.
    06-13-2013 06:54 PM
  19. NaNoo123's Avatar
    Ms could drop xbox like hot cakes, but 360 and xbox1 is different, whether it be dashboard update or a little wp8 running just doing authentication on the cloud.
    I've seen people worried about not being able to play their xbox1 games in the future (15 years etc), i just don't see that happening, some one would hack it if it ever got that bad. Lol
    06-13-2013 06:56 PM
  20. NaNoo123's Avatar
    This is my thought exactly. I love games, but being married, 27, and in graduate school I don't have the time I once did. A system that plays games (when I have the time) but ALSO does multimedia is what I want. I think Microsoft is taking advantage of a great opportunity.
    i also think ps4 will do media just not as flashy maybe.
    Most of the people at e3 didn't look like teenagers to me lol
    Personally i actually like what ms is doing over all.
    To me their pushing consoles further, regardless of specs.

    Ps4 is more of the same, just better
    Xbox 1 what people was watching in films about the future just last week lol
    06-13-2013 07:06 PM
  21. oldpueblo's Avatar
    I have absolutely 0 plans to buy any physical media this time around depending on everything being available and how the process works in the end. I am so looking forward to that with three kids and three Xbox's in the house. No more broken/scratched discs or

    "Where's my game it's not in the drive?!"
    "It's upstairs Dad"
    "Damnit I just sat down and got comfortable!"
    06-13-2013 07:38 PM
  22. theeboredone's Avatar
    Wow, you said something that I totally agree with you on !

    Yea, wish they would come over to the dark side....We have cookies ! :)

    All kidding aside, the Uncharted series is one of my all time favs. One of the best series of games I have ever played (all 4 of them, yea, I picked up the Vita to play it). Worth owning a PS3 just for that series alone.

    If they release a Uncharted 4 for the PS4...I will go out and grab a PS4 that day if I don't already have one by that point...just for that game..

    and the Last of US is pretty epic so far but, only an hour or 2 into it...
    Doesn't that game come out on Friday? Can't wait to get my hands on it >_>. We should play MP when the time comes.
    06-13-2013 07:47 PM
  23. Reflexx's Avatar
    i also think ps4 will do media just not as flashy maybe.
    Just like the Wii can do games. Just less flashy.

    Most of the people at e3 didn't look like teenagers to me lol
    They're not exactly typical people. Most of them were game journalists or bloggers. Not really the ESPN type.

    Personally i actually like what ms is doing over all.
    To me their pushing consoles further, regardless of specs.

    Ps4 is more of the same, just better
    Xbox 1 what people was watching in films about the future just last week lol
    06-13-2013 08:43 PM
  24. NaNoo123's Avatar
    Just like the Wii can do games. Just less flashy.
    Yes, what's your point? And it also sold very well.

    And lots of people will be happy not to change the channel with voice and gestures.

    apart from live tv, do we actually know what the ps4 will and will not do with media, what its interface will be like also? I wouldn't be surprised if it was more than adequate for most people.

    Reminds me when people was making out xbox1 wouldn't play games, just because it hadn't been shown yet.

    Most people get their information from the media, the same people that are at e3
    06-13-2013 09:35 PM
  25. TonyDedrick's Avatar
    I honestly have no idea what you are referencing. They have not lied about anything. They have always been direct. If you only look at the official announcement Microsoft made, they have never lied about anything.

    The problems happened when you and all the other people take the official information Microsoft was giving us and kept adding and mixing in information that you got from news outlets and the media.

    The people that never read a news article about Xbox One, the people that didn't go digging through the internet to find information that was guaranteed to be incorrect and tampered, the people that only heard what Microsoft told them and no one else; Those are the people that still support Xbox One and aren't complaining about it.

    All these news articles that featured quotes from private interviews after May 21st sharing new information that was not revealed at the event, they are the ones to blame for your disappoint. They give you the information that generates interest and nothing else.
    Maybe implying MS wasn't being honest wasn't the correct way to get my point across.

    But there has been a huge issue with being direct and transparent in answering questions.

    And please don't attribute things to me that did not happen. Nowhere did I take things from inaccurate media reports and twist them as the truth. Any post I've made has been based on MS not being completely clear on their language on the Xbox One and nothing more. Even some folks who have pledged their first born children to the console have admitted that alot of the language is vague and that hopefully, MS offers more explanations.
    06-13-2013 11:40 PM
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