Has Microsoft lost faith in Windows Phone?

[DontHate707]

its funny because even google brings there features to ios i guess its truly all about the money. you dont see facetime or iphoto on any other device except ios ones i wonder why?

 

[psychotron]

Yep, its all about business. Really has nothing to do with a lack of faith. Windows Phone doesn't have enough traction yet for them to hold on to exclusive, differentiating features yet, and at the end of the day MS has to please the shareholders as much as the consumers. Speaking of which, Office is their biggest product and the top selling piece of software on the Mac, so I can see them not wanting to get leapfrogged on Apple's mobile OS either.

Sent from my Samsung Focus using Board Express

 

[N8ter]

I think the real point here, as I tried to explain to n8ter, is the WP7 versions are always going to be better than the other platform versions.

Just look at Google maps on Android vs iPhone to see what I mean. The Android version of Google maps has far better features and also provides a turn-by-turn option. Let's not get into a turn-by-turn battle here as that is not the point.

The bottom line is that software companies, like Microsoft and Google, make money off of getting people into their ecosystems. They can then use the ecosystem to sell products. App stores are new to this equation and not as all-telling as some people might think. There is no reason to believe that Microsoft will not be successful with WP7. Any real success takes perseverance. That does not seem to be an issue for MS.

I didn't misunderstand that. But there isn't any Apple products on WP7 - period, so it's a pure win for iOS, and a net loss for WP7.

It's a net win for Microsoft's other devisions, not the Windows Phone devision.

These apps being available on other platforms has absolutely nothing at all to do with Windows Phone. It's the XBox, Windows Live, and Office teams getting their products on other platforms.

So the answer to the OP's question is No. These apps should not be viewed as an indicator of Microsoft's dedication to their mobile platform. However, porting the apps over can be seen as detrimental, at least indirectly.

No one is going to buy a Windows Phone just to get a few features in a Microsoft app they installed on their iPhone. Almost every iPhone user I know has either completely or is in the process of migrating all of their stuff to iCloud at the moment, because many people prefer to just use the services that came with the phone (I'm having huge issues right now with iPhone users iMessaging me on my iTouch instead of SMS because they have my iCloud email address in their phone - obviously I don't get that when it's in the other room or I'm not on WiFi).

The only app that can be seen as a reason to switch platform is the XBox companion, and that app simply isn't good enough [at least not yet] to even induce those types of thoughts.

 

[naplesbill]

I didn't misunderstand that. But there isn't any Apple products on WP7 - period, so it's a pure win for iOS, and a net loss for WP7.

It's a net win for Microsoft's other devisions, not the Windows Phone devision.

These apps being available on other platforms has absolutely nothing at all to do with Windows Phone. It's the XBox, Windows Live, and Office teams getting their products on other platforms.

So the answer to the OP's question is No. These apps should not be viewed as an indicator of Microsoft's dedication to their mobile platform. However, porting the apps over can be seen as detrimental, at least indirectly.

No one is going to buy a Windows Phone just to get a few features in a Microsoft app they installed on their iPhone. Almost every iPhone user I know has either completely or is in the process of migrating all of their stuff to iCloud at the moment, because many people prefer to just use the services that came with the phone (I'm having huge issues right now with iPhone users iMessaging me on my iTouch instead of SMS because they have my iCloud email address in their phone - obviously I don't get that when it's in the other room or I'm not on WiFi).

The only app that can be seen as a reason to switch platform is the XBox companion, and that app simply isn't good enough [at least not yet] to even induce those types of thoughts.

Honestly, this is your typical shortsightedness. This platform is not going anywhere anytime soon. I applaud Microsoft for sticking to their guns on what this platform is and can be. This is no different than the strategy Apple took with the iPhone. The iPhone did not immediately take over the world.

Also, I swtiched back to the WP7 platform for the ZunePass feature alone. I think the Zune software is light years ahead of anyone in design and presentation. Being able to share my Zune Pass with all my PCs, XBox, and my phone is a huge deal for me. I am absolutely postiive that I am not the only person who sees this value.

Integration will be far more important than you think. That is where all the platforms are going, mark my words here. The power of social media is undeniable and WP7 is getting that right.

 

[mprice86]

The way I see it is that WP7 is just a little too ahead of its time.

At the moment all I can imagine is that MS are biding their time until they have Windows 8 out. Once the Metro UI is out in a much more mainstream market on both PCs and Tablets, I think it will make it much easier to sell Windows Phones, especially with the potential for app crossover between the two ecosystems.

I think it's a real shame though; I love WP7 and I love the software that is out already for PC that uses the Metro design, like Zune. Unfortunately you get some pretty funny looks when you tell people that the Zune software is better than iTunes.

Give it time though, Microsoft are no where near done with WP7, they're just getting started and I'm glad to be along for the ride.

 

[power5]

The only thing I dislike about Zune is that there is no now playing. After I start playing a song, if I go back to start looking for the next song I can not get back to the now playing artist and their album. **** when I push back my list does not even center on the artist playing. It centers on the letter and I have to scroll down to get to the artist. Sometimes luck would have it (at least it seems) that the artist may be at the bottom of the screen. Other times the letter is at the bottom of the screen, some times the letter is in the middle. Its just a quirk that I think they should fix. Or put a now playing pivot in. Should be easy. Make it to the left of the default artist list. Ehh, my only real gripe about the music player. I do not do playlists or anything so that may be a viable option. I really wish you could create playlists from the phone.

 

[Curtieson]

Other times the letter is at the bottom of the screen, some times the letter is in the middle. Its just a quirk that I think they should fix. Or put a now playing pivot in. Should be easy. Make it to the left of the default artist list. Ehh, my only real gripe about the music player. I do not do playlists or anything so that may be a viable option. I really wish you could create playlists from the phone.

I assume you are talking about Zune on your WP.

From the Music page (where it says Music, Videos, Podcasts...) you can flick left and be on the "HISTORY" page. If you are listening to music, click the top tile, as it should be the song you are currently playing, and it will take you into the full music player.

THAT is the Now Playing pivot basically.

OR, if you hit the volumn rocker (button) you can click the song artist/song title underneith the Play/Pause button and it will take you to the same place.

 

[Curtieson]

because I wanted to help on the Zune question, I wanted to put this to bed also.

I'm saying the sale of Office for Mac is often just as good because many Mac users run Windows as well if only for Windows-specific applications, this creates the third option:

Seriously you have lost yourself in your argument...

If you really want to keep up with the math equation... technically we would have...

Windows OS + Office = $300

or

Mac OS + Office + Windows = Mac OS + $300

The Mac OS purchase was completely independent to your need for Office and your want/need for Windows.

And yes, your other response you completely proved my point in saying you didn't buy Office twice, haha. Microsoft would MUCH RATHER sell you Office for Windows because that AUTOMATICALLY implies they have sold you Windows. The same can not be said for a sale of Office for Mac but you are trying to say it does "because many Mac users run Windows" :straight:

 

[KingCrimson]

I wonder how many of the millions of new Mac owners in the last 3-4 years(unibody Macs) have also bought a copy of Windows 7 + Office? We'll never know, but I suspect the number is big.

 

[N8ter]

Honestly, this is your typical shortsightedness. This platform is not going anywhere anytime soon. I applaud Microsoft for sticking to their guns on what this platform is and can be. This is no different than the strategy Apple took with the iPhone. The iPhone did not immediately take over the world.

Also, I swtiched back to the WP7 platform for the ZunePass feature alone. I think the Zune software is light years ahead of anyone in design and presentation. Being able to share my Zune Pass with all my PCs, XBox, and my phone is a huge deal for me. I am absolutely postiive that I am not the only person who sees this value.

Integration will be far more important than you think. That is where all the platforms are going, mark my words here. The power of social media is undeniable and WP7 is getting that right.

Why so insulting?

I've already stated that the platform is relatively stagnant at the moment.

Social Integration has been common since 2009. The HD2 had it and all Samsung and HTC Smartphones have Social Hub and whatever HTC calls theirs. That is all People Hub is. The WP7 version of that. It doesn't offer really anything above and beyond what those Android integrations offer, and they were there 1.5 years before WP7's release.

Zune Pass on XB360 isn't that great unless you're into watching music videos. It also baloons the price of Zune Pass because it requires XBL Gold (what doesn't on that system?).

The Zune Software is redundant and probably shoulnd't exist. It doens't do anything WMP cannot do (it actually does a ton less than WMP) except access the the Zune and App Marketplace. I don't know what Microsoft was thinking making a redundant piece of software when they already have a media player basically built into the OS.

 

[KingCrimson]

Why so insulting?

I've already stated that the platform is relatively stagnant at the moment.

Social Integration has been common since 2009. The HD2 had it and all Samsung and HTC Smartphones have Social Hub and whatever HTC calls theirs. That is all People Hub is. The WP7 version of that. It doesn't offer really anything above and beyond what those Android integrations offer, and they were there 1.5 years before WP7's release.

Zune Pass on XB360 isn't that great unless you're into watching music videos. It also baloons the price of Zune Pass because it requires XBL Gold (what doesn't on that system?).

The Zune Software is redundant and probably shoulnd't exist. It doens't do anything WMP cannot do (it actually does a ton less than WMP) except access the the Zune and App Marketplace. I don't know what Microsoft was thinking making a redundant piece of software when they already have a media player basically built into the OS.

Agreed, social integration was already in Android way before WP7. What WP7 brings is the Metro UI with horizontal swiping to different parts of a hub. Zune Pass and XBL with that are the only compelling reasons to get a Windows Phone. If those things are of no importance then you might as well buy an iPhone or Galaxy Nexus.

 

[InfectedPhreak]

What I don't see is even with this integration of social networks, is combined inbox's and combined messengers. I believe in iOS 5, you do have a combined email inbox and that's about it. When you have Facebook, Windows Live Messenger, and texting all linked to a contact in a thread to me that's the best. Also these contacts have their linked facebook, twitter, and linkedin. You can argue that Android already had these integrations such as HTC Friendstream and Sony Ericsson's Timescape.. but these aren't integrated in a manner that is all located in one place.

Smart phones are all about bringing the information to you, and how you view the information. When you can open People Hub and see Facebook, Twitter, LinkedIn, your contacts, and so forth... I don't see anyone else doing this. Now with Android ICS, and the new People Hub on there might bring a bit more integration the way that WP7 perceives it. But there still is no combined threading or combined inbox with ICS.

I could be completely wrong, but I just feel that People Hub on WP7 blows any other type of integration out the window as far as I can tell. As for Zune Pass and Xbox, they are big things for WP7 as well, also the Metro UI. Also have to take it from a standpoint that M$ is taking it. Microsoft doesn't necessarily have to beat the competition, just make a standpoint. I think with the Metro UI, and the differences between WP7 and iOS/Android make it apparent. Just trying to give a solid middle ground to those who don't want the overzealous approach, and those who don't want to have to root and ROM their device to make it solid.

Microsoft is a software company, they will make money any which way possible. At the end of the day, that's all that matters.

 

[N8ter]

In iOS you can look at your Inboxes by account. Back out and select that account, and you can view only that account you want.

Yes, Facebook Offline Messages is missing. That is causing particular issues IRT Facebook Chat since Facebook's official clients aggregate all of that and deliver them all to you via the Messages application with Push notifications.

You're wrong about SocialHub/FriendStream/etc. Those are integrated just as deeply as WP7's People Hub. They all literally do the same thing and solve the same purposes. The only difference is the user interface. Social Hub on my Vibrant even lets me view and reply to Facebook Offline Messages in the Contacts app. You cannot do that on WP7 without a third party application. I could already group SMS on my Vibrant, and the integrated Windows Live Messenger is analogous to Google Talk. Integrated FB chat would be useless on Android since Facebook supports that Platform and their chat client works flawlessly there.

Metro is the biggest selling point of WP7.

IRT Zune/Zune Pass. That is less of a selling point than it was months ago for a few reasons:

1. Microsoft has stopped giving out free 10 tracks to new subscribers.
2. It's locked to WP7 due to the DRM Microsoft uses. If you ever move from WP7 all your Subscription music is unusable on the other device.
3. It costs the same as any other streaming service (Spotify, Rhapsody) and XBL Gold is required on the Console.
4. Zune's Library is smaller than some third parties (like iTunes, AmazonMP3).

So, now that they've eliminated the biggest advantage they had over the competition (unless you're grandfathered in, like I am) there really isn't a reason to buy a WP7 device just for Zune Pass - unless you like using it on your XB360 as well. You can simply buy an Android/iOS device, subscribe to Spotify, and buy the tracks that you want from AmazonMP3, Google Music, or iTunes. Google Music and Amazon have a huge Advantage over Zune in that they use an Online Music Locker, so if anything happens you can always re-download the music you already bought from the service. When Zune Corrupted half an Album I had to rebuy the Album to get the Corrupted songs I had to delete. iTunes has iTunes in the Cloud, which is cheaper than XBL Gold. You can play AAC encoded media from an iPod or iPhone by simply plugging it into the USB port on your XB360, as well. ANything else you can stream from your PC over WiFi or via Media Center Connect (or from an Android phone like a Galaxy S that has "full" DLNA support - i.e. full Client and Server mode).

Biggest Points are Metro and Supposedly XBL which has turned out thus far to be nothing more than GameCenter 2.0 with only 1/5th the games. That is why Microsoft puts a lot of weight on the actual user experience, and not necessarily the function. Most of that trivial stuff (media services, social integration, etc.) are nothing new or noteworthy. It's not necessarily about what it does, but how it does it, how well, and how aesthetically pleasing it is while doing it.

 

[InfectedPhreak]

Most of that trivial stuff (media services, social integration, etc.) are nothing new or noteworthy. It's not necessarily about what it does, but how it does it, how well, and how aesthetically pleasing it is while doing it.

That's true it is about look and feel, which I personally enjoy WP7's way of doing it then any other. Social Hub on the Vibrant looks so cliche, and so does FriendStream/TimeScape... Maybe it's just me, having an HTC DInc and using FriendStream... I used Facebook/Twitter more then using FriendStream... because I just couldn't stand the look and feel. It works for some, and doesn't work for others.

Thanks for clearing everything up, N8ter.

 

[KingCrimson]

The problem I have with the Windows Phone start screen is how it's oriented towards strictly consumer operations. What about being viable for business & medical apps? A doctor doesn't want to hassle with learning how to pin an app on the start screen only to have to scroll down because of the large tiles. This is why Apple has captured mobile phones in medical.

 

[Pronk]

I wonder how many of the millions of new Mac owners in the last 3-4 years(unibody Macs) have also bought a copy of Windows 7 + Office? We'll never know, but I suspect the number is big.

Office 2011, maybe. Windows 7? I really doubt it, because there's no real need. Only if they need it for some Windows-only program that there's absolutely no equivalent for, and there really aren't many of them these days, or they're a PC gamer - and if they are, they'd be better off buying a PC anyway. I would imagine most Mac owners don't put Windows on their Macs as well. Or, they do what I do: on the very rare occasions I need Windows, I run an old copy of XP via parallels. Works fine for what I need.

The only time recently I've needed Windows 7 was when I was thinking about Chevron unlocking my WP7 phone, and I'm not paying MS for Win 7 just for a handful of homebrew apps and a limited unlock. Would be nice if Chevron labs came out with a Mac client too. But then again, it'd be nice if MS came out with a Zune client for Mac. Having make-do software on the Mac is hardly an incentive for people to try WP7 - it just seems petty. And it doesn't tie me to the system either - why would I buy music in Zune on my phone when I can buy it on iTunes and use it everywhere but vice versa is not the case?

On the topic of integration, I actually don't want everything too integrated and I suspect I'm not the only one. I have facebook chat off at all times, don't use MSN Messenger at all, and keep my messages just for SMS. I also don't tie in my LinkedIn account even though I have one, I filter my contacts to just show people I actually have phone numbers for, and still primarily use the separate Facebook and Twitter apps too. Sometimes you can be too connected and it's information overload, and to be honest if WP7 didn't let you filter and sort who you want to appear where, it'd be a deal breaker and I'd never have bought a WP7 phone. It's nice to have the option I suppose, but it's nicer still to have the option to not be always on.

 

[power5]

I filter my contacts to just show people I actually have phone numbers for, and still primarily use the separate Facebook and Twitter apps too. .

How do you filter for phone number contacts only?

 

[Pronk]

Turn off facebook and twitter contacts - then, the only ones left are the ones I have numbers for!

 

[Big Supes]

I honestly can't believe that some people think Windows Phone is stagnant. The Lumia 800 is currently selling out all over the UK. 2012 is going to be a big year for wp7. That's for sure.

Merry Christmas, peeps.

 

[power5]

Turn off facebook and twitter contacts - then, the only ones left are the ones I have numbers for!

Damn, that does not work for me. I have email addy only for some people. Still email them though as they are work contacts. It would be nice if MS could find a way to filter by number contacts only for the phone app and the people hub could still have everyone in it. I realize that steps away from their idea that everything is in one hub for people. But could also just look at it as a filter setup in the phone app. WP7 is about getting in and using the info you have to get out as fast as possible. So filtering contacts for numbers only in the phone icon would accomplish that goal. I may just need to streamline my contacts so I am only using 1 addy not 3 for my contacts to pull from.