06-24-2013 08:58 PM
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  1. travis_valkyrie's Avatar
    That's how your technologically-incompetent aunt ends up buying a laptop, taking it back, buying another, being unable to take it back, buying a third laptop, and putting the second on eBay.
    Why would you buy something that you don't like in the first place, or not confident because it may not support your needs. People could ask for help, but that's different from telling people to not buy this or that because of your opinion
    Last edited by HeyCori; 06-21-2013 at 09:00 PM. Reason: edited for language
    06-21-2013 08:28 PM
  2. HeyCori's Avatar
    It's not about having internet, it's about getting internet to the XBone. Like I explained earlier, my old roommate keeps his systems in his basement. No jack for his internet there. Modem and router are elsewhere. WiFi does not reach his set up. Active military personnel. People who go on trips. No matter how you slice and dice it, supporting the old model shuts these people out completely. The new model gives everyone the same capabilities as the 360/PS4, the old model gives some people no capabilities. Which do you think is better?

    Honestly, it doesn't sound like anyone's excited to share games with a family plan anyways. Seems like everyone is really excited to freeload off of other people's libraries. Seems kind of selfish.
    Ask your friend to look into a wifi extender (also called a wifi repeater). Aside from the device itself there's no additional cost and he should be able to cover any dead spots in his home.
    06-21-2013 08:58 PM
  3. ItnStln's Avatar
    So basically we're back to square one, only the ones whining now are the ones who liked the DRM. Funny how things turn out sometimes...
    Does anyone actually like DRM?
    06-21-2013 09:24 PM
  4. sinime's Avatar
    Does anyone actually like DRM?
    I don't like DRM, but there are so many pirates that it is a necessary evil. That said, I was fine with the DRM MS was planning to use because I wanted to buy the discs, but still play the games discless.
    06-21-2013 09:41 PM
  5. AngryNil's Avatar
    People REALLY need to use a dictionary before they type things. Do you get what "entitled," means?
    Yes. Do you?

    It's not Microsoft's job to serve people with a lack of reading comprehension and fear of change a console they want. Microsoft doesn't owe those people anything, but they felt entitled to that and hence worked to destroy the XB1's reputation, even to the stage where FUD was being spread on US national television – to applause. A 24 hour check does not constitute online play.

    least latency I could get connected to a server in the US is 250ms, at about 3 in the morning.
    And this is a concern for a daily check why?
    06-21-2013 09:53 PM
  6. rocking23nf's Avatar
    I will refute your post with several points that apply to me.

    I play in 2 places, home, and my cabin, I have no internet or cell phone access at my cabin, its in a weird valley, so I cannot play under the old rules at my cabin anymore.

    second, with a cloud based drm, I cannot rent games from the library anymore, my library has around 20 copies of pretty much every xbox game. I have rented probably 50 games in the last year, I would bet 30 of those games were turds or less then 10 hours playtime. Without renting, I have to rely on reviews that tend to be skewed towards certain publishers. Or I take the change and spend 60$ on a game to hope it doesn't suck, and although people think a cloud based system will drop prices like steam does, Microsoft will never do it, at best they will sell for 10-15% off, which is still a rip off.
    06-21-2013 10:18 PM
  7. Daniel Ratcliffe's Avatar
    We're cleaning up this thread. Please stop the personal attacks.
    06-21-2013 10:58 PM
  8. NaNoo123's Avatar
    Did you forget(or never knew) they talked about renting, so that wasn't ruled out, just not ready for launch.
    06-21-2013 11:00 PM
  9. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    It's not about having internet, it's about getting internet to the XBone. Like I explained earlier, my old roommate keeps his systems in his basement. No jack for his internet there. Modem and router are elsewhere. WiFi does not reach his set up. Active military personnel. People who go on trips. No matter how you slice and dice it, supporting the old model shuts these people out completely. The new model gives everyone the same capabilities as the 360/PS4, the old model gives some people no capabilities. Which do you think is better?

    Honestly, it doesn't sound like anyone's excited to share games with a family plan anyways. Seems like everyone is really excited to freeload off of other people's libraries. Seems kind of selfish.
    I agree with you on the first part. I wouldn't be negatively affected by the 24-hour check-in, but I was against having that as the only option because I knew others would be inconvenienced (to the point of being unable to purchase the console) because of it. My issues with it were 100% selfless, as they were because I wanted the console to be flexible enough for anyone to use it. I never have issues with Internet outages myself, but I thought it was a terrible idea to have no other form of license checking.

    Oh, and I'm not in that boat of "only wanting to get free games," either. I was actually thinking more of an instance where those in my group would take turns buying games, then share them with the others. For example, I might buy Forza 5 and share it with others, then my cousin might buy Madden, my brother-in-law might buy Call of Duty, and my dad might buy my little brothers LEGO Marvel Super Heroes, and we'd all share those games amongst ourselves.
    06-21-2013 11:08 PM
  10. Giddora's Avatar
    I cancelled my pre-order when they downgraded it to a PS4.
    06-21-2013 11:16 PM
  11. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    Yes. Do you?

    It's not Microsoft's job to serve people with a lack of reading comprehension and fear of change a console they want. Microsoft doesn't owe those people anything, but they felt entitled to that and hence worked to destroy the XB1's reputation, even to the stage where FUD was being spread on US national television – to applause. A 24 hour check does not constitute online play.
    So, again, telling Microsoft that because they do not offer a product that I wish to purchase, that makes me entitled? I did not say that I DESERVED anything. I did not demand a change. I said that the current system did not appeal to me. They changed their minds of their own free will. That is how economics works--a business provides a good, then adjusts its offerings depending on what consumers do and do not purchase.

    Consumer feedback is not entitlement. It's offering an opinion and attempting to suggest improvements to the manufacturer.
    06-21-2013 11:21 PM
  12. Blu3V3nom07's Avatar
    Nah see, I've been waiting years for Killer Instinct http://static.giantbomb.com/uploads/...brewulf_09.png
    My train is still a'rolling. :)
    06-21-2013 11:26 PM
  13. vovakyan's Avatar
    I cancelled my pre-order when they downgraded it to a PS4.
    Thanks. Hopefully, Microsoft will resolve this so we can purchase and enjoy it.
    06-22-2013 12:05 AM
  14. Digital Savior's Avatar
    I felt crushed when Microsoft removed the family share and the whole digital future. Was going to get a bunch of games at midnight but now I will just purchase them digitally. I'm hoping the restore the functionality later on for digital titles.
    06-22-2013 03:24 AM
  15. Coreldan's Avatar
    I cancelled my pre-order when they downgraded it to a PS4.
    Even as it is, the X1 still does a whole lot more than the PS4. X1s offgaming capabilities weren't really affected at all by this. I plan to buy most games digitally just to get the "old glory" back and enjoy what I find to be far more advanced than the PS4 :P
    06-22-2013 04:19 AM
  16. Yakkob's Avatar
    Hello everyone. This topic was so important that I decided to create an account and my first thread. I know many of you are disappointed with the new DRM, and so was I. That is why I cancelled my preorder. I think we were all caught in the squeaking wheel getting greased dilemma, and now we need to take action of our own. I hope everyone that liked the original DRM, and was compelled to preorder the XBOX ONE decided to cancel it, like I did. This is the letter I sent Microsoft. If anyone wants to see, I can provide my cancellation email. I am not a PS troll, I was a MSFT fan as the following letter shows. Help support the movement and get everyone you know to cancel. We should not be bullied by the ignorant.

    Dear Microsoft,
    As a supporter of your new ecosystem, I am deeply saddened and shocked at the changes you made to your DRM policy for the XBOX ONE.

    I am an owner of a Windows 8 Desktop, Surface RT, and the Lumia 928. As an Aerospace Engineer working for the DOD, I saw the potential in all of your new products. I was also glad that you were not folding to all of the pressure of people that want to live in the past. It is a sad day that you have decided to give in. All of the whiners and complainers that will still complain have won, and all of your true supporters were ignored. I made the decision to preorder an XBOX ONE because I saw all of the negative and false news coming out from people that did not and would not give it a chance; that was the very reason I supported you with my pocketbook. Just as with the purchase of the Surface RT. Now that this seems like the way Microsoft will be going, maybe I should sell my stock in the company. Why would you be competing with a company like Sony on its way down and out? Isn't the path innovation and the future, not the past? Look at what Apple has accomplished by creating its own path.

    This is the reason I have cancelled my preorder. I will not buy an XBOX ONE. I will most likely not buy another windows product and I will sell my shares in Microsoft. Why would anyone want to walk up to their console and change the disk when they want to change the game? Why would people not want to share their games digitally? I hope you are glad racing Sony to the bottom.

    Did you ever wonder that maybe it was people that just needed something to complain about and there was actually nothing wrong with your DRM. Yes, maybe you are selling more now because of all the hyped up publicity, but be aware that it won't last when the true believer realized what they lost. Look at all the forums of people shocked by the changes you made, which are more than the original group of whiners. I hope that your decision is augmented or reverted so I that one day I might enjoy an XBOX ONE. Thanks for your time.

    V/R,
    Vovakyan

    EDIT:
    I want everyone to understand that I loved the original concept including the following abilities: Multi-media, the new windows eco system, sharing games, buying disks and just using them to install, and all of the original DRM policies. Microsoft took a step back, and I will stop my support.
    06-22-2013 04:43 AM
  17. Yakkob's Avatar
    So let me get this straight, you're going to sell your shares and not buy another ms product because you're too lazy to get off your buttocks ti swap a dvd in the drive?? Jesus Christ, get a grip.
    I, as one of the majority am glad that ms have u-turned. Herees my reasoning. .. I'm going on holiday for 2 weeks. I wan to lend my eldest son my games whilst in away (he lives away from home - uni.. ). When we go away, we turn all electrical things off. Everything!. So now he cant borrow my games as i would gave to leave the xbox on to check in every 24 hours. What a stupid idea. All if the 'lazy' excuses for the drm.. Is exactly that.. LAZY. ... Oh no, I've got to lug my xbox one around to my mates to play games, and i have got to get up to change a dvd in the drive... Bollocks.. Really.. You should listen to yourselves.
    06-22-2013 04:51 AM
  18. stiflingcobra's Avatar
    The more i think about it the more they should have just had a compromise. If you can't go inline then request the disk. But if you buy a game digitally you should still be able to share them.
    06-22-2013 05:06 AM
  19. AngryNil's Avatar
    telling Microsoft that because they do not offer a product that I wish to purchase…
    "Consumer feedback" is not what was happening on the web. There were some perfectly reasonable stances to take against Microsoft's original system, but that's not what the bulk of the conversation was comprised of. It was fear-mongering and spreading lies in an effort to destroy a product. This is an Internet trend that really hit a pinnacle for me in this case – people filled with self-importance who take their misinformed opinions to an extreme to rip apart a person or group of people, then maintain such positions even when it comes to light that they were wrong. Be opinionated all you want – I am. But admitting and correcting your mistakes is the important part, and instead we have the masses and "Internet famous" people they follow displaying nothing but arrogance and entitlement.

    I think I'm done with this conversation though, it seems you're trying to spin my comments to feed into your rants.

    The more i think about it the more they should have just had a compromise. If you can't go inline then request the disk. But if you buy a game digitally you should still be able to share them.
    Ideal situation would have been a hybrid approach, but that wouldn't have given them the ability to say that "always online" is gone. There's been a whole lot of FUD and I'm not sure such a change would have been bold enough to combat that blitz. I think they wanted to be able to offer up a "clean slate" of sorts – we're giving you what Sony gives you, be happy.
    06-22-2013 06:36 AM
  20. Yakkob's Avatar
    This is the first time i have even wrote about the xbox one. I have had a 360 for years as have my sons and their mates. I am not alone in this reasoning and obviously i must be in a majority for ms to do such a huge u-turn. Pre-orders is what ms looked at, and what the majority were saying. There is no smoke without fire. The drm could have been a compromise. I have bought in to the total ms ecosystem but am totally let down by 'their' future. I actually think its too late now anyway, as if they can 'turn off' this feature just like that, I'm pretty sure they will be turning it back on in little stages at a later date, and for that reason (in the words of Peter Jones. - I'm OUT) .. You can take the reply as you see fit, but i answered your quibbles, and to be fair they are pretty pathetic arguments, as is everyone's who is bemoaning the u-turn.
    06-22-2013 06:46 AM
  21. martinmc78's Avatar
    This is the first time i have even wrote about the xbox one. I have had a 360 for years as have my sons and their mates. I am not alone in this reasoning and obviously i must be in a majority for ms to do such a huge u-turn. Pre-orders is what ms looked at, and what the majority were saying. There is no smoke without fire. The drm could have been a compromise. I have bought in to the total ms ecosystem but am totally let down by 'their' future. I actually think its too late now anyway, as if they can 'turn off' this feature just like that, I'm pretty sure they will be turning it back on in little stages at a later date, and for that reason (in the words of Peter Jones. - I'm OUT) .. You can take the reply as you see fit, but i answered your quibbles, and to be fair they are pretty pathetic arguments, as is everyone's who is bemoaning the u-turn.
    Bye then.
    06-22-2013 06:55 AM
  22. Yakkob's Avatar
    Bye then.
    I would just like to reiterate that i am out as far as the xboxone is concerned. Still plenty of life in the old 360 ;)
    Oh ... and.. See ya Martin.. Where you off? ;)
    06-22-2013 09:50 AM
  23. Coreldan's Avatar
    It's not all lost in this regard either. They said they are planning to implement some of the good stuff back at least for digital games in the future. It might take some time though, but I'm looking forward to see what kind of improvements are made in the long run.
    06-22-2013 10:02 AM
  24. martinmc78's Avatar
    I would just like to reiterate that i am out as far as the xboxone is concerned. Still plenty of life in the old 360 ;)
    Oh ... and.. See ya Martin.. Where you off? ;)
    Really? the way you were going on it sounded like you were dumping everything MS. In the words of Peter Jones "Im out" - Sounds pretty final to me. I'm not off anywhere, I'm omnipresent, I'm everywhere.
    Last edited by martinmc78; 06-22-2013 at 10:32 AM.
    06-22-2013 10:21 AM
  25. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    There were some perfectly reasonable stances to take against Microsoft's original system, but that's not what the bulk of the conversation was comprised of. It was fear-mongering and spreading lies in an effort to destroy a product. This is an Internet trend that really hit a pinnacle for me in this case – people filled with self-importance who take their misinformed opinions to an extreme to rip apart a person or group of people, then maintain such positions even when it comes to light that they were wrong. Be opinionated all you want – I am. But admitting and correcting your mistakes is the important part, and instead we have the masses and "Internet famous" people they follow displaying nothing but arrogance and entitlement.
    So some people were rude in their Internet posts, so that makes anyone who did not support the all-DRM system "entitled?" Demeanor doesn't speak to entitlement anyway, expectations do. Saying those who spoke out against the DRM policy are entitled for wanting to play offline is no different than talking badly about a car with bad gas mileage because you want better gas mileage. Does not liking the gas mileage on a car make you entitled? No, it doesn't. Simply having a dissenting opinion, regardless of how loudly or angrily you express that opinion, does not speak to a level of entitlement.

    Really, can you say what makes those people entitled? I've said why I think that this DOESN'T, but all you want to say is that I'm wrong, without backing it up with any explanation. I'm not even calling you wrong, just claiming that I disagree. If you have something to back the claim that people are entitled for not liking the DRM system, please present it, and I'll admit if your proof gives evidence to your claim.
    06-22-2013 12:07 PM
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