1. PepperdotNet's Avatar
    I have gotten frustrated reading about the many different variants of each phone model and have created a post on uservoice, now it needs votes if you agree.

    This is my concern. I have a Lumia 1020 from AT&T. Coming from an iPhone I was very disappointed to learn that there is no 'Lumia 1020' but instead three different hardware models with seemingly infinite combinations of region and carrier variants, where the carriers have made all sorts of customizations. For example, though the hardware is capable, the AT&T firmware disables the LTE frequencies and tethering used by T-Mobile so even if you unlock the phone it just doesn't work. This has also resulted in the FUBAR that is the Cyan rollout. Apple makes a new release of iOS and the majority have upgraded in days, Cyan has taken months and still nowhere close to done, if ever. Especially if you're a Verizon customer.

    My request to Microsoft is twofold. First, that in future they make one version of each model, one firmware, that they control. For existing Lumia, after we've paid off the subsidy and unlocked the phone, let us install an unbranded firmware on the device.

    Here is the link to uservoice where you can vote: https://windowsphone.uservoice.com/f...-customization
    a5cent likes this.
    10-05-2014 09:49 PM
  2. N_LaRUE's Avatar
    This has been discussed many times on this forum. Part of the issue that MS has is getting carriers to carry the phone. To do so they have to compromise. It's a big issue in the US but not anywhere else in the world. We have exclusives with carriers but they're not custom phones. Which is still an issue.

    I'm pretty sure you'll have a lot of people agreeing with you and I'm quite surprised that there isn't a uservoice on this already, however, it all depends on what kind of pull MS has with the carriers. At this stage, it looks like very little. I'm sure that the carriers wished they did the same with Apple.

    In my view a carrier should have no say in with OS updates. It's like having an internet provider holding back a Windows update in my eyes. However the carriers in the US are very powerful unfortunately.

    So I guess we'll see what the future holds.
    a5cent and xandros9 like this.
    10-06-2014 08:41 AM
  3. PepperdotNet's Avatar
    Yeah, I don't hold out much hope for it happening, but it needed to be there so people can vote for it and let MS know how frustrated we are.

    The thing I totally overlooked when I composed all of it last night was the effect on resale value. When I got AT&T to unlock my old iPhone and then I sold it on eBay I was able to get a really good price for it, because iPhones are by definition unbranded and an unlocked one works on overseas GSM carriers. I won't be able to do that with my Lumia phone, I'll be lucky to get anything at all for it, because who other than an AT&T customer would want an AT&T branded phone that is crippled to work anywhere else even if it's unlocked?

    I agree with your other statement. Imagine the outcry if your home Internet provider was able to dictate what choices of computer you could buy, and then refused to let you download and install the OS updates for it until they had opportunity to embed their custom advertising or whatever in it. Not only that, if you got tired of cable and ordered DSL from the phone company, you'd have to buy a new computer because the old one wouldn't work anymore. Ridiculous.
    a5cent likes this.
    10-06-2014 08:49 AM
  4. PepperdotNet's Avatar
    It's up to 46 votes! Only a few thousand more and maybe somebody would actually pay attention.

    Since I posted this, I have learned a few things. Sometimes carriers have legitimate reasons for modifying the firmware, for example T-Mobile's implementation of WiFi calling. Sometimes the reasons are nefarious, for example AT&T disabling a specific frequency band because T-Mobile uses it. All the more reason that if you've paid for the device and it's no longer under contract and unlocked, there should be no restriction of loading a different carrier's or unbranded firmware.
    11-04-2014 11:13 AM
  5. S640's Avatar
    I have no faith that MS will get this under control but I voted for it since it certainly does suck for users and the WP ecosystem as a whole.
    11-04-2014 11:21 AM
  6. PepperdotNet's Avatar
    73 votes as of today!

    Lumia 535, 532, 640 and 640XL with 3G and with LTE, countless product codes and firmware variants of each, doesn't seem to be letting up at all. My hope is for each model of a flagship to be one device with one firmware that works everywhere on all carriers. Probably not going to happen.
    03-04-2015 02:27 PM
  7. a5cent's Avatar
    ^ Basically, how it works in western Europe.
    I suspect the FCC is the only entity that could force something like this thorough. The carriers will forever resist, and MS has no choice but to bend over.
    BTW: It's a technicality, but carriers don't actually modify firmware. They just say what they want and the OEM does it for them.
    Anyway, I wish the network configuration for every carrier in the world was stored on each phone. You'd then select your carrier, after which all carrier specific apps and configurations, like TM's WiFi calling, would be downloaded OTA. That would completely remove the necessity for carrier specific firmware of any kind.
    03-04-2015 02:59 PM
  8. gMaesterUK's Avatar
    I understand your point, but MS aren't in the position that Apple are in...

    My understanding is that Apple makes a single hardware version and each country/region has a different firmware profile sharing most features (barring network frequencies). Apple can tell a network that it is upgrading the firmware on X date, network must allow this or be informed it can't sell Apple products anymore. Apple are literally blackmailing the networks.

    MS without the market share are forced to abide by network rules & regulations...
    I personally don't like it, but nothing much we or MS can do about it at the moment until MS have the force behind it to stronghold networks...

    G.
    a5cent and Laura Knotek like this.
    03-04-2015 03:12 PM
  9. PepperdotNet's Avatar
    My understanding is that Apple makes a single hardware version and each country/region has a different firmware profile sharing most features (barring network frequencies).
    Not exactly, an iPhone can download carrier-dependent settings, but the actual firmware is exactly one per device model, worldwide. Had Apple come up with the bright idea of having a different firmware for every region, country and carrier, surely they would have been bankrupt by now. And iPhone resale value would be nothing, if it only works in the place where it was sold.
    03-04-2015 03:32 PM
  10. a5cent's Avatar
    Not exactly, an iPhone can download carrier-dependent settings
    How does it download carrier dependent settings, before it knows what network configuration to use? There must already be some minimal configuration on every device.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    03-04-2015 03:42 PM
  11. gMaesterUK's Avatar
    That's more or less what I meant. Just didn't articulate it correctly!

    But ultimately, no network can tell Apple that AT&T (for example) won't allow the phone to be used on Sprint. Whereas AT&T can demand MS integrate this into their firmware, or they don't sell the phone...

    Apple probably do have the best way of doing it, but carriers want all of the control!

    G.
    03-04-2015 03:50 PM
  12. PepperdotNet's Avatar
    How does it download carrier dependent settings, before it knows what network configuration to use? There must already be some minimal configuration on every device.
    Minimal configuration for every carrier is built in the base firmware, the sim card determines which one is used and which carrier-specific settings to download.
    03-13-2015 09:18 PM
  13. a5cent's Avatar
    Minimal configuration for every carrier is built in the base firmware, the sim card determines which one is used and which carrier-specific settings to download.
    Exactly.
    03-13-2015 09:29 PM
  14. fatclue_98's Avatar
    Anyway, I wish the network configuration for every carrier in the world was stored on each phone.
    I had completely forgotten about that feature on WP7. Each OEM had its own version of the "Network Settings" app.
    03-13-2015 09:35 PM
  15. Robinsonmac's Avatar
    Won't .happen with MS market share without spending a ton & I mean a ton of cash to get the same phone on all carriers at the same time. I've said this in a few other posts. They MUST also back that up with a massive ad campaign like nothing we have ever seen for a sustained 6-9 months. Samsung spent there way to be the #1 Android & over all smartphone OEM with a constant barrage of ads. The problem is I don't think Satya think WP is worth spending the amount of cash that will be necessary to gain consumer mindshare which leads to market share.
    03-13-2015 09:56 PM
  16. EspHack's Avatar
    buy unlocked, only WE as consumers can vote with our money to stop this bs

    as someone mentioned, carriers have no say in what kind of machine I use at home with their dsl/cable connection, they have to adapt to standards and that's it, not the other way around
    03-14-2015 02:51 PM

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