Windows Media Center to make a return on Windows 10 ? Any updates ?

[link68759]

That's a lot of manual nerd-work just to watch TV. The beauty of media center is that it just works all together when you pick up your remote, and you can extend it to other TVs very easily. Sure there are hacks and multiple products you can cobble together that provide "similar" functionality. But for me I say "Xbox On" and it switches on my Xbone which in turn auto-flips on my TV and 360, and it takes me straight to media center and live TV or recorded shows or ripped videos, no messing around with anything. It just works.

(And before anyone asks, we still play 360 games a lot so no we aren't being forced to keep the 360. We actively use both systems for gaming as well.)

Knowing it's days are numbered I've also been tempted to replace it with something else, but as stated before there is nothing that equals it that doesn't require me to buy more stuff and hack/cobble **** together for LESS functionality. That homerun box looks close, but not quite there.

If you call plugging an HDMI cable into a box "nerd work" then I assume you had to hire a nerd to plug in your TV for you. You could easily call him/her again to get the HDCP stripper set up.

 

[oldpueblo]

If you call plugging an HDMI cable into a box "nerd work" then I assume you had to hire a nerd to plug in your TV for you. You could easily call him/her again to get the HDCP stripper set up.

Okay I obviously misread what you meant by HDCP stripper, I assumed it was some kind of software I'd have to use to strip out DRM from the video files after they record. You're saying it can run inline with the HDMI cable? Question though, how do I even get the HDCP content in the first place to strip out? Right now I have one box that effectively services all my multiple TVs as well as takes care of all subscribed channel decoding for lack of a better word. Where would the stripping happen with a different device?

 

[link68759]

Okay I obviously misread what you meant by HDCP stripper, I assumed it was some kind of software I'd have to use to strip out DRM from the video files after they record. You're saying it can run inline with the HDMI cable? Question though, how do I even get the HDCP content in the first place to strip out? Right now I have one box that effectively services all my multiple TVs as well as takes care of all subscribed channel decoding for lack of a better word. Where would the stripping happen?

Yeah they're usually a box with an input and output for inline use. Some PC capture cards support HDCP stripping on the hardware level. I've never played with TV tuners or channel decoding software so I couldn't advise you on how to configure everything.

 

[PepperdotNet]

HDCP stripper won't do any good with a TV tuner based recording system, you'd need a separate tuning device that outputs HDMI, then an HDMI input on your recording device. If it's multiple devices, good luck controlling or automating anything. This kind of DRM crap is why Dish Network and DirecTV never released their PCI-card satellite tuners, both of which were actually designed, built and demonstrated as working.

 

[Cleavitt76]

Yeah they're usually a box with an input and output for inline use. Some PC capture cards support HDCP stripping on the hardware level. I've never played with TV tuners or channel decoding software so I couldn't advise you on how to configure everything.

It's nice that you mention that part about not knowing what you are talking about after you have talked down to people that actually have experience with this stuff. The bottom line is that most people don't have the time or the desire to hack their own TV subscription that they already paid for. Nor do they want to string a bunch of devices together to accomplish some of what can be done with a single supported product like WMC. I work on computers all day long for a living. When I'm trying to relax and watch some TV or a movie, I really don't want to feel like I'm still at work troubleshooting some kludge of a DVR/media player. The solutions you are describing are fine for some kid in a dorm room with nothing better to do with their time, but for anyone with a life and other family members sharing the TV, hacks are not a viable option. If the day comes that I can't get WMC or a real replacement for it, I'll go back to renting a DVR from the cable company before I resort to stringing a bunch of random stuff together.

 

[link68759]

It's nice that you mention that part about not knowing what you are talking about after you have talked down to people that actually have experience with this stuff. The bottom line is that most people don't have the time or the desire to hack their own TV subscription that they already paid for. Nor do they want to string a bunch of devices together to accomplish some of what can be done with a single supported product like WMC. I work on computers all day long for a living. When I'm trying to relax and watch some TV or a movie, I really don't want to feel like I'm still at work troubleshooting some kludge of a DVR/media player. The solutions you are describing are fine for some kid in a dorm room with nothing better to do with their time, but for anyone with a life and other family members sharing the TV, hacks are not a viable option. If the day comes that I can't get WMC or a real replacement for it, I'll go back to renting a DVR from the cable company before I resort to stringing a bunch of random stuff together.

Thanks for the info, you sure did put me in my place Mr. trust-me-I-work-on-'puters-for-a-living. You're totally right, experience has to be first hand or it's useless, there's no such thing as a solution that works for more than one scenario.

And I humbly apologize for the act of suggesting an alternative solution to what is probably not going to work in the near future- I'll never talk down to someone like that again. When my suggestions are then misinterpreted and rudely rebuked, it is not my place to return in kind and I deserve to be talked down by you as well!

Ah, to be so entitled on the internet... What was I thinking?

 

[poit57]

It seems someone confused the issue by mentioning HDCP. That is not the issue at all, and an HDCP stripper would not resolve the DRM issue. You can still connect analog displays that require no HDCP support at all.

The issue with CableCard support is that WMC is the only software licensed to decrypt copy protection from cable companies, which happens between the tuner and the WMC software. Without that support, there is no hope for recording, much less watching protected video streams. For my cable provider, that includes all channels past the basic 40 channel package, which means not only premium channels like HBO and Showtime, but also common cable channels like USA, ESPN, AMC, etc. are encrypted.

 

[poit57]

For the record, I did try the WMC key that Microsoft released for the Windows 8 consumer preview a few years ago. Like others have mentioned, it did unlock WMC, but I could no longer get any updates from Windows Update for the technical preview.

The other issue I had is that I could not get the Digital Cable Advisor inside WMC to install properly, which means I could not receive those protected channels through my CableCard.

I haven't really messed with the technical preview much outside of this. I am already sold on the upgrade for my regular computer, but this will be the determining factor on whether or not I will upgrade my HTPC which is currently running Windows 8.1. I have voted on the uservoice page that WMC be supported, or at the very least that CableCard support be brought to W10 in some form.

 

[DavidinCT]

Still, People are taking about using a 3rd party product with using Windows Media Center in the background. If you are worried about running into HDCP problems, just run component HD (1080i max but, no broadcast is over that anyway) this would resolve this problem and there are 3rd party products that can import Component HD into a computer, if one was to need it.

Honestly, I don't see the point. Microsoft wants everyone to go to Windows 10 by giving everyone Windows 10 for free (7 and 8 users), Sure a few of my desktops will be upgraded but, My Dedicated Home theater PC will NOT unless it has Windows Media Center on it.

Still running Windows 7 on it, Why ? There is NO difference between WIndows 7 version and Windows 8, infact they removed a few settings when it went to Windows 8. Win 7 is the better product for WMC (if using as a HTPC).

Sure I would be ok if MS released WMC on Windows 10, I would be extremely happy, if they did a release and did some major updates to a product that was designed 5-7 years ago.

Still for a 5-7 year old piece of software, it still holds up today and still is the "CHOSEN" option for HTPC users, and it's the one that everything else is compared to in this area.

Anyway about it Microsoft had a great product in their hands and just let it go, I really wish they would get the passion back, like I have and re-do WMC to be the ONLY HTPC out there....

sigh, MS if your listening, Please do something on this subject, it really is/was one of the best products Microsoft has ever made and I am sure I am not the only one who feels this way.

 

[Wilbur Schitzel]

Only people who don't use WMC don't realize how great it is. It rarely has issues if its used within its boundaries. No, MKV files dont always work correctly, but WMC was never meant to support those files. Feed it what it was built to do, and its seamless.

I would be blown away if WMC is in Win10. It almost wasn't in Win8, but people revolted and they added it as an add-on to suffice those disgruntled (me included) Windows users. Look at XBOX One. There is no extender support. There is the writing on the wall.

As of right now, there is no Live TV/DVR that works for HTPC. I've tried XBMC, mythTV, etc. Nothing comes close. Plus, the XBOX 360 extenders takes WMC through the roof. There's nothing like it...except putting a DVR cable box on every TV.

I realize that WMC's days are numbered, but until then, our family is happy.

 

[Maaz Mansori]

I agree with the others who say WMC is a great product, in particular it's the only proper solution for a digital cable DVR, one that works without hacks and only requires a Windows computer with a CableCard TV tuner. You don't have to mess with additional hardware or software. It just works and works well. Otherwise you have to rent one from the cable company or buy a TiVo or similar device and pay monthly service fee for that, and often times you only get 2 tuners instead of 4 or 6 that many CableCard tuners provide.

That said, cable companies discourage the use of CableCards by making them a little more difficult to get, not including them with bundles, and offering little support. CableCards that are used in boxes other than what the cable company provides represent maybe 1% or so of the market and the vast majority of those are TiVo. In addition, traditional cable TV is starting to become a thing of the past. Soon enough more and more live channels will be available for streaming, and such services as On Demand, HBO GO, or logging into your cable account online to watch shows on AMC or other channels you may have missed are becoming the norm, negating the need for a traditional DVR in many cases.

What Microsoft needs to do is work with cable companies to bring streaming live TV to both the Xbox One as well as the Xbox Video or another Windows 10 app, then offer a new media center type app that makes it easier to use the remote control and interacts with other apps such as Netflix, and Blu Ray player. I believe Verizon FIOS offers some live channels on the Xbox One without the need of connecting the cable box. I may look into this. As great as WMC and CableCard support is, unfortunately, it is time to move on from them.

 

[DavidinCT]

So, I tried something, a long time ago, when Windows 8 came out, someone created a Install for Windows Media Center for Windows 8. They created a installer, and it installed on Windows 8 and seemed to work fine with tuners (didn't try it on a cablecard tuner).

For those who are asking, I DO not remember where I got it from but, it was tagged from one of the big tech sites, I know for a fact that it does work on Windows 8 and 8.1..(I have it setup on my tablet). Just one of those endless files I see to have sitting on my Windows 7 desktop (Need to clean it up a little)

So the other day, I tried to install it to Windows 10 (the newest build) and it does not run at all, as an admin or in compatibly mode.

Maybe MS changed something in the graphics subsystem that wont work with WMC ?

That said, cable companies discourage the use of CableCards by making them a little more difficult to get, not including them with bundles, and offering little support. CableCards that are used in boxes other than what the cable company provides represent maybe 1% or so of the market and the vast majority of those are TiVo. In addition, traditional cable TV is starting to become a thing of the past. Soon enough more and more live channels will be available for streaming, and such services as On Demand, HBO GO, or logging into your cable account online to watch shows on AMC or other channels you may have missed are becoming the norm, negating the need for a traditional DVR in many cases.

Your 100% right, Cable companies do not push or give you hard time with getting or supporting cablecards. I have used COX and COMCAST (current) and if you have an issue, it's normally a hassle to get support. After MONTHS of issues (where after about 2 weeks channels would just fall off) and calling every month or so, I finally got a direct number to the cablecard support team and I keep it on a sticky note in my office. After talking to them before, No problems, it's been working for months with out a problem.

The BIGGEST problem with cablecards is their limits. In their current form, they do not support true 2-way communication, So with this, you lose PPV and On-Demand features. Some one who has cable but, not all those features (just basic or extended basic) WOULD LOVE WMC. Also for people who never use those features.

There was a upgraded cablecard that was going to FCC and not sure if it was officially approved but, it would of supported on-demand and PPV. It's been a while from the time I heard about it.

Never mind, WMC was not designed for Cablecard v2, so it would need to be almost re-written to support those features (unless the eHome team started it before they broke up), so even if you could get one, get your cable company to activate it, there is no software or hardware that support it...

Sad to say

Also when WMC for Windows 7 came out, there was a good period of time before the "eHome" team was broken up, there was rumor that they were building a new version of WMC (this is going back a few years).

As we know (at least WMC junkies know) there is no difference in WMC in 7 and 8, they just removed "start when windows starts" and "WMC always on top". In fact the version number did not change.

Would love to see the last bits of what the eHome team created....EVEN SCREENSHOTS...

 

[Maaz Mansori]

Your 100% right, Cable companies do not push or give you hard time with getting or supporting cablecards. I have used COX and COMCAST (current) and if you have an issue, it's normally a hassle to get support. After MONTHS of issues (where after about 2 weeks channels would just fall off) and calling every month or so, I finally got a direct number to the cablecard support team and I keep it on a sticky note in my office. After talking to them before, No problems, it's been working for months with out a problem...

Yeah, and Comcast used to offer Cablecards for tech install only so when I got mine the first time, the tech came but couldn't figure out how to get it working. He didn't understand WMC and blamed the problem on my system. After he left, I ran some diagnostics and discovered that the problem was receiving the signal so I called and did an automatic refresh by using their touch tone system and suddenly is started working.

The second time I set it up I ordered service for self-install and they said they can't ship cable cards and sent me a cable box instead but they said I could take the cable box back to their office and they will give me a cable card instead so I did just that. I then called the number to activate. The rep did not understand that it would work with WMC so I pretended that I had a TiVo instead and just gave all the information from WMC and then it worked fine.

The BIGGEST problem with cablecards is their limits. In their current form, they do not support true 2-way communication, So with this, you lose PPV and On-Demand features. Some one who has cable but, not all those features (just basic or extended basic) WOULD LOVE WMC. Also for people who never use those features..

This is true but you don't have to rely solely on WMC. After all you have a full Windows desktop computer. Comcast has their On Demand available for streaming through the web. PPV is generally a waste of money and there are usually other options such as renting a movie from Amazon.com.

 

[DavidinCT]

This is true but you don't have to rely solely on WMC. After all you have a full Windows desktop computer. Comcast has their On Demand available for streaming through the web. PPV is generally a waste of money and there are usually other options such as renting a movie from Amazon.com.

All depends on the family, some people use on-demand/PPV all the time. Others could care less about it. I did customer WMC based home theater PCs for a few years (till MS officially killed it), maybe about 150-200 PCs I setup and installed. This topic came up a lot when I was selling the system to the clients (PPV more than on-demand).

As for 3rd party On-demand products/web sites, sure there are a ton of them. The key thing for me, can they be fully controlled via remote ?

There are some mods where you can get a icon in WMC, then click on it and it will open IE in Kiosk mode (full screen with no banners). If the item can be used via a remote, then it's something I would use, otherwise, it does not fit in the interface, so I wont use it.

I am talking about a Dedicated Home theater PC, used just for WMC running at 2160p @60hz(4k/UHD) with full DTS/DD-HD core audio running from it.

 

[Maaz Mansori]

All depends on the family, some people use on-demand/PPV all the time. Others could care less about it. I did customer WMC based home theater PCs for a few years (till MS officially killed it), maybe about 150-200 PCs I setup and installed. This topic came up a lot when I was selling the system to the clients (PPV more than on-demand).

As for 3rd party On-demand products/web sites, sure there are a ton of them. The key thing for me, can they be fully controlled via remote ?

There are some mods where you can get a icon in WMC, then click on it and it will open IE in Kiosk mode (full screen with no banners). If the item can be used via a remote, then it's something I would use, otherwise, it does not fit in the interface, so I wont use it.

I am talking about a Dedicated Home theater PC, used just for WMC running at 2160p @60hz(4k/UHD) with full DTS/DD-HD core audio running from it.

I agree, but what I meant was that for those who just may want to access some other content on occasion, the option is there to use the computer without the remote. For me, having 4 tuners, not having to rent a DVR, and support for DVDs both stored on the HDD and physical ones, plugins for Blu Ray and Netflix that were remote control friendly, third party plugins for Hulu and others, and occasionally having to use the web browser to access other content, was adequate, worked well and saved me money.
However, now that WMCs days are numbered and there are streaming options of live TV available, my next project will be to replace my HTPC with an Xbox One, use its apps, and set up Plex to stream locally stored movies. I'll lose the DVR but it's no longer important to me with most content available for streaming, and I can switch to Verizon FIOS if Comcast isn't going to play nice with the Xbox One.

 

[WScottCross]

I was a hardcore MC user since the original 2005 version. I was unhappy that MS decided to remove support for the other extenders in Windows 8, so I was stuck with Windows 7. I decided to cut the cable back in December after yet another price increase from Comcast. I switched over to OTA and streaming for the shows I couldn't get OTA. After a bunch of research into the best way to have both the DVR and streaming from one device, I looked into TiVo and found that it was the best option for me. I now have a TiVo Roamio Basic with 4 tuners (supports either OTA or cablecard) and 3 TiVo Mini's. I upgraded the drive to 3TB as soon as I got it and that's plenty considering I now have fewer channels to record from. The latest update from TiVo integrates the streaming and recorded shows into one package called OnePass. It's the perfect replacement for me. It does everything my MC did with one exception; no more automatic commercial skipping. The commercial detection was never perfect in MC, but I do still miss it. I can still skip with the remote so it's no show stopper for me. The cost I paid for the TiVo's with lifetime subscription will be recovered in under a year from what I'm saving from cutting the cable. All my MC hardware is now up for sale and that will further offset the hardware costs of the TiVo units. Anyone looking for a MC alternative should consider TiVo.

 

[CJ Thunder]

Xbone and a usb receiver for cable/antenna would be nice.

 

[Maaz Mansori]

Xbone and a usb receiver for cable/antenna would be nice.

I agree. I'm hoping maybe once the 'Xbone' is updated to Windows 10, a standard USB TV tuner could work. I have an outdoor digital over the air antenna that I can make use of. It's somewhat wishful thinking though. Apparently, the capability is already available in parts of Europe and I think Australia.

 

[dgr_874]

I was a hardcore MC user since the original 2005 version. I was unhappy that MS decided to remove support for the other extenders in Windows 8, so I was stuck with Windows 7. I decided to cut the cable back in December after yet another price increase from Comcast. I switched over to OTA and streaming for the shows I couldn't get OTA. After a bunch of research into the best way to have both the DVR and streaming from one device, I looked into TiVo and found that it was the best option for me. I now have a TiVo Roamio Basic with 4 tuners (supports either OTA or cablecard) and 3 TiVo Mini's. I upgraded the drive to 3TB as soon as I got it and that's plenty considering I now have fewer channels to record from. The latest update from TiVo integrates the streaming and recorded shows into one package called OnePass. It's the perfect replacement for me. It does everything my MC did with one exception; no more automatic commercial skipping. The commercial detection was never perfect in MC, but I do still miss it. I can still skip with the remote so it's no show stopper for me. The cost I paid for the TiVo's with lifetime subscription will be recovered in under a year from what I'm saving from cutting the cable. All my MC hardware is now up for sale and that will further offset the hardware costs of the TiVo units. Anyone looking for a MC alternative should consider TiVo.

Does the mini's have the same capability as an extender did for WMC? Shared Guide, Hulu, Netflix available on the mini?

 

[CJ Thunder]

I agree. I'm hoping maybe once the 'Xbone' is updated to Windows 10, a standard USB TV tuner could work. I have an outdoor digital over the air antenna that I can make use of. It's somewhat wishful thinking though. Apparently, the capability is already available in parts of Europe and I think Australia.

I hope so with w10. I wonder if they'll be a hack to put steam on an xbone...
Anyway I miss many media center things.

Kind of on topic, are there any curator type apps or sites that will launch the proper app or service with a specific movie or show?