03-20-2015 04:32 PM
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  1. slysy's Avatar
    I'm interested in buying an MS Band but haven't really looked at the competition. I have a few questions:

    What other devices are worth looking at?
    What can the band do that the competitors can't?
    What can competitors do that the band can't?
    Does the band integrate better with WP than other devices (and in what ways?)

    Main things putting me off at the moment are:
    Not waterproof (can't use for swimming)
    Several online reviews stating it's uncomfortable

    Looks nice overall though, very tempted :)
    03-17-2015 06:44 PM
  2. TruPlaya187's Avatar
    Well I don't have one yet or any other smartband but from what I've read and maybe someone can correct me or add more information but with the latest update and apps that are coming out for it it's a well rounded smartband.

    It is the only one (I think) that can get all notifications for Windows phone. There is the Cortana integration for reminders, appointments, receiving text, reply with pre-writing messages or even use a keyboard to reply what you want and more. It has 10 sensors (heart rate monitor, UV sensor, calories counter with elevation...etc) a good battery life, full independent GPS. It is synched with HealtVault. Good pricing!

    I'm sure that there is a lot more!!!
    03-17-2015 06:56 PM
  3. Kronus24's Avatar
    I'm interested in buying an MS Band but haven't really looked at the competition. I have a few questions:

    What other devices are worth looking at?
    What can the band do that the competitors can't?
    What can competitors do that the band can't?
    Does the band integrate better with WP than other devices (and in what ways?)

    Main things putting me off at the moment are:
    Not waterproof (can't use for swimming)
    Several online reviews stating it's uncomfortable

    Looks nice overall though, very tempted :)
    Check on amazon and read the details reviews there and also on reddit they have some good reviews. And of course there are a few here too, such do a search. But if you can go to a microsoft store and see how it feels on your wrist.
    03-17-2015 11:34 PM
  4. jojoe42's Avatar
    My main concern is also the waterproofing. Like, I'm the kind that washes dishes in the sink without consciously realising I need to take off my watch... :P
    03-17-2015 11:46 PM
  5. Kronus24's Avatar
    My main concern is also the waterproofing. Like, I'm the kind that washes dishes in the sink without consciously realising I need to take off my watch... :P
    Although there is a video on youtube of the Microsoft band submerge for 20min and still working. Dish soap water will get water in places that it might normally wont go. So a few splash of water is one thing buy washing dishs in soapy water and hand submerge over time would be unadvised. But if it just regular water you should be ok going by the video.
    03-18-2015 02:24 AM
  6. Nate Silver's Avatar
    If you check out my posts, you'll find a couple where I compare and contrast several of the devices that I've tried out (and bought). To quickly summarize, none of them will do it all; but to date, the Band comes closest for me for daily use. During exercise however, I also use the Mio Fuse paired to endmondo or IPBike on my phone, as the HR is more responsive and accurate, and that has an impact on calorie count.
    03-18-2015 05:52 AM
  7. Kronus24's Avatar
    Thanks Nate. Nate do you think that if the band was taking more readings more often of you HR would it be more accurate. For example the band does 2 reading every 10min when you are sleeping, which I would assume they have the Band set to different reading interval depending on the activity. So I would assume in time they will have it dial in more once more data comes in. Just like the last update people are getting more accurate reading overall. Thanks again Nate.
    03-18-2015 10:11 AM
  8. Kronus24's Avatar
    If you check out my posts, you'll find a couple where I compare and contrast several of the devices that I've tried out (and bought). To quickly summarize, none of them will do it all; but to date, the Band comes closest for me for daily use. During exercise however, I also use the Mio Fuse paired to endmondo or IPBike on my phone, as the HR is more responsive and accurate, and that has an impact on calorie count.
    ok Nate read your other lengthy posts on your reviews. I believe I understand why the Mio Fuse has a more accurate readings in the HR readings. The green Leds are bigger and seem to be even closer to the actually skin, also the Mio Fuse doesn't do 24hr reading so it when you do a exercise it is doing more readings during the work out. So it doesn't hamper the battery life of reading thorough out the day. I do not own either device just from my research, please correct me if I am wrong.

    To fix this there is 2 things I can see the band doing to get more accurate readings. The ability to turn of 24hr Hr and to manual adjust the Hr reading times of the band. If you have both device on your arm and just did a reading at the same time would they both display the same exact HR reading? IF so, then theory the quality of the sensor for reading HR is the same and we can come to conclusion that the Mio Fuse is just doing more reading to achieve a better HR. I do find it interesting that we might be able to tailor the Band to be more accurate in the things we care about most, this would be a BIG PLUS. So we can have the band work the way we want it rather then devices work they want it to work for us.

    WHat do you think of my conclusion Nate?

    Now I need to read up on the ANT+ and if that is something this Band can add or needs a certain chip.
    Last edited by Kronus24; 03-18-2015 at 11:44 AM. Reason: updated
    03-18-2015 11:44 AM
  9. Kronus24's Avatar
    Well on the Ant+ that's a negative no windows device support it and Microsoft is not even in the ANT+ Alliance, lol Hopefully that will change once Microsoft wants to target are Hardcore Fitness guys like Nate :) Going after the low hanging fruit is always best when entering a new market.

    Update : March 17, 2009 Microsoft join the ANT+ Alliance
    Last edited by Kronus24; 03-18-2015 at 12:02 PM. Reason: update
    03-18-2015 11:50 AM
  10. campbellc's Avatar
    My suggestion is to go see the Band in person. You must try it on. I did and found it too uncomfortable and clunky for my taste. However, the feature set is awesome. I chose the Fitbit Surge which I love. Currently WP doesn't support the phone notifications on the Surge. I am confident that this feature is coming soon though. I wanted a fitness device first rather than a smart device.

    Eager for the release of the Band 2. I'm hoping the design will be improved. I want to want to buy one!
    03-18-2015 11:53 AM
  11. Nate Silver's Avatar
    ok Nate read your other lengthy posts on your reviews. I believe I understand why the Mio Fuse has a more accurate readings in the HR readings. The green Leds are bigger and seem to be even closer to the actually skin, also the Mio Fuse doesn't do 24hr reading so it when you do a exercise it is doing more readings during the work out. So it doesn't hamper the battery life of reading thorough out the day. I do not own either device just from my research, please correct me if I am wrong.

    To fix this there is 2 things I can see the band doing to get more accurate readings. The ability to turn of 24hr Hr and to manual adjust the Hr reading times of the band. If you have both device on your arm and just did a reading at the same time would they both display the same exact HR reading? IF so, then theory the quality of the sensor for reading HR is the same and we can come to conclusion that the Mio Fuse is just doing more reading to achieve a better HR. I do find it interesting that we might be able to tailor the Band to be more accurate in the things we care about most, this would be a BIG PLUS. So we can have the band work the way we want it rather then devices work they want it to work for us.

    WHat do you think of my conclusion Nate?

    Now I need to read up on the ANT+ and if that is something this Band can add or needs a certain chip.
    In think your conclusion is fairly sound. In my experience the two devices are usually pretty much in agreement, provided the HR is reasonably steady. During weight-lifting or circuit training type workouts, the Fuse is more able to respond to rapid rises and falls, so there can be a fair amount of difference in calorie burn since it takes longer for the Band to 'ramp up' and then fall back when the activity ceases. Additionally, the Fuse's larger and more powerful sensors may allow it to better hold on to HR when the arm is flexing. The other factor may be that there is a certain amount of software 'smoothing' going on to filter out possible false readings. So, it may be possible to introduce the ability to do a certain amount of 'tuning' and customization of timing of readings.

    As to ANT+, I think we're out of luck for the current version. I think that more hardware (ANT receiver and antenna) would be needed. For future versions, I think that's up to MS based on whether or not they believe there is enough interest for them to license the technology. In spite of MS belonging to the ANT+ Alliance, my understanding is that ANT is basically owned by Garmin. But MS is certainly big enough to overcome any hurdles should they choose to.
    03-18-2015 01:16 PM
  12. Kronus24's Avatar
    In think your conclusion is fairly sound. In my experience the two devices are usually pretty much in agreement, provided the HR is reasonably steady. During weight-lifting or circuit training type workouts, the Fuse is more able to respond to rapid rises and falls, so there can be a fair amount of difference in calorie burn since it takes longer for the Band to 'ramp up' and then fall back when the activity ceases. Additionally, the Fuse's larger and more powerful sensors may allow it to better hold on to HR when the arm is flexing. The other factor may be that there is a certain amount of software 'smoothing' going on to filter out possible false readings. So, it may be possible to introduce the ability to do a certain amount of 'tuning' and customization of timing of readings.

    As to ANT+, I think we're out of luck for the current version. I think that more hardware (ANT receiver and antenna) would be needed. For future versions, I think that's up to MS based on whether or not they believe there is enough interest for them to license the technology. In spite of MS belonging to the ANT+ Alliance, my understanding is that ANT is basically owned by Garmin. But MS is certainly big enough to overcome any hurdles should they choose to.
    Exactly, Nate. and because the FUSE is doing more reading its can smooth out the numbers better. That is why it would be nice for us to completely have control over the setting of how we want the band to perform for a activity. Because that would be awesome to change the base line setting to X number of readings a min, etc then what ever the default setting is. Of course, this would effect battery life but when you are doing HITT, etc we need more readings to get a better ideal what going on. I think that is the fascinating part to be able to be able to push the band to it limits.

    Totally agree on the ANT+. But I believe they are just going to focus on the average consumer on the Band. They want other companies to make the device for swimmers, bike riders(ANT+),etc and use Microsoft Health to upload there data too. So they can give better insight on all users of the Microsoft Health. Really insane to think what Microsoft Health can really do with all this data from numerous different device, what they are eating, Sleep times, etc. Not to think about the money they can make from it , just hard to grasp all the possibilities :)

    Thanks Nate, Look forward to more of your reviews.
    03-18-2015 03:35 PM
  13. DroidUser42's Avatar
    My main concern is also the waterproofing. Like, I'm the kind that washes dishes in the sink without consciously realising I need to take off my watch... :P
    That's why I bought Microsoft Complete. Normally I skip all that "extended warranty" stuff. But this would be the first non-waterproof watch I've had since I was a kid. $20 vs. $199 with a fair probability of a mistake. Easy decision.
    jojoe42 likes this.
    03-18-2015 03:55 PM
  14. DroidUser42's Avatar
    I believe I understand why the Mio Fuse has a more accurate readings in the HR readings.
    In exercise mode, the Band takes continuous readings, so that's not it.

    Simply put, the Band has difficulty taking readings when there is motion. It confuses it. I do suspect that it tries to sense things like steps and subtract that out, but it's only partly successful on that. I'm not sure what the Mio is doing differently.
    03-18-2015 04:03 PM
  15. Tim Stone's Avatar
    Campbellc, a short into in a store doesn't tell the whole story on fit and comfort. The reviewers hit that pretty hard, but frankly those of us who stayed with our purchase find them quite comfortable. Yes, its a bit different feeling at first, but mine is on 24/7 except for 90 minutes every other day when I charge it while working on the computer. I love the notifications capability. It means that 75% of the time my phone never has to come out of my pocket. The fitness data is fine. It just keeps right on working.

    I would strongly suggest people look at the forum ( community ) pages for ones they might wish to buy. That is where the story is told, and you can quickly see who supports their product ( ie. Microsoft ) vs who does not ( ie. Fitbit ).

    I've tried many, stuck with the Band, and am very pleased with the results. Also, it is now clear that this product will continue to evolve and improve, and users are being listened to, and their input is being implemented. That's not happening with a lot of the wearables out there.
    03-18-2015 11:30 PM
  16. Jazmac's Avatar
    My company recently hired a new person to work in Sharepoint and they introduced her around the office. She noticed my Fitbit and asked me what I felt about it. Then she went on to show me her MS Band. I have to say, I didn't see one in the wild until recently. After talking to her about it, I might be able to own one. Its not as bad as I thought.
    jleebiker likes this.
    03-19-2015 10:01 AM
  17. Kronus24's Avatar
    In exercise mode, the Band takes continuous readings, so that's not it.

    Simply put, the Band has difficulty taking readings when there is motion. It confuses it. I do suspect that it tries to sense things like steps and subtract that out, but it's only partly successful on that. I'm not sure what the Mio is doing differently.
    But " continuous readings" could mean a lot of things, unless you knew exactly what it is because we know for sure that the light is not staying doing reading one after anther for the whole work out.
    03-19-2015 10:44 AM
  18. Kronus24's Avatar
    My company recently hired a new person to work in Sharepoint and they introduced her around the office. She noticed my Fitbit and asked me what I felt about it. Then she went on to show me her MS Band. I have to say, I didn't see one in the wild until recently. After talking to her about it, I might be able to own one. Its not as bad as I thought.
    I step in the Microsoft store last night and I was surprise how light the band was and of course the simplistic ideal of the UI. Going to get a use one cheap just to play around with it,
    Jazmac likes this.
    03-19-2015 10:46 AM
  19. defante's Avatar
    But " continuous readings" could mean a lot of things, unless you knew exactly what it is because we know for sure that the light is not staying doing reading one after anther for the whole work out.
    How often your HR is checked has already been explained in an article. During a workout it's once a second.
    This is how often the Microsoft Band checks your heart rate | Windows Central
    Kronus24 likes this.
    03-19-2015 12:02 PM
  20. NBrookus's Avatar
    I've had the FitBit Flex and the ChargeHR. I have a very thin, bony wrist: if someone isn't going to be able to wear a wrist device for comfort reasons, it's going to be me. The Flex was uncomfortable until I got used to wearing something in my wrist. The Charge HR has a rigid portion that extended past the width of my wrist and was very uncomfortable until I turned it to the inside. I got used to it in about 3 or 4 days, but there will still weird gaps in the fit. I never could sleep well with it on. (Then in a few weeks the charging port started raising burn blisters, so back it went to FitBit, who was awesome about the return. Other people have had issues with the band material.)

    I hope the comfort level will be the same with the Band -- annoying until you get used it.

    I should get mine tonight and can come back with a better comparison between the ChargeHR and the Band, but I will say this: the FitBit Windows Phone App is really not that great yet. It sorta of works. The Live Tile doesn't update unless you open the app and they still have issues with background syncing, which they just released -- background syncing sort of works now but drains battery like crazy. It also doesn't have feature parity with their Android the iOS apps; no heart rate data, no notifications, etc.. And it won't recognize bluetooth on anything except a PHONE, not even my Surface Pro or Android tablet. For all other devices you have to use their USB Bluetooth Adapter.

    They are working on their app and making progress, but if the phone app is going to be your primary way of working with your device you may be very disappointed right now.

    That said, I suspect the FitBit web app is *way* more mature than the Microsoft Band site. I'll know more soon. You can use the FitBit web dashboard for free, even without a device, so you can check it out while you are deciding.

    No one else has a Windows Phone App right now, so your choices are:
    • FitBit ChargeHR (has heartrate, no GPS)
    • FitBit Surge (has GPS)
    • Microsoft Band


    None of those are waterproof; all have some level of resistance to splashing and sweating.
    03-19-2015 12:44 PM
  21. Witness's Avatar
    I'm interested in buying an MS Band but haven't really looked at the competition. I have a few questions:

    What other devices are worth looking at?
    What can the band do that the competitors can't?
    What can competitors do that the band can't?
    Does the band integrate better with WP than other devices (and in what ways?)

    Main things putting me off at the moment are:
    Not waterproof (can't use for swimming)
    Several online reviews stating it's uncomfortable
    I've had a FitBit, Jawbone, Band, and Pebble Steel. Forget about the FitBit and Jawbone unless all you really want it for is for fitness related features. The Band is hands down the best and it understandably integrates better on Windows Phones. How is it better? Handling text messages with reply, Cortana support, viewing your appointments, the Guided Workout is fantastic, sleep tracking and the occasional UV measuring is fantastic.

    Your off putting issues about waterproofing is correct. You can't swim with it and it would be nice if it were possible. As for comfort, I find it pretty comfortable. Wear it screen down as it was intended. Online reviewers don't seem to understand that and/or they wear it for an hour then conclude it's uncomfortable. After a day of use, I don't even notice it - I became used to it. Even when I used the Pebble for a while, I had this habit of looking at the bottom of my wrist to read, but of course the Pebble sits on top. I like it on the bottom as it is more discrete and text remains private.

    Since you're a WP user, you will probably love the Band.
    realwarder likes this.
    03-19-2015 02:23 PM
  22. realwarder's Avatar
    My suggestion is to go see the Band in person. You must try it on. I did and found it too uncomfortable and clunky for my taste. However, the feature set is awesome. I chose the Fitbit Surge which I love. Currently WP doesn't support the phone notifications on the Surge. I am confident that this feature is coming soon though. I wanted a fitness device first rather than a smart device.

    Eager for the release of the Band 2. I'm hoping the design will be improved. I want to want to buy one!
    Felt clunky to me for about 5 days too, but that's because I hadn't worn anything on my wrist for years. After that I rarely notice it. First feelings are not necessarily indicative of long term comfort.
    03-19-2015 04:23 PM
  23. DroidUser42's Avatar
    because we know for sure that the light is not staying doing reading one after anther for the whole work out.
    We do? Yes, in "normal" mode it runs 1 minute out of 10. In sleep mode it's 2 minutes out of every 10. In exercise mode I believe the lights are on continuously. And the display updates every few seconds.

    If you're saying the lights are not on full time in exercise (Run, workout, bike, etc) mode, then that's something new. I'd like to see what you find.

    If you're doing an exercise without putting the Band into an appropriate mode, then yes, there's going to be issues. But then, unless it's in some kind of exercise mode, it won't display HR continuously. You'll have to keep pushing buttons to bring up the screen.
    03-19-2015 04:36 PM
  24. Kronus24's Avatar
    How often your HR is checked has already been explained in an article. During a workout it's once a second.
    This is how often the Microsoft Band checks your heart rate | Windows Central
    Thanks for link. Miss this article.
    03-19-2015 04:44 PM
  25. teemulehtinen's Avatar
    In terms of the competition, Apple will set the baseline, whether it is relevant or not. It's the stories like in this link which will make the Apple look lightyears ahead of all competition. Even if Microsoft could come up with a way of demonstrating the value of insights gathered over the past months and before the launch for further product development, it will only be seen as a meager copycat of what has been going on in the "super-secret" Apple sports lab.

    I just wish they would publish more, tell more and explain how it all has been done, how it works and what it can do in the future.

    http://www.theverge.com/2015/3/20/82...et-fitness-lab
    NBrookus likes this.
    03-20-2015 12:15 PM
31 12

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