why keep using windows/windows phone?

[tgp]

I was decrying the lack of alternatives.

On the other hand, there are plenty of alternatives. Currently we have, or had, Windows Phone/Mobile, Sailfish, Tizen, BB OS, Ubuntu Touch, and probably others I missed. The problem is that they don't take off. Here's my opinion on why they flounder:

I've brought this up before, but why does the 2nd place desktop OS vendor have less than 4% market share? It makes sense to settle down to the best one or two at the top. If there were more viable platforms, a company such as Facebook would need to provide an app for each one. Right now 2 apps will cover 99.5% of the market. Why would they want to produce 3, 4, 5, or 10 apps for the same coverage?

The same concept applies to carriers and other vendors selling devices. Everyone is going to buy a smartphone anyway. What gain would they see by spreading it out? They're not going to get any more customers. I realize that there are arguments for having more options, but if having more was advantageous (to manufacturers and vendors) to having less, there would be more. Customers arguably would gain, but it's not enough of an advantage to us to override the downsides, so we're content to leave things as they spin out.

My 2¢.

 

[fatclue_98]

InstaSnapTwitFace

You just gave me a standing 8-count with that one.

 

[fatclue_98]

In future, AI will know you better, and offer only stuff you might be interested in and haven't responded previously with annoyed or sarcastic tone

I would quote Katt Williams but I know what would happen. Do you seriously want any form of artificial intelligence (there's an oxymoron if there ever was one) prying into your past in an effort to help you? Are you sure that machine is looking out for your best interest or Cyberdyne System's? Check your response, Skynet is watching.

 

[libra89]

Option one: Notifications are off by default. Users must enable the notifications they want.
Problems: How do users know what to enable? How do users know what could be possible? Why I'm not getting discount codes like others? Can I pay with my phone here? Why am I left out of the "inner ring"?

Option two: Notifications are on by default. Users must disable the notifications they don't want.
Problems: Stream of notifications until unnecessary ones are turned off.

As a user I would pick #2 . As a developer I would pick #2 . If I was in management, I would pick #2 .
Turning off things you do know is easier than turning on things you don't know.

---

In future, AI will know you better, and offer only stuff you might be interested in and haven't responded previously with annoyed or sarcastic tone... The learning process though - :grincry:

As someone who has a phone of each currently (iOS, Android, Windows Phone) and have used them as phones, I strongly prefer the way iOS does it when you open the app for the first time. I hate that with Android, I have to dig to find what stuff to change. Having true notification control in a centered place is preferred.

For your options, I would take 1 but with how iOS does it.

 

[anon(50597)]

Towards the first point: "...I assume many people enjoy it because they sell like hot cakes... mostly because there are inexpensive models..." Might lack of visible alternatives be a factor?

Towards your second point... Good on you that you have that much acceptance... and disposable cash.

Let's combine your third point and your summation as this is the only portion that actually addresses what I stated and that which you quoted.

Remember I wasn't asking to have someone show me why they think Apple or Android is palatable. I'm well aware of the reasons why most consumers choose either or both. I don't live in a bubble. I was decrying the lack of alternatives. The carriers and tech press have long shunned anything that doesn't conform to the model they all make money off of. Have you read the articles regarding recently emergent mobile operating systems such as Ubuntu Touch, FirefoxOS and SailfishOS? They all read the same way: interesting, but they don't support InstaSnapTwitFace so you won't like it. How many carrier stores have even tried to promote a 3rd or 4th choice in the last five years? Disregard what the corporate buying policy is. I mean on the front lines where most consumers do their research, the local carrier (or big box) store. If you don't ask for the latest iThing or Galaxy Whathaveyou the staff quickly steers you that way. Try and talk about an alternative and it is immediately apparent that the "expert" rep is uninformed and uninterested in becoming informed. How can they recommend that which they know and care nothing about?

So your summation looks something like this when pared down:
"Third, I completely agree a duopoly is not the best, but who's to blame? Not the consumers... So what's the answer? To me it's pick the one you hate the least.."

The answer to complacency with the status quo is become more complacent? And it IS the consumers who are to blame. People vote with their money in these situations. It's why I can no longer support Windows Phone. Too many times even the die-hards have shown a lack of willingness to invest in the ecosystem in sufficient numbers on an annual basis to keep the system afloat. I.E.: Buy an App Day, Get NuAns Neo out of Japan, Wharton Brooks and the Cerulean Moment.

You also stated: "...Sailfish? I do wish you the very best with that but I don't see it as ever getting off the ground..." I'm glad it's not up to you, but also saddened when I realize that most think as you do. It's an uphill battle to be sure. Shrugging your shoulders and walking away from the fight you acknowledge needs to be waged does nothing but contribute to the problem.

Enjoy your complacency, but don't insist I adopt it too.

So you blame consumers because you want it and they don't? Why should they put their hard earned money down on something that doesn't give them satisfaction? If any of those alternatives are worth a damned, people will come. Blackberry owned the smartphone market until the 2 current alternatives came along and provided more and look what happened.
I'm not shrugging my shoulders about anything. This is not world hunger or racial inequality, it is a smartphone. It's not a fight because it holds little value. I'm more worried about the two idiots slinging nuclear jabs at each other and disregarding human lives. That's something to fight for.

 

[fatclue_98]

So you blame consumers because you want it and they don't? Why should they put their hard earned money down on something that doesn't give them satisfaction? If any of those alternatives are worth a damned, people will come. Blackberry owned the smartphone market until the 2 current alternatives came along and provided more and look what happened.
I'm not shrugging my shoulders about anything. This is not world hunger or racial inequality, it is a smartphone. It's not a fight because it holds little value. I'm more worried about the two idiots slinging nuclear jabs at each other and disregarding human lives. That's something to fight for.

Are you referring to Kim Jong Un and Wun Dum Fuk?

Sent from my Acer Liquid Jade Primo on mTalk

 

[anon(50597)]

Are you referring to Kim Jong Un and Wun Dum Fuk?

Sent from my Acer Liquid Jade Primo on mTalk

Yes, I believe those the two _________ I am referring to.

 

[fatclue_98]

Yes, I believe those the two _________ I am referring to.

Just to be sure, this one?

Sent from my Acer Liquid Jade Primo on mTalk

 

[anon(50597)]

Just to be sure, this one?

http://i.imgur.com/aFRL9Pw.jpg


Sent from my Acer Liquid Jade Primo on mTalk

Yes, the visual confirms it. I am absolutely sure now.

 

[aximtreo]

ROFLMAO

Now that's 72 year old intelligence. Nothing artificial about ROFLMAO!!!!!

 

[RumoredNow]

Why should they put their hard earned money down on something that doesn't give them satisfaction?

In my estimation they haven't tried alternatives so they have no idea whether any of them satisfy their needs or not. The industry tries mightily to steer them away (which is, of course, only natural in a competitive market space). Familiarity, complacency, timidity... Various factors combine (and the majority is severely under-informed [tech press complicity there]) to prevent most consumers from venturing into alternates.

Hopefully, you can see the fallacious nature of your argument that the systems "don't provide satisfaction" as the adoption rates are so low.

Not using something ever is no indicator of whether it works for you or not, it only indicates adoption rates. It's not like all the alternates have been tried by each and every user who then selected the best fit for themselves from personal experience. You're conflating issues and assigning causation where only a correlation (at best) might exist.

If you'd never heard of the influenza vaccine, or had declined to get inoculated, is not proof that the influenza vaccine is useless to you.

 

[anon(50597)]

In my estimation they haven't tried alternatives so they have no idea whether any of them satisfies their needs or not. The industry tries mightily to steer them away (which is, of course, only natural in a competitive market space). Familiarity, complacency, timidity... Various factors combine (and the majority is severely under-informed [tech press complicity there]) to prevent most consumers from venturing into alternates.

Hopefully, you can see the fallacious nature of your argument that the systems "don't provide satisfaction" as the adoption rates are so low.

Not using something ever is no indicator of whether it works for you or not, it only indicates adoption rates. It's not like all the alternates have been tried by each and every user who then selected the best fit for themselves from personal experience. Your conflating issues and assigning causation where only a correlation (at best) might exist.

If you'd never heard of the influenza vaccine, or had declined to get inoculated, is not proof that the influenza vaccine is useless to you.

There s not an alternative to the influenza vaccine, so that is not a valid example.
Also, why should people try all the alternative OS's if they are satisfied with the current ones? I truly feel for you for not being happy with iOS or Android but you can't expect everyone else to test alternatives to fit your situation. Sure, a few people may switch but there is no proof a substantial amount of people would.
Again, I throw this back on the alternative OS's. Build something worthy, news will spread, users will recommend it and it will become mainstream. It's how it works.
Please let us know how Sailfish goes. Who knows, you could be the catalyst it needs.

 

[fatclue_98]

There s not an alternative to the influenza vaccine, so that is not a valid example.
Also, why should people try all the alternative OS's if they are satisfied with the current ones? I truly feel for you for not being happy with iOS or Android but you can't expect everyone else to test alternatives to fit your situation. Sure, a few people may switch but there is no proof a substantial amount of people would.
Again, I throw this back on the alternative OS's. Build something worthy, news will spread, users will recommend it and it will become mainstream. It's how it works.
Please let us know how Sailfish goes. Who knows, you could be the catalyst it needs.

Sorry, but I have to disagree with you there. We, @RumoredNow and I, are webOS refugees. We know what being on a clearly superior OS feels like only to see gross mismanagement pi$$ it away. Many of the features users clamor for were webOS firsts and yet the OS failed. Garbage hardware had a lot to do with it as well but that's an argument for another day. For all its negative press, BB OS10 is much better (as a core OS) than Android could ever dream of being and puts iOS to shame.

Simply put, people don't want to let go of their binkies even if there's something better. Please note I'm generalizing, the fact you're here shows you were adventurous enough to give WinMo a shot. Sadly, the other 98% is screwing it up for everybody else with death by condescension.

 

[anon(50597)]

Sorry, but I have to disagree with you there. We, @RumoredNow and I, are webOS refugees. We know what being on a clearly superior OS feels like only to see gross mismanagement pi$$ it away. Many of the features users clamor for were webOS firsts and yet the OS failed. Garbage hardware had a lot to do with it as well but that's an argument for another day. For all its negative press, BB OS10 is much better (as a core OS) than Android could ever dream of being and puts iOS to shame.

Simply put, people don't want to let go of their binkies even if there's something better. Please note I'm generalizing, the fact you're here shows you were adventurous enough to give WinMo a shot. Sadly, the other 98% is screwing it up for everybody else with death by condescension.

Hey it's OK to agree to disagree, and yes I disagree!

How do you quantify WebOS as a "clearly superior" OS, as if that has been scientifically proven and accepted? BB10 puts Android and iPhone "to shame"? Again, how? Wait, I know....better security, the Hub, removable battery.......right? Now we are to assume the 99% didn't hear about the existence of BB10 and these magical innovations. Look, BB10 was an excellent OS (not superior). I was the first person in line to get the Z10 when it came out so I know all about it. It was a "different" OS that had nothing innovative to pull enough people from Android and IPhone. If everyone had tried it would some have switched? Sure, but not enough. Heck, they couldn't even keep enough diehards, what does that tell you?

Again, if someone is using a particular OS and engrossed in their ecosystem, it takes more than hyperbole to pull them away. How do we know if people aren't just happy with their choice? It's like saying if I would just drive your favorite vehicle, you know I would buy it because you like it and it's "clearly superior". I find it insulting when people claim the other 99% are stupid, sheep, or too lazy to try something different.

I fully accept that in a perfect world we would have more choices. I thought MS was going to be that company but the dream is fading away. In the mean time, I'm perfectly happy with my iPhone that can do everything I need, despite the fact it doesn't run WebOS or BB10. How am I managing?

FYI: I find this an interesting topic and hope I don't offend anyone with my comments. I respect people's choices and differences. I believe the market will work itself out over time, technology will develop, and very cool new things are right around the corner for us to argue about for years to come.

 

[Elky64]

The way I see it, MSFT had the wherewithal to change the mobile industry but they chose not to. So at this point and time we basically have two viable choices whether we like it or not. Of course that’ll depend on ones needs. But at present I personally feel WM does restrict those yearning for advancements, if not now soon it will if the cards keep being dealt as they have been.

2-choices - Either you stick w/Windows Mobile dealing with its ramifications by doing so, or switch to Android/iOS accepting their pitfalls while welcoming the added abilities. Orrrrr, you could simply buy multiple handsets on each platform (like me ), which would allow one to have the best of "ALL" worlds. Sounds like a simple solution don't ya think :winktongue:

 

[leandrodp2016]

Who would have thought everything that happened in computers' world after the invention of Windows, Microsoft would be beatable in any ground. You'd believe with all that money and power anything they'd put out would be embraced by the masses. And then late to the party with smartphones, now seemingly leaving that territory, and people opting for Macs... I remember struggling to install Netscape on my win 98 machine, behind my dad's back who though only Microsoft stuff was worth it. Now how tables have turned amazes me. I know realistically and logically more pcs are sold in the world than Macs (mostly due to pricing, availability...) but people are REALLY into macs , and Apple stuff in general. I have no clue how the mighty of the 90s has eventually fallen.

 

[Sakitumi]

For the offline maps app

 

[Byrese]

Please tell me why i must stay with the Windows platform?
Even Microsoft makes there one suport and apps better for other platforms than for there own platform. Skype is better on any other system than that from Windows on phone or pc. There keyboard on the iPhone is better than on the Windows phone, the Edge browser is more a bug than usable and even Windows 10 is still far behind os-x.

Why must i stay with the windows platform as other platforms give me what i want and better than Microsoft for there own platform do?

I have tablets, phones, laptops and a desktop pc running all win10 but i am thinking of switching to apple and android only because of the way Microsoft treates there user by supporting other platform more than there own platform, and than i am not talking only about win mobile.
I feel like i am used like %%#@ and that microsofts tanks you for getting there product and than say but we help the ones on other platforms because we our platform sucks and we have your money already, thank you and have fun.

You don't have to do anything. Use what you want. I have an Android but I keep coming back to WP bcuz it's unique. There's nothing like it. More than the others I simply ENJOY WP.

Sent from my HP Elite x3 on mTalk

 

[Elky64]

Please tell me why i must stay with the Windows platform?
Even Microsoft makes there one suport and apps better for other platforms than for there own platform. Skype is better on any other system than that from Windows on phone or pc. There keyboard on the iPhone is better than on the Windows phone, the Edge browser is more a bug than usable and even Windows 10 is still far behind os-x.

Why must i stay with the windows platform as other platforms give me what i want and better than Microsoft for there own platform do?

I have tablets, phones, laptops and a desktop pc running all win10 but i am thinking of switching to apple and android only because of the way Microsoft treates there user by supporting other platform more than there own platform, and than i am not talking only about win mobile.
I feel like i am used like %%#@ and that microsofts tanks you for getting there product and than say but we help the ones on other platforms because we our platform sucks and we have your money already, thank you and have fun.

If it's meeting your needs and expectations at this point and time then there's no real reason to switch. But going by your post I'd say you are now questioning Windows Mobile's abilities to fulfil those aspects I mentioned. Only way to really find out is by giving the "others" an honest go, seeing for yourself is the only way to know if it is right for YOU.

Was just recently using my 950 as a daily driver and after 4-days returned to Android. Like the tiles and the ability to have everything on one page so-to-speak, and the simple "swipe up" to access more – we keep live-tiles to a minimum. Yes I am a chronic switcher yet we’re mainly Android 90% of the time now.

For me (average user here) WM suffices for the necessities such as, calls, e-mails, texting, and photos. Yet one of my gripes, when compared to other platforms, is how the OS still feels so "beta" like. Basically, it is not tweaked for efficiency so stutters, lagging, delays, are always evident when performing many of the operations. Then there's the fact that this phone now severely limits what we (I) can do compared to my droid, mostly due to non-existent apps - just lost another one last week, banking app - then throw in web pages that are inaccessible which we have yet to find a workaround. Almost forgot... the fact that in my experience, Android/iOS has been a "set it and forget it" affair w/Windows Mobile not even being anywhere near close.

At the end of the day, for me, our Windows Phone's cannot compete in the consistency, performance or ability departments with any of my Androids, and that includes my oldest droid which happens to be 8-months older than our 950. And IMHO, same holds true for iPhone since it too has rivalled WM from my standpoint. It's one thing "hanging on" because it does what you need it to, another because you like its good looks.


So to answer your question "Please tell me why i must stay with the Windows platform?", YOU DON'T... The ability to have an open mind and not being resistant to change will go a long way in helping one transition, tis going to be inevitable the way I see it.

 

[PerfectReign]

Sorry, but I have to disagree with you there. We, @RumoredNowFor all its negative press, BB OS10 is much better (as a core OS) than Android could ever dream of being and puts iOS to shame.

heh, you must not have been forced to actually use a BB10 device. I had first the Z10 then the Q10. I'm sure you can find some of my rantings on crackberry. My coworkers and staff resoundly despised the awful UI also.