06-23-2013 04:24 PM
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  1. AaHaa's Avatar
    Have you not been looking at the comments on the reports on the tech websites - practically every other comment is now asking to remove Kinect and drop the price - Even Xbox360 magazines twitter account has been going on about that all morning - saying its the best option to offer two versions and lower the price to compete with Sony.

    MS have given in once - how long before they take heed of the new round of whining b*tches and give in again and remove the Kinect. 2 weeks? A month? - Can guarantee that's what's next.
    Nah, I don't think they will do this again. Kinect is way too baked-in in the system I think. I'm already surprised they think they have enough time to change the whole DRM-stuff with the few months until november. It's just practically impossible to change things like the Kinect integration at this point.
    06-20-2013 05:49 AM
  2. martinmc78's Avatar
    Nah, I don't think they will do this again. Kinect is way too baked-in in the system I think. I'm already surprised they think they have enough time to change the whole DRM-stuff with the few months until november. It's just practically impossible to change things like the Kinect integration at this point.
    Its perfectly feasible as its just deleting code and stripping the OS down to the game engine - remove all the Kinect features and just push out the box with basic software no TV processing sublayer, no screen snapping, no Skype, no voice commands, no spying camera, no data fed to the nsa. Get rid of the lot charge $249 for it.

    Its what the whining masses want and MS have just shown they are willing to listen to consumer (whining masses) feedback.

    There are plenty of people on this very forum that would be perfectly happy with an xbox 360+
    Courtney S likes this.
    06-20-2013 06:11 AM
  3. lemonsteveo's Avatar
    Nah, I don't think they will do this again. Kinect is way too baked-in in the system I think. I'm already surprised they think they have enough time to change the whole DRM-stuff with the few months until november. It's just practically impossible to change things like the Kinect integration at this point.
    I sincerely hope they don't give in to the fanboys on this aspect. Kinect has to be packed in, end of story.
    06-20-2013 06:22 AM
  4. ProjectBerkeley's Avatar
    This really burns me up. Was looking forward to the family sharing. Now we're stuck in the past.

    I will buy every game in digital format. Gamestop must die.
    06-20-2013 06:34 AM
  5. ag1986's Avatar
    Its perfectly feasible as its just deleting code and stripping the OS down to the game engine - remove all the Kinect features and just push out the box with basic software no TV processing sublayer, no screen snapping, no Skype, no voice commands, no spying camera, no data fed to the nsa. Get rid of the lot charge $249 for it.

    Its what the whining masses want and MS have just shown they are willing to listen to consumer (whining masses) feedback.

    There are plenty of people on this very forum that would be perfectly happy with an xbox 360+
    Look, MS' job is to sell things, not to cater to every whim coming out of you lot (who are the whiners now but not masses though). If the whining masses want it, then it is their duty to their stockholders to make what will sell. I'm just waiting to find out who gets fired for the events of the past few weeks.
    06-20-2013 06:38 AM
  6. martinmc78's Avatar
    Look, MS' job is to sell things, not to cater to every whim coming out of you lot (who are the whiners now but not masses though). If the whining masses want it, then it is their duty to their stockholders to make what will sell. I'm just waiting to find out who gets fired for the events of the past few weeks.
    I was perfectly happy with the way things were - I was just trying to point out they have given in once, what stops them from giving in again? Neither Sony or MS is getting my money this generation now. My consumer feedback is with my wallet and its much happier this morning having the 100 preorder I put down back in it.

    I agree with you on the point of the firing though - somebody needs to go.
    06-20-2013 06:45 AM
  7. Daniel Ratcliffe's Avatar
    What it seems Microsoft failed to do it both explain their position and REALLY listen to people. They took "we want to play offline" as "change it back," rather than "make it better." It's like they only listened to those who were anti-Microsoft regardless, rather than trying to take input from folks such as myself, who wanted to make a workable hybrid system. I mean, I legitimately question if Microsoft is capable of making this situation any worse. I mean, I guess they could say that the switch will mean $70 games or something.
    I'm expecting games to cost like 5000 each now on the Xbox as retaliation for them turning back on this. And boy do I hope that happens and they switch back to the system they had before to get the price back down to 50 each.
    06-20-2013 07:14 AM
  8. NaNoo123's Avatar
    Just to clarify for some people.
    No this doesn't have anything to do with the 300k servers, it doesn't affect their cloud ambitions.
    Games will still be made as before, the fact you could play offline and just checkin was proof of that.
    If games require the cloud, it will just say as part of games requirements, net access required.

    MS did say 'at launch' so they may implement the sharing etc when games are bought digitally afterwards.

    Its a shame that they never actually said that was the plan.
    Then most people on each side would be happy. But now their still getting a backlash.
    Then the only loss is sharing disk digitally, and publishers being able to get some control on disks.

    Gamestop etc saying victory for gamers lol. Well they may get a reprieve but this alone shows the writing is on the wall, they need to change their business.

    If you want it digitally but can't download the size of games, then if you can get access to the disk, you can install it from that and buy it digitally. It wont need to redownload.
    06-20-2013 07:15 AM
  9. HeyCori's Avatar
    I do understand his frustration. After all, other industries have ways to increase revenue after the initial product is released.

    Films and television shows have DVD sales, syndication royalties, and broadcast rights.

    Record labels have concerts, royalties, licensing and radio.

    In comparison, video games basically have jack squat.

    I'm no fan of DRM but there is a problem when a game can sell almost four million copies and the publisher still has to lay off half the staff. I'm not saying that Microsoft had the perfect solution but something's gotta give.
    Musicman247 likes this.
    06-20-2013 07:17 AM
  10. AaHaa's Avatar
    Its perfectly feasible as its just deleting code and stripping the OS down to the game engine - remove all the Kinect features and just push out the box with basic software no TV processing sublayer, no screen snapping, no Skype, no voice commands, no spying camera, no data fed to the nsa. Get rid of the lot charge $249 for it.

    Its what the whining masses want and MS have just shown they are willing to listen to consumer (whining masses) feedback.

    There are plenty of people on this very forum that would be perfectly happy with an xbox 360+

    I really doubt that. With all the whole machine (posters, ads, games in development, games already finished, communication with retailers etc etc etc) already set in motion, they can't make drastic changes. Not anymore. I think they should stick with the price and Kinect. Be a little stubborn Microsoft. Forcing the future isn't that bad.
    06-20-2013 07:23 AM
  11. NaNoo123's Avatar
    MS just needs to heavily push the digital, to make it so most people don't want to buy, trade disks etc.

    The only people that will are the ones who can't download that amount of data.
    And even they would buy digitally if they can get hold of the game, to preinstall.

    They really need to make digital cheap enough... With the other possible benefits it would crush the used game market.
    This could actually be worse for gamestop etc, than how it was before.
    MS gave them a chance, but now the only way to control disks is by making them totally unattractive at all.
    06-20-2013 07:32 AM
  12. LMZR's Avatar
    Fearing the great PS4 already!
    People said there was gonna be a backlash against the PS4, and guess what, it's happened! :)
    06-20-2013 07:33 AM
  13. AaHaa's Avatar
    h6533e4a9.jpeg

    And ofcourse, Sony gets credit. This was to be expected... The internet is dominated by Playstation fanboys
    06-20-2013 07:43 AM
  14. ncxcstud's Avatar
    One of the other off-shoots of their DRM policy (that is now moot) was that the XBOX One, had the potential of being the 'safest' platform to play games on. If someone stole your physical copy of the game - as long as you already installed it on your XBOX One - it wouldn't work for them and you'd still be able to play it. They wouldn't be able to sell it, and I would think wouldn't be able to 'de-authorize' it at a local retailer (depending what sort of credentials you needed to prove that you are the person entitled to de-authorize the game).

    Now, if someone ends up stealing a persons game (which happened to me in college, but not any other time) they'll be without their game, resorting to having to re-purchase the whole thing again.

    I'll be interested to know what the breakdown is between digital purchased and physical disc purchases after this all shakes out - on both platforms. If digital purchases end up being the majority of sales - then the internet whined about nothing...
    06-20-2013 09:01 AM
  15. link68759's Avatar
    MS just needs to heavily push the digital, to make it so most people don't want to buy, trade disks etc.

    The only people that will are the ones who can't download that amount of data.
    And even they would buy digitally if they can get hold of the game, to preinstall.

    They really need to make digital cheap enough... With the other possible benefits it would crush the used game market.
    This could actually be worse for gamestop etc, than how it was before.
    MS gave them a chance, but now the only way to control disks is by making them totally unattractive at all.
    You listed "crushing the used game market" as a benefit?
    Sent from my RM-824_nam_att_101 using Board Express
    06-20-2013 09:10 AM
  16. iBandar's Avatar
    06-20-2013 09:12 AM
  17. martinmc78's Avatar
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Pretty much sums up how im feeling at the moment
    06-20-2013 09:17 AM
  18. vertigoOne's Avatar
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    And ofcourse, Sony gets credit. This was to be expected... The internet is dominated by Playstation fanboys
    They had to find something to do with their time while the Playstation Network was down for that long period of time after the hack. Some of them scrambled to the 360, the rest formed into an internet megazord of nerd rage.

    I really don't care what happens from this, if it means the Xbox One will be more successful then I am fine with it, and if it blows up in Microsoft's (Don Mattrick's) face then even better since it will be a lesson learned to maintain fortitude.
    Musicman247 likes this.
    06-20-2013 09:18 AM
  19. Coreldan's Avatar
    I'm bummed about this. None of the DRM stuff were an issue to me. While I'm glad in a way that those who want to can sell/trade games etc, but the fact that this can be done pretty much ruined all the good things the DRM brought with them (or more so the good things that brought the DRM with them).

    I would've personally valued being able to play all games without disc (will likely go largely for digital downloads, short from some used games I guess) and more importantly the 10 person family share.

    It's a shame that the whiners slow down evolution in technology.. I do admit that the restrictions were quite severe for some (even if not for me), but the possibilities they brought with them were IMO greater than what we get now. Either way, I would've got X1 before and I would still get the X1.. in fact.. now there's even less reason to go PS4 anymore except if you the 100 usd makes or breaks your budget, but what I get with the extra 100usd is still a lot more than the PS4 IMO.
    06-20-2013 09:29 AM
  20. HeyCori's Avatar
    The rage from MS removing DRM is almost equal to them adding DRM.

    Microsoft News | A Vocal Minority Of Idiots (& Journalists) Ruin Innovations On The Xbox One
    Musicman247 likes this.
    06-20-2013 09:31 AM
  21. Coreldan's Avatar
    Just maybe somewhere down the line they can re-implement some of this stuff at least for digital games.. I've been trying to think how to make it an option for disc based games too (like upon first installation a poll if you want the "DRM version" or "DRM free), but I can't come up with any solution that wouldn't be possible to exploit on consoles not connected to the internet. And I guess about half of the rage was that 24h-check-in, which was that made the cool stuff possible.

    Any specific reason why digital games still couldnt be cheaper, have the family share option, etc? I know at this time they likely won't be, but here's to hoping..
    06-20-2013 09:36 AM
  22. DavidinCT's Avatar
    Nah, I don't think they will do this again. Kinect is way too baked-in in the system I think. I'm already surprised they think they have enough time to change the whole DRM-stuff with the few months until november. It's just practically impossible to change things like the Kinect integration at this point.
    Exactly, No matter how much people DONT want the Kinect, the system will be coming with it. Period. Why ? Microsoft has said, the problem with the lack of great kinect games on the xbox 360 was because it was an optional device. Now that everyone will have one, the devs can do better things with it, and now that it's almost 100% accurate (not like v1 was), it might be actually enjoyable this round.

    Also the fact, that Microsoft said about changing DRM, when you get the X1 you will need to take a update to change over, this means, they are already making the X1, so it's fully in production. Doing any hardware change at this point would cost too much money and guess who will pay for it ?
    06-20-2013 09:37 AM
  23. ncxcstud's Avatar
    Another thing I was thinking about -

    All the doom, gloom and fear that people were saying regarding this that when the XBOX One is no more (in 10+ years mind you) when MS 'shut off' the servers then no one would have their games. People feared that and was one of the more vocal negatives about the DRM stuff that MS was implementing.

    Even though folks like Major Nelson already said that 1) - We haven't even begun this generation, we're not focusing on the 'end' of it already. 2) They aren't going to do that to gamers.

    So, by 'patching it in' now, they've shown us that they could always 'turn off' the restrictions if they wanted to. Thus quelling the future fears and concerns.

    But, of course people didn't think they'd do it 10 years from now (let alone 5 months before the system debuts). But, it shows that they are able to do that
    06-20-2013 09:52 AM
  24. HeyCori's Avatar
    I also think Microsoft's attempt to go "always on" exposed how inadequate online connectivity is throughout the world. Several parts of rural America doesn't have access to reliable, broadband internet. ISPs like Comcast, AT&T, etc are dragging their feet when it comes to improving their services. In an age of HD downloads and streaming, Comcast is still charging $40 for 3Mbps. A basic 4G smartphone is faster than basic landline internet. GameFly can't support consoles unless the console is always on. And nothing was more telling than the fact that Microsoft had to limit which countries the Xbox One would launch in. Stores around the world can't handle an online only console because they can't guarantee that their customers will have reliable internet or offer trade-ins. Nope, the world is not ready for an always connected video game console.

    Microsoft will have to spend the next 8-10 years prepping the world for a digital console. Then maybe the next Xbox can go online only.
    06-20-2013 09:56 AM
  25. martinmc78's Avatar
    I also think Microsoft's attempt to go "always on" exposed how inadequate online connectivity is throughout the world. Several parts of rural America doesn't have access to reliable, broadband internet. ISPs like Comcast, AT&T, etc are dragging their feet when it comes to improving their services. In an age of HD downloads and streaming, Comcast is still charging $40 for 3Mbps. A basic 4G smartphone is faster than basic landline internet. GameFly can't support consoles unless the console is always on. And nothing was more telling than the fact that Microsoft had to limit which countries the Xbox One would launch in. Stores around the world can't handle an online only console because they can't guarantee that their customers will have reliable internet or offer trade-ins. Nope, the world is not ready for an always connected video game console.

    Microsoft will have to spend the next 8-10 years prepping the world for a digital console. Then maybe the next Xbox can go online only.
    If that were the case why not launch in Asia first - South Korea has the best digital infrastructure on the planet - Everyone has a download speed of at least 100mb/s. Japan isn't too far behind that and yet they are left hanging?
    06-20-2013 10:02 AM
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