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10-24-2014 07:15 PM
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  1. someone2639's Avatar
    If Windows 10 is coming to Windows phone 8 devices, and some of those are 512mb ram devices, then wouldn't Windows 10 for PC have support for older computers?
    10-11-2014 11:11 PM
  2. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    How old are you looking at? What are the hardware specs of your PC?
    10-11-2014 11:14 PM
  3. several potatos's Avatar
    Well, define "older". Honestly, I think Microsoft may purposefully block *really* old devices simply to stop people from installing W10 and then freaking out when Crysis doesn't run at 4k.
    10-11-2014 11:14 PM
  4. Bobvfr's Avatar
    I wonder if I can find my old Amstrad 1520 with 520k of ram that I upgraded to 640k and replaced one of the 5 1/4 floppies with a 1.2m 3 1/2 drive and finally put a 20m hard drive in, I am sure I can stuff a new OS on it if a try hard enough



    Bob
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    10-12-2014 03:42 AM
  5. gwinegarden's Avatar
    There is a big difference between the phone OS and the PC version.
    10-12-2014 07:26 AM
  6. Toan Le's Avatar
    As long as your PC meets the hardware requirement of the OS (2GHz CPU, 1GB of RAM, etc as I remember), then it is supported. Unlike phones, whose OS availability also depend on OEMs (I think).
    10-12-2014 08:20 AM
  7. someone2639's Avatar
    But, theoretically, if Windows 10 mobile can run on 512 Mb phones, then it could possibly run on 512 Mb computers (release)
    10-12-2014 08:31 AM
  8. jmthomas1987's Avatar
    The CPU and memory may meet the specs, but the bigger issue will be drivers for the other hardware.

    That is the biggest challenge for MS since it started. Having an OS that can work with multiple types of hardware from multiple manufacturers.

    That is why new OS releases from MS seem so painful and disorganized sometimes. It isn't the OS that has the problem. A lot of times it is the hardware makers not getting their drivers right to talk to the OS.

    That is why Apple has systems that "just work". They control both the hardware and software, so they can control things better within their eco system.

    I am NOT an Apple fan, actually pointing out that MS has many more variables to contend with.
    WinSammie and monkeysaintfun like this.
    10-12-2014 08:48 AM
  9. Bobvfr's Avatar
    We will find out in the fullness of time.




    Bob
    Dave47 likes this.
    10-12-2014 09:41 AM
  10. a5cent's Avatar
    If Windows 10 is coming to Windows phone 8 devices, and some of those are 512mb ram devices, then wouldn't Windows 10 for PC have support for older computers?
    This is exactly the kind of confusion that I expected...

    Many people, even here on these boards, including some developers, believe this is all the same OS when they are actually two. The Windows desktop and mobile OSes will no doubt have much in common (WinRT API and runtime and the kernel) but there will remain huge differences as well.

    W104M (Windows 10 for mobile) lacks everything related to the desktop, enterprise, virtualization, disk management, and a gazillion other things.

    The W10 technical preview is nothing like what will end up running on phones and tablets. From a users point of view however, they will access the same app store and both will run the same universal apps. I guess it's those similarities that justify using the same name for both.

    Because these two OSes won't be the same (W104M will be about 1/10th the size of its bigger brother), it's simply not possible to draw conclusions about one by knowing something about the other.

    Desktop W10's minimal requirements will likely be identical to W8.1's:

    1GB for 32bit versions, 2GB for 64bit versions of Windows.
    Last edited by a5cent; 10-12-2014 at 03:10 PM. Reason: formatting
    10-12-2014 10:12 AM
  11. someone2639's Avatar
    I knew something like that would surface. Due to display and multitasking, it would need 1 GB of ram.
    10-12-2014 11:26 AM
  12. a5cent's Avatar
    I knew something like that would surface. Due to display and multitasking, it would need 1 GB of ram.
    That too, but mostly because desktop W10 is over 9 times larger and includes two decades worth of Windows functions and features that phones and tablets simply have no use for.
    Last edited by a5cent; 10-12-2014 at 03:09 PM. Reason: W10 > desktop W10
    10-12-2014 01:09 PM
  13. ronaldme's Avatar
    But, theoretically, if Windows 10 mobile can run on 512 Mb phones, then it could possibly run on 512 Mb computers (release)
    No, not even theoretically. Windows 10 on Pc supports desktop applications, and desktop itself, and there are limitations for 512MB PCs.
    10-12-2014 01:46 PM
  14. EssThree's Avatar
    Window 10 x86 and Windows 10 ARM are different beasts.
    10-12-2014 10:53 PM
  15. mjrtoo's Avatar
    Window 10 x86 and Windows 10 ARM are different beasts.
    Wrong Windows 10 x86 programs and apps are different beasts, the OS is the same.
    10-12-2014 10:54 PM
  16. a5cent's Avatar
    Wrong Windows 10 x86 programs and apps are different beasts, the OS is the same.

    Ehm..... you've got this backward.

    Universal apps for W10-arm and W10-x86 can be 100% identical, meaning the entire source code base and the binary distributable too, as it will often be just CPU independent IL code.

    Moreover, W10-arm and W10-x86 are not functionally identical. One is a very small subset of the other, which IMHO is anything but "the same". You might as well say the numbers 123 and 2 are the same, because they both include the number 2.
    10-13-2014 03:36 AM
  17. mjrtoo's Avatar
    Ehm..... you've got this backward.

    Universal apps for W10-arm and W10-x86 can be 100% identical, meaning the entire source code base and the binary distributable too, as it will often be just CPU independent IL code.

    Moreover, W10-arm and W10-x86 are not functionally identical. One is a very small subset of the other, which IMHO is anything but "the same". You might as well say the numbers 123 and 2 are the same, because they both include the number 2.
    It's the same OS as far as the consumer is concerned, it is Windows 10, that is all. We could argue this all day, not gonna. :-)
    10-13-2014 08:04 AM
  18. a5cent's Avatar
    It's the same OS as far as the consumer is concerned, it is Windows 10, that is all. We could argue this all day, not gonna. :-)
    Since were on a tech site, I don't think adopting the most benign and dumbed down view of the OS makes a lot of sense.

    IMHO even the biggest technophobe would want to know whether a tablet can run desktop software or not, so I'd also disagree that it's safe for consumers to completely ignore the differences.

    Pretending both OSes are one and the same has already proven to be more confusing than helpful, particularly to the tech interested layman. You need only look at the questions people ask about W10 on this site. Most of the misunderstandings and false expectations can be traced directly back to MS using one name for two OSes, for which this thread is a good example.

    By pretending we're getting the same OS on all devices, we're just making it much harder on ourselves. Six months from now, we'll be telling people in the "Ask a Question" forum how stupid they were, for not having done their research. They should have known that not all W10 devices can run desktop software, or that not all W10 tablets will support feature X like on your W10 laptop! Stupid, stupid, stupid! That will be met with cries about how they did do their research but were deceived by WPC members who insisted the OS on all W10 devices is identical.

    Last edited by a5cent; 11-14-2014 at 09:25 AM. Reason: formatting
    10-13-2014 09:22 AM
  19. mjrtoo's Avatar
    Common sense is all but gone.
    10-13-2014 10:43 AM
  20. a5cent's Avatar
    Common sense is all but gone.

    If insults is all you have left, then that is unlikely to convince many. There's got to be a more mature way to disagree, right?

    I'll respond to any worthwhile rebuttal, but lets not make it personal.
    satrus08 and sahib lopez like this.
    10-13-2014 11:02 AM
  21. mjrtoo's Avatar
    I wasn't saying you didn't have common sense, I was saying that in general. Having to explain every detail to every person so they understand that you will never be able to run PhotoShop on a phone is ridiculous.
    10-13-2014 12:04 PM
  22. a5cent's Avatar
    I wasn't saying you didn't have common sense, I was saying that in general. Having to explain every detail to every person so they understand that you will never be able to run PhotoShop on a phone is ridiculous.

    Yeah, I doubt photoshop owners will have issues too, but others will:

    You need only look at how the tech press reacted to Windows RT: "why doesn't my windows tablet run windows software" was a common complaint and misunderstanding, and I fully expect the tech press to complain about the same thing if MS decides to call their WP successor W10. The tech press' reactions will heavily influence consumer sentiment, just as it has for RT.

    The average consumer may think: "hey, a phone that runs windows! I'll run my tax program on that and upgrade my 7 year old laptop and phone with a single carrier subsidised device ". Many of them will turn up here, asking how to get to the desktop on their new W10 phablet, and then obviously blame everyone but themselves for any confusion.

    Finally, like I said, you can already see many signs of confusion here at WPC. The uncertainty about what W10 is, and the false expectations are apparent everywhere (this thread is an example). How do you expect the average consumer to deal, when so many at WPC are already thouroughly confused?

    There are differences, and I just don't see how suggesting there aren't any helps anyone.
    10-13-2014 12:40 PM
  23. mjrtoo's Avatar
    I thoroughly confused is a little strong.
    10-13-2014 02:12 PM
  24. Mike Gibson's Avatar
    Universal apps for W10-arm and W10-x86 can be 100% identical, meaning the entire source code base and the binary distributable too, as it will often be just CPU independent IL code.
    I don't think you can go that far, as any decent Universal app will do something with files and once you do that you're code changes significantly (the idiotic "AndContinue" FilePicker crap in WinPRT). We talk about the significant differences between computers, tablets, and phones in terms of the OS but MSFT is still, even after the Win8 disaster, trying to force them together. For whatever reason they still think that they can use Windows desktop dominance to leverage their way into phones. It hasn't worked and won't work. That's not what consumers want.
    10-13-2014 02:38 PM
  25. a5cent's Avatar
    I thoroughly confused is a little strong.
    I wasn't referring to you here. You understand that we've got more than one OS on our hands. I was referring to those who don't understand that. As I understand it, you just don't think the differences are worth mentioning.

    Sorry for that.
    Last edited by a5cent; 11-14-2014 at 09:26 AM. Reason: formatting
    10-14-2014 01:40 AM
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