12-10-2013 11:48 PM
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  1. Coreldan's Avatar
    I'm glad you don't mind paying twice for something. You're right, not everyone would feel the same way, hell, like martinmc78 they'd be pissed. Personally I would be more than pissed. I'd be asking for their supervisor and then the manager. If I didn't get that, I'd would be taking it to the press.

    There is no reason to take a a 500 deposit to 'repair' something. I sent my laptop in for repairs. They didn't ask for a deposit or carrier fee and it was almost out of warranty.

    There is no reason at all for the way they handled the situation considering how new the console was. Regardless of where he bought the console from, MS provides the warranty.
    I'm pretty sure paying would imply you don't get the money back. I don't mind cos I would get my money back :P

    EDIT: Although, I've never had to go through a process like this, so perhaps if I would have to go through one and they fe. would hold my money for an excessive period, I might join the crowd that wouldn't agree to an agreement like this, so maybe I'm naive enough to not worry about this for now.
    12-09-2013 09:46 AM
  2. ohgood's Avatar
    the practice of not trusting the customer is normal, and acceptable.
    you won't get a new car shipped to you from Ford, if you call and say it will not start.

    there is a vetting process to prevent theft, which means the customer waits.

    the easy and noon dramatic option is to return to store, exchange or buy new(or don't), move on.
    TheIsaacG likes this.
    12-09-2013 09:47 AM
  3. martinmc78's Avatar
    So you are telling me they wouldn't do the "we send you a shipping label, you send in the console, we fix it and give you one back within how ever many business days" option? Here in the states they give you those two options.
    Yes I had the option to send it in for repair but that would take up to 3-4 weeks to get the console back to me. The way I was looking at it I was going to be 3-4 weeks without a console or 3-4 weeks without the money. Neither way is acceptable. UK law for purchases is different as I stated, going back to either the retailer or manufacturer with faulty goods should be an immediate exchange for new or full refund.
    12-09-2013 09:59 AM
  4. gsquared's Avatar
    They arent charging him for repairs. They are sending him a brand new console, so they are putting a hold on his account until they get the broken one back.

    If he sent it in for repairs it would take at least two weeks (he sends it in, they fix it, and send it back). They gave him an option of basically overnighting a brand new console and putting a hold on his account (btw never do this with debit cards only credit cards.) until they get the broken one back (just incase he is scamming them.)
    I do not see an issue with their approach. Of course, why didn't you take it back to the place of purchase? I just wrote about this earlier when dealing with CS and not getting S&^%%Y with them:

    1. They are likely not getting paid very much.
    2. They have irrate people screaming in their ear all day.

    Given those two things in combination they don't give a damm about you or your problem. Better to just be civil.
    12-09-2013 10:24 AM
  5. martinmc78's Avatar
    I do not see an issue with their approach. Of course, why didn't you take it back to the place of purchase? I just wrote about this earlier when dealing with CS and not getting S&^%%Y with them:

    1. They are likely not getting paid very much.
    2. They have irrate people screaming in their ear all day.

    Given those two things in combination they don't give a damm about you or your problem. Better to just be civil.
    Did you even read the original post? I called the original place of purchase, they told me to speak to MS support and when they didn't offer an appropriate response I went back the to original place of purchase.

    You don't see an issue with having 500 disappearing from your bank account for 3 weeks because they decide to do things in the most inefficient way possible?

    As for being civil with customer service ops that's fine as long as they actually provide you with customer service. I got customer service from Game for which I was grateful and appreciative. All I got from MS was the feeling I was on a scam and about to get scammed myself. I was expecting the reverse which is what got my back up more than anything. I wasn't screaming at the CS rep either, I was frustrated and let it show in my tone.

    Screaming at people is for drill sergeants and 13 year olds playing COD
    N_LaRUE and LMZR like this.
    12-09-2013 10:41 AM
  6. DavidinCT's Avatar
    A lot of companies do this, they put a temp hold on a credit card that is released once they recive the item. I can understand it from a business aspect because there will be fraud and there will ALWAYS be someone trying to get something for nothing.

    Still there should be a better way to do this or at least word it.

    They we not charging you, they were putting a hold on it...If you didn't return it in XXX time, it would be a charge. There is a difference.

    I dont agree with it but, this is what credit cards are for, just as a temp hold...
    12-09-2013 10:59 AM
  7. N_LaRUE's Avatar
    A lot of companies do this, they put a temp hold on a credit card that is released once they recive the item. I can understand it from a business aspect because there will be fraud and there will ALWAYS be someone trying to get something for nothing.

    Still there should be a better way to do this or at least word it.

    They we not charging you, they were putting a hold on it...If you didn't return it in XXX time, it would be a charge. There is a difference.

    I dont agree with it but, this is what credit cards are for, just as a temp hold...
    Tell you what, the next time I have to do something like this let me use your card. You don't seem to have an issue with a company holding onto whatever amount they want for whatever period of time. Sorry, but this happened to me once and I never went back to that company again as they conveniently 'forgot' to reimburse my card after the period of time they said they would hold it. Anytime I see this type of service now I refuse to deal with that company. If they're happy to take my money they can provide me service otherwise I'm not interested.

    As for other services where this is the norm then you have to deal with it. This is a product. Not a car rental. I can understand a hold on funds with that situation.

    As for the car comment, you obviously didn't read the OP, if I bought a new car I would expect it to get fixed immediately and have a temp car to use until such time it is fixed or replaced if it was defective. This is inline with the OP.

    See the problem here is, people wonder why service is going down hill is because we all take crap from companies. You're assumed a criminal until they think you're not. Sorry, not the type of company I want to deal with. If I buy a new product and register it then go through the motions of determining it's defective with said company than I want a new one if its within the new period. If this is the way MS is going then I'm going to seriously think twice about any of their products. I was considering a Surface 2, now I'm not so sure.
    12-09-2013 11:28 AM
  8. MacDaMachine's Avatar
    Either way the traditional warranty through manufacturer would be you send it in, you get a fixed one/new one within a certain amount of time. That's how every single warranty repair has ever worked for me.

    With retailers its bring it there get a new one within a certain time frame and proof of purchase.
    12-09-2013 12:52 PM
  9. Coreldan's Avatar
    Either way the traditional warranty through manufacturer would be you send it in, you get a fixed one/new one within a certain amount of time. That's how every single warranty repair has ever worked for me.

    With retailers its bring it there get a new one within a certain time frame and proof of purchase.
    I've personally probably never dealt with manufacturer directly, it's always been the retailer who has taken care of the warranty part for me.
    12-09-2013 01:21 PM
  10. DavidinCT's Avatar
    Tell you what, the next time I have to do something like this let me use your card. You don't seem to have an issue with a company holding onto whatever amount they want for whatever period of time. Sorry, but this happened to me once and I never went back to that company again as they conveniently 'forgot' to reimburse my card after the period of time they said they would hold it. Anytime I see this type of service now I refuse to deal with that company. If they're happy to take my money they can provide me service otherwise I'm not interested.
    Get over it, this is the way business runs. They gave the OP a few options.

    1. Send it in for repair and they will send back a replacement (could take 2 or so weeks in the real world)
    2. If you want an advance replacment, you need to put a deposit down.
    3. Return to the store for replacement

    Ok, on your concept, You make an item, it gets broken in shipment, It cost you $450 out of pocket, are you going to send them an replacement item with out anything securing the option of getting it back when you know there is a good percentage that you could never get the item back ? Yea, right. Personally, I wouldn't

    The OP has his option, I understand as a company standpoint, that they would requre that. Sad to say, there are a lot of people who would take avanage of this and not send the old system back and they do wreck it for the honest people. By putting this deposit down, it assures that the person would return the old one.

    I've had to do this in the past for Computer hard drives, normally the hold is less than the value of the item. And I have never seen them acutally hold it, They get a pre-auth on the card, so you might see your balance drop for a few days, then it drops off. I am not sure how MS would do it. Normally when they get the item, they release it, so if you send it out right away, you would only be short on your account for a few days.

    Yes, I can see why the OP is upset and I would be too but, still the fact of the matter on a high value item like this, I can totaly understand why they ask of this.
    12-09-2013 02:35 PM
  11. Funky Cricket's Avatar
    I understand the frustration of it not working. But the process is reasonable and completely normal. You did have the option to take it back for a full refund, or you can go through the process of getting it repaired/replaced with the processes in place. It's annoying, yes, but not anything I haven't had to do in the last 20 years.
    12-09-2013 03:42 PM
  12. bobbob1016's Avatar
    I do phone support for another company. This hold charge thing is commonplace. From their POV, they get calls ALL the time, where a customer may be lying about damage just to get another device. I can't speak for the UK, but I could see this being worse PR in the States as you *know* someone would play the race card if MSFT said:
    "Well, we have to charge you a hold sir"
    "But you didn't do a hold with my buddy!"
    "Well sir, (insert reason that would prevent trusting the customer will return it here)"
    "No, I think it's because I'm (insert race/religion/orientation here)! That's BLANKIST!"

    This policy sucks yes, but there are two sides to everything. I'd imagine there could be a better way, and this guy you spoke with worded this like an *****. I usually say something along the lines I told you, minus the race card stuff. I mean, ultimately there is no charge though. Don't know how that works with that UK law you mention though.

    I mean, they couldn't really take out an insurance policy that would cover "Well, we gave all these people XB1's and they promised they would give back their non-working ones, but those 10% of the non-working ones didn't come back..." Sucks, but some people usually ruin things for everyone.

    I guess they *could* blacklist the old XB1, but I mean, as it isn't online 24/7 anymore (I personally prefer that tbh), they could use it for offline mode, or sell it to someone who doesn't know to check. Could even use it to block a friend's XB1 if they pretend they're the other person enough.

    Sorry if this isn't how to respond to these rants, but as a customer service rep myself, I guess I'm ranting too...
    12-09-2013 03:56 PM
  13. 5150 Joker's Avatar
    I can understand the policy of placing a charge during cross shipping. They have to protect themselves from fraud. That is commonly practiced by other companies as well. So while it's a large amount, that's the price you pay for the luxury of a cross shipped item.

    Sent from my GT-I9100
    bobbob1016 likes this.
    12-09-2013 04:40 PM
  14. 5150 Joker's Avatar
    Tell you what, the next time I have to do something like this let me use your card. You don't seem to have an issue with a company holding onto whatever amount they want for whatever period of time. Sorry, but this happened to me once and I never went back to that company again as they conveniently 'forgot' to reimburse my card after the period of time they said they would hold it. Anytime I see this type of service now I refuse to deal with that company. If they're happy to take my money they can provide me service otherwise I'm not interested.

    As for other services where this is the norm then you have to deal with it. This is a product. Not a car rental. I can understand a hold on funds with that situation.

    As for the car comment, you obviously didn't read the OP, if I bought a new car I would expect it to get fixed immediately and have a temp car to use until such time it is fixed or replaced if it was defective. This is inline with the OP.

    See the problem here is, people wonder why service is going down hill is because we all take crap from companies. You're assumed a criminal until they think you're not. Sorry, not the type of company I want to deal with. If I buy a new product and register it then go through the motions of determining it's defective with said company than I want a new one if its within the new period. If this is the way MS is going then I'm going to seriously think twice about any of their products. I was considering a Surface 2, now I'm not so sure.
    This isn't a car where you take it back to the dealer so your emotionally charged analogy is incorrect. He has the option of returning it for a full refund or exchange at the store if they have any on hand (and they did). Your flawed analogy is akin to driving my brand new Toyota to their HQ and asking for a new car or loaner on the spot. Sorry but businesses have to protect themselves because there are a lot unscrupulous individuals out there. Don't like the policy? Then try going to Sony and see what they say.

    Sent from my GT-I9100
    DavidinCT and bobbob1016 like this.
    12-09-2013 04:45 PM
  15. diplomat696's Avatar
    Uhhh, it wasn't faulty? Lol...Sounds like user error to me. Testing after a Friday night **** up is never a good idea is the moral of this story.

    Sent from my RM-820_nam_att_100 using Tapatalk
    12-09-2013 04:54 PM
  16. Kellzea's Avatar
    Personally, i think shouting at and being horrible to a customer service advisor because you don't like the company policy he has to work by or get fired, makes you a bad person.
    12-09-2013 04:56 PM
  17. Great deal's Avatar
    Quite frankly they are taking the pish. Until MS get stores around the world like Apple they will be restricted. Best to deal with 3rd party suppliers like Game. I will never ever call MS CS as they have a loooong way to go.. The devices and services behemoth needs a bit more time to get it right, guess we are patient while they are transitioning and it's up to them to make it or break it. Btw I like your custom tables, you might get an order at some point when I move house :)
    12-09-2013 05:46 PM
  18. Polychrome's Avatar
    Not many people are going to have 500 sitting in their accounts to do this type of transaction, especially around xmas time. So I personally do see a big issue if this is how they are handling things.

    It's not going to look good from a customer service point of perspective. I can see it being another PR disaster in the making.
    I've heard this subject come up a lot recently, and I'm starting to think there's a misunderstanding about these replacements. The original means of doing things seems to still be available, and it was similar to how replacements were done on the 360. The "pay" version seems to just be a way to get the replacement faster, probably because of the time of year it is, and to make sure Microsoft doesn't get defrauded in the process. I think people might be making more out of this than it's worth.
    DavidinCT likes this.
    12-09-2013 05:49 PM
  19. AngryNil's Avatar
    Title is good enough to land you a job in The Verge's headline writing crew. If you want a replacement console before you send back your faulty one, you pay the deposit. If you don't want to pay, you do the usual and send back your faulty console, and they will ship a new one once they receive yours. This is industry standard practice.
    TheIsaacG likes this.
    12-09-2013 07:18 PM
  20. spaulagain's Avatar
    Title is good enough to land you a job in The Verge's headline writing crew. If you want a replacement console before you send back your faulty one, you pay the deposit. If you don't want to pay, you do the usual and send back your faulty console, and they will ship a new one once they receive yours. This is industry standard practice.
    Not really. You shouldn't have to front cash for them to send you a replacement device. Even if it's before you send it back. You can provide bank info, but you shouldn't actually be charged. It should just be like a pro-order, set up the charge, but it shouldn't hit your bank unless needed.

    Nokia repair center did this for me after the sent me a broken replacement 920.

    Microsoft can't afford to **** over customer's on a key device like this. And making the customer front 500 for a device replacement (you actually spent less on) is a **** move.
    12-09-2013 07:44 PM
  21. spaulagain's Avatar
    I've heard this subject come up a lot recently, and I'm starting to think there's a misunderstanding about these replacements. The original means of doing things seems to still be available, and it was similar to how replacements were done on the 360. The "pay" version seems to just be a way to get the replacement faster, probably because of the time of year it is, and to make sure Microsoft doesn't get defrauded in the process. I think people might be making more out of this than it's worth.
    Setting up a charge or even a % deposit charge is one thing, making the customer front a charge more than they even bought the device for is bull****. Getting it fast, yes you may need to front a little bit, but 110% the original price is not reasonable.
    12-09-2013 07:47 PM
  22. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    Both the options were incorrect and not acceptable. Whether its a console or a toaster the same rules apply here in the UK when it comes to faulty goods. If something you buy is faulty an exact working replacement or full refund are the only two options you should be given. They offered neither.
    Well, they did, didn't they? They just said they'd have to put a temporary charge on your bank account, or the free route woudl take a few weeks. They didn't offer an immediate replacement, but they did offer one free of charge.
    12-09-2013 11:48 PM
  23. psudotechzealot's Avatar
    excited-child.gif
    martinmc78 likes this.
    12-10-2013 03:02 AM
  24. N_LaRUE's Avatar
    I've read all the reply comments, not going to bother commenting. Regardless what some of you may think, I think like a consumer and unfortunately a lot of us like getting the shaft and don't seem to care.

    Here's the thing. Their rival, Sony, isn't charging or asking for a deposit for a replacement. Do you not see an issue?

    The bad press is already out on the web and gaining speed. This bad PR and as it continues to grow I'm sure we'll start to see back peddling, maybe, depends on stubborn MS wants to be. You guys just don't get it. Lots of people are happy with their consoles, great but those who have to return them get this kind of treatment it won't sit well.

    It's made me realise one thing though, I'll never buy direct from MS and I'll never buy a new release of theirs either. I'll buy at a store so I can return the thing without hassle.
    12-10-2013 04:18 AM
  25. Coreldan's Avatar
    Here's the thing. Their rival, Sony, isn't charging or asking for a deposit for a replacement. Do you not see an issue?
    Nor did they offer to get you a new console before they gotthe broken one judging from their support forum.
    bobbob1016 and Mystictrust like this.
    12-10-2013 05:17 AM
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