Please support France #Je suis charlie

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AhmadSorour said:
And once again, if they really were Muslims who did that, this doesn't mean that all Muslims are like that.
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We all agree on that. It's an important point to make, but it's also important to note that nobody here has claimed that to be the case.
 
Plus the French had every right to do them comic pics. In London we had a guy called hook hand hamza and he used to preach violence in finsbury mosque and was allowed to as it was "he's human rights" and how did we take it? By doing a demo... Yet when its the other way round when the French done a cartoon with no preach of violence then its "a whole different game" and they attacked with murder. So I personally (being English living in London) support the French. And no.. I am not racist. My ex many many years ago was Muslim but her cousin was racist against me and caused me to lose my job as she was my room leader (I couldn't take it any more and left my job) and caused us to break up. Seems like if white people makes fun of culture then its racist but if I Muslim or black person attacks then its "defending their go out" or "freedom of speech" like I said I am not racist. In fact I have had more relationships with multi culture women then with white women (once again I am white) dated a mixed race woman with spina biffida in a wheel chair and now with a Moroccan woman (after being dumped my Filipino girlfriend.... I have a thing for Filipino women) but without going to much off topic on my personal life the french had a right to print them pics why? Freedom of speech and I personally support the french
 
Erractic Lumia said:
Plus the French had every right to do them comic pics. In London we had a guy called hook hand hamza and he used to preach violence in finsbury mosque and was allowed to as it was "he's human rights" and how did we take it? By doing a demo... Yet when its the other way round when the French done a cartoon with no preach of violence then its "a whole different game" and they attacked with murder. So I personally (being English living in London) support the French. And no.. I am not racist. My ex many many years ago was Muslim but her cousin was racist against me and caused me to lose my job as she was my room leader (I couldn't take it any more and left my job) and caused us to break up. Seems like if white people makes fun of culture then its racist but if I Muslim or black person attacks then its "defending their go out" or "freedom of speech" like I said I am not racist. In fact I have had more relationships with multi culture women then with white women (once again I am white) dated a mixed race woman with spina biffida in a wheel chair and now with a Moroccan woman (after being dumped my Filipino girlfriend.... I have a thing for Filipino women) but without going to much off topic on my personal life the french had a right to print them pics why? Freedom of speech and I personally support the french
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Tiny bit too much info there. Now that's how you do an "off topic" post lol
 
djeire84 said:
Just think issues such as religion, politics and war ain't really a topic we should be talking about here. Like as if what we say here is gonna make a blind bit of difference. Yes discuss it but not on sites such as this the only voice that counts is the one we use with our votes come election day. Yes its sad what happened but there are (unfortunately) worse atrocities committed every day in countries not important enough for media coverage. That's all I'm saying on the matter. Its windows central really that's all that should be discussed.
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I respectfully disagree. I think whomever the U.S. votes into office as their next president, is about as relevant to solving this particular issue as what type of bread I prefer for breakfast. This is not a political problem. It's a societal problem, rooted in counterproductive beliefs held by majorities of people in middle eastern cultures, not just the radical Islamist fringe. The only way to solve the problem is to painstakingly convince people, one by one, that some of the things they were taught in school, or picked up simply by living in their societies, may not be as wise as they initially thought. It's about hearts and minds and beliefs.

The U.S. has unfortunately squandered any capability they might have had to convince anybody in the middle east about anything. The only reason the U.S. remains at all relevant in the region is due to their influence over Israel. At this point, the only productive thing the U.S. can do is to remove themselves from the equation entirely. The people who will ultimately solve this issue are the intellectuals and spiritual leaders that live in middle eastern societies. Unfortunately, their voices are currently drowned out or censored, precisely because they live in societies where people can't cope with dissenting opinions and free speech. This issue literally sits at the centre of what is holding their entire culture back.

You may be right that my attempts to get people to rethink their views are futile (although my personal experiences suggests otherwise), but you won't stop me from trying. If all reasonable people tried to extend a hand to someone who believes differently, and embraced any opportunity to discuss our differences, I'm sure that would ultimately represent our fastest route to success. It must start somewhere, so why not at least try?
 
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Free speech is an ideal thats wonderful on paper, just as Bill of rights, freedom charter ect. Religious groups, lawyers, politicians and sports fanatics have one doctrine, namely Bush doctrine!

Osama chasing Russians on behalf of America, Iran & Iraq pounding each other America in the mix. Black hawk, America did I mention Libya or the bombings in Kenya and Tanzania back then.

Money makes the world go round!
 
Nokia5110 said:
Free speech is an ideal thats wonderful on paper
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A bit defeatist, don't you think? It's also a wonderful idea in practice, not just on paper.
The fact that U.S. foreign policy is heavily influenced by the military industrial complex, doesn't diminish the value of ideals that have proven themselves essential to the progress of humanity many times over. But ultimately, ideals are just that. It's what you strive for, knowing full well we will never achieve a perfect implementation.
If you oppose any particular doctrine, free speech will be vital in changing it, and thankfully, in the west, nobody is going to think you're asking for trouble by disagreeing with authority figures or majority opinion.
 
a5cent said:
I respectfully disagree. I think whomever the U.S. votes into office as their next president, is about as relevant to solving this particular issue as what type of bread I prefer for breakfast. This is not a political problem. It's a societal problem, rooted in counterproductive beliefs held by majorities of people in middle eastern cultures, not just the radical Islamist fringe. The only way to solve the problem is to painstakingly convince people, one by one, that some of the things they were taught in school, or picked up simply by living in their societies, may not be as wise as they initially thought. It's about hearts and minds and beliefs.

The U.S. has unfortunately squandered any capability they might have had to convince anybody in the middle east about anything. The only reason the U.S. remains at all relevant in the region is due to their influence over Israel. At this point, the only productive thing the U.S. can do is to remove themselves from the equation entirely. The people who will ultimately solve this issue are the intellectuals and spiritual leaders that live in middle eastern societies. Unfortunately, their voices are currently drowned out or censored, precisely because they live in societies that can't cope with dissenting opinions and free speech. This issue literally sits at the centre of what is holding their entire culture back.
You may be right that my attempts to get people to rethink their views are futile (although my personal experiences suggests otherwise), but you won't stop me from trying. If all reasonable people tried to extend a hand to someone who believes differently, and embraced any opportunity to discuss our differences, I'm sure that would ultimately represent our fastest route to success. It has to start somewhere, so why not at least try?
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Sorry like I do disagree wholly with that. On 9/11 it was allegedly"Al Qaeda" who were responsible and they were based in Afghanistan. The US spent 6 months bombing and shelling looking for Osama bin Laden the alleged ring leader, then for no apparent reason invaded Iraq a country that wasn't involved in the New York attacks and captured Sadam Hussein a man who kept so called Islamic extremists in their place and (yes it was unorthodox) ruled with an Iron fist. Then occupied that for almost a decade **** Chaney's Haliburton setting up shop there and draining Iraq of its oil. Then the US executed Sadam on war crimes (yes he did it to his own people but never posed a threat to USA or her territories) and then the very breed of extremists he had kept under iron rule were free to roam and do as they saw fit.
 
So in short yes voting in fair and just leaders makes a world of difference.
Voting in people who want to invade and destroy nations (on the fake promise of "change") makes the difference.
The very minute corner if a very peaceful and just religion of Islam are just fighting back in the same way a minute corner of the west did for oil and prosperity. That's what happens when one country invades another and that another country fights back.
 
I do not hear the voice of Windows central????
The world is coming together tomorrow in Paris to unanimously stand against those atrocities, where is windows central?
Je suis Charlie
 
djeire84 said:
So in short yes voting in fair and just leaders makes a world of difference.
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I don't want to get into U.S. politics here, as that's a whole other can of worms. I understand your point, and agree with you in general. I really do. It's just that as far as this particular issue is concerned, I don't think any U.S. president is in a position to offer anything that could possibly contribute to an actual solution. The very best a U.S. president can do is to get out of the way and not make things even worse. I guess that was my point, which I could have stated better. But you are right, even that is apparently asking too much of some presidents.
 
a5cent said:
I don't want to get into U.S. politics here, as that's a whole other can of worms. I understand your point, and agree with you in general. I really do. It's just that as far as this particular issue is concerned, I don't think any U.S. president is in a position to offer anything that could possibly contribute to an actual solution. The very best a U.S. president can do is to get out of the way and not make things even worse. I guess that was my point, which I could have stated better. But you are right, even that is apparently asking too much of some presidents.
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Sure Barack Obama was walking into a huge messy situation. Bush created the mess and Obama bless him he tried to untangle the huge clusterfcuk that was in front of him. But is failing. Reminds me of matters here at home in Ireland, the last government got us into bad austerity and made our recession worse and the current government tried to undo the damage and is failing and making things a whole lot worse. Ha ha that's why a few posts back I said religion and politics shouldn't be discussed here. Makes me angry and sad. I come on here for the light banter and tech support and help out fellow Lumians with their devices. 😊
 
djeire84 said:
Sure Barack Obama was walking into a huge messy situation. Bush created the mess and Obama bless him he tried to untangle the huge clusterfcuk that was in front of him. But is failing.
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Lol liberals will stretch as far as they can to blame everything on Bush. There are some things *gasp* are even outside the US's influence.

djeire84 said:
Then the US executed Sadam on war crimes (yes he did it to his own people but never posed a threat to USA or her territories) and then the very breed of extremists he had kept under iron rule were free to roam and do as they saw fit.
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That's a straw man argument if I've ever seen one. The problem isn't that the "breed of extremists... Were free to roam", the problem is that the breed of extremists even existed in the first place.
 
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