02-03-2014 09:30 AM
66 123
tools
  1. Bahamen's Avatar
    Literally anyone can make an android device, anyone. It's free on the GitHub. The code is there for the world to see. You can literally change every line of code to your liking. Every single line.

    But, please continue with your fantasy.
    Usually the ones with fantasy are those Android fans who fantasized Google as some sort of corporate Robin Hood giving away free services to the poor. Sorry, but Google serves only its shareholders and it is just as calculating and brutal as any corporation out there. It's only source of income is pushing ads and data mining. Once this stops, that's when that business model breaks down. Like a5cent said, opting out on Android is equivalent to piracy. Nothing particularly wrong with this form of business model if it is handled transparently and with informed consent, but it does seem that most users are unaware of it. Just think about it - if one day somebody walks in and volunteers to become your personal assistant free of charge, with full access to your personal information - you would be highly suspicious won't you? But in the digital world of freeware most people will happily and unsuspectingly agree to it.
    Nogitsune Micah likes this.
    01-25-2014 07:43 AM
  2. CrockettGTO's Avatar
    Good thread, up until it started turning....
    etad putta and aximtreo like this.
    01-25-2014 07:59 AM
  3. WPus3r's Avatar
    I suspect you are opaquely referring to one of my earlier posts, in which case you failed to understand it. My point was that no matter what apps/services you use from an Android device, you are still sending data home to Google. That is an integral part of the OS, and that is what is used to power Google's main "service". There is nothing controversial or Fox-News-Like in that statement. It's just fact.

    I also stated that Microsoft's services are available on Android, as did you, and pretty much everyone else in this thread.
    No offense a5cent,but could you please say what data is being sent over to Google without the consent of the user? AFAIK, when features are implemented as an opt-out/opt-in, the user has to take responsibility for what they do .. I would like see your statements like " data collection being an integral part of the OS " backed up by some sort of proof, but you don`t seem to be producing any? Sorry, but I am sick of seeing this everywhere about here.
    01-25-2014 08:58 AM
  4. WPus3r's Avatar
    . Nothing particularly wrong with this form of business model if it is handled transparently and with informed consent, but it does seem that most users are unaware of it.
    Mind enlightening us with an example where they are stealing data without the consent of the user? If people are unaware of it, its plainly being ignorant, little else.
    After reading the OP`s comment I wonder if the forums need to renamed Microsoft Fan Forums..lol
    01-25-2014 09:16 AM
  5. Bahamen's Avatar
    Mind enlightening us with an example where they are stealing data without the consent of the user? If people are unaware of it, its plainly being ignorant, little else.
    You are pretty sloppy with your reading, aren't you? Nobody is saying that somebody at Google should be going to jail for stealing data. Of course there are multi-page fine prints that you have to click "I Agree" at the bottom. I'm pretty darn sure you actually read every single word on it, and everyone else also should (/s). So no, nobody is going to prison. But considering the fact that many users are unaware of what Google does with your data, in your words "being ignorant", I'd say it is quite important to educate them. That's what MSFT is doing with their campaigns. That's what the commenters here at WPC are doing. If you are fully aware and consent to giving away your private info for commercial use, good for you and we don't have any issue with that. So please, read properly, do not put words ("steal data") etc into people's mouth.

    No offense a5cent,but could you please say what data is being sent over to Google without the consent of the user? AFAIK, when features are implemented as an opt-out/opt-in, the user has to take responsibility for what they do .. I would like see your statements like " data collection being an integral part of the OS " backed up by some sort of proof, but you don`t seem to be producing any? Sorry, but I am sick of seeing this everywhere about here.
    Again, PLEASE read carefully before accusing someone of making statements without proof. He DID repeatedly offered to provide the proof to FinancialP but the offer was not taken up. You are really fond of firing blindly, aren't you?
    01-25-2014 10:16 AM
  6. worldspy99's Avatar
    Proof of what? It'll be for your entertainment only.

    Forks exist on Android because it is open source. The user or builder can control exactly what Android does. You don't have to sign in to a google account on android. You don't have to opt in to anything. You can omit everything google.
    Then please provide links to all of the MS apps which can be sideloaded without having a google account and the Play Store.
    01-25-2014 01:50 PM
  7. FinancialP's Avatar
    Then please provide links to all of the MS apps which can be sideloaded without having a google account and the Play Store.
    Huh? Bing it/google it? You're on the internet, just bing it and grab the apks.
    01-25-2014 01:52 PM
  8. worldspy99's Avatar
    Some great responses, thanks guys.
    Nicely written post as well shovelhead84, very informative :)

    The 1520 is very appealing, although it does seem to be just a larger more powerful version of what I have now. I was looking for something a bit more special with the hardware, but it may be that a lot of the Note's features are gimmicky.

    So I think I will be sticking with the Microsoft and Windows ecosystem, and if I were to upgrade now it would be to the 1520. I can wait and see what 8.1 brings first though and any new hardware this year.
    Actually I have played with my friend's Note 3 and most of the stuff is plain gimmick. He uses his phone to do very minimal stuff, beyond watching videos on the large screen and occasional note taking with the stylus he couldn't describe the benefits over is iPhone 5. I think it is not what smartphone you have but how much use you get out of it. And my opinion of usage is how much you can get your smartphone to do the work without logging into your PC or tablet, that is the measure of a good smartphone.
    01-25-2014 01:54 PM
  9. aximtreo's Avatar
    Good thread, up until it started turning....


    I filled out the WPCentral questionnaire yesterday and the final question was? In your opinion, what can we do to make the Forum section better? My answer was to monitor more closely the continuous "*******" contest some of the members have. Here is a prime example of what I was speaking to.
    CrockettGTO and sahib lopez like this.
    01-25-2014 02:52 PM
  10. worldspy99's Avatar
    Huh? Bing it/google it? You're on the internet, just bing it and grab the apks.
    And then what, constantly search for updated APKs? Is that something that is efficient?
    01-25-2014 06:13 PM
  11. WPus3r's Avatar
    You are pretty sloppy with your reading, aren't you? Nobody is saying that somebody at Google should be going to jail for stealing data. Of course there are multi-page fine prints that you have to click "I Agree" at the bottom. I'm pretty darn sure you actually read every single word on it, and everyone else also should (/s). So no, nobody is going to prison. But considering the fact that many users are unaware of what Google does with your data, in your words "being ignorant", I'd say it is quite important to educate them. That's what MSFT is doing with their campaigns. That's what the commenters here at WPC are doing. If you are fully aware and consent to giving away your private info for commercial use, good for you and we don't have any issue with that. So please, read properly, do not put words ("steal data") etc into people's mouth.



    Again, PLEASE read carefully before accusing someone of making statements without proof. He DID repeatedly offered to provide the proof to FinancialP but the offer was not taken up. You are really fond of firing blindly, aren't you?
    Yep , people like you definitely should, the paranoids. I can`t help but laugh at the way Google is being casted as a totally evil company when all they do is give Ads based on the user`s interests. Yeah ,I didn`t really read through all those arguments with the OP, FinancialP .But I do know what exactly he is referring to and bringing that up straight would have made his argument pointless, so he chose to again scare the other person, like u and some people at MSFT. People only laugh off at those considering how miserable the MSFT folks might be, after seeing the Scroogled ads and last I checked, those haven`t helped the sales of the Windows phones/tablets.
    FinancialP likes this.
    01-25-2014 08:45 PM
  12. WPus3r's Avatar
    And then what, constantly search for updated APKs? Is that something that is efficient?
    Install another app store, Amazon or something else, of course you need to do that if you are trying to keep away from all things Google. You will get your updates. If you really have to sideload ,install appbrain and sync the apps. You`ll get your updates.
    FinancialP likes this.
    01-25-2014 09:34 PM
  13. Jed Cutler's Avatar
    I have two phones. The L1520 and Nexus 5. For me personally, I think I have best of both worlds. My question is, I uninstalled all google services from my phone although I am still on stock ROM. Would anyone know if Google still can mine data from me?
    01-25-2014 09:51 PM
  14. WPus3r's Avatar
    I have two phones. The L1520 and Nexus 5. For me personally, I think I have best of both worlds. My question is, I uninstalled all google services from my phone although I am still on stock ROM. Would anyone know if Google still can mine data from me?
    Nope provided you haven`t used a Google account in your phone, have as u said uninstalled everything Google and have opted out of everything in settings, nobody mines anything
    FinancialP and Jed Cutler like this.
    01-25-2014 10:32 PM
  15. Jed Cutler's Avatar
    Nope provided you haven`t used a Google account in your phone, have as u said uninstalled everything Google and have opted out of everything in settings, nobody mines anything
    Ok cool! Thanks.
    01-25-2014 10:41 PM
  16. PureView's Avatar
    If you like Note 3, then get Note 3. No need to ask around here because all you'll get are paranoid responses about Google stealing your wife and kids. Go to YouTube, watch video reviews. Go to credible sites and read reviews; I suggest AnandTech or AndroidCentral. If you like the device, get it. It's a phone, you shouldn't feel 'bad' about purchasing it. If it fits your needs, then that's all that matters.
    WPus3r likes this.
    01-26-2014 04:22 AM
  17. taymur's Avatar
    Most of the people I know either don't use the stylus, or got bored of it!

    I wonder if Samsung ever generated data on how many really use the stylus, its just a marketing gimmick, IMO.
    01-26-2014 07:15 AM
  18. Nogitsune Micah's Avatar
    This place is like Fox News. Only the information they want you to have is provided.

    To simply answer your question. No, you don't have to use any of Google services to use the phone. You can just grab Microsoft apps and use them as you like.
    Um unless Android has changed since i last used it(August 2013)...you do need a Gmail account in order to access the playstore...and if you wish to leave reviews on apps, you now are required to use google+ to do so....so yes, actually you DO have to use google services in some shape and form in order to use Android...unless you get a forked version like a kindle or something where it completely bypasses all of Google services.
    01-26-2014 07:15 AM
  19. Nogitsune Micah's Avatar
    Most of the people I know either don't use the stylus, or got bored of it!

    I wonder if Samsung ever generated data on how many really use the stylus, its just a marketing gimmick, IMO.
    Same here. When i got my Surface Pro, i was like "Ooh cool a stylus...Played with it all of 10-15 mins...flashforward 2 weeks later, no clue where that stylus even is now lmfao. I got bored quite easily and didn't use it.
    01-26-2014 07:19 AM
  20. WPus3r's Avatar
    unless you get a forked version like a kindle or something where it completely bypasses all of Google services.
    not necessary at all
    01-26-2014 07:41 AM
  21. PureView's Avatar
    Um unless Android has changed since i last used it(August 2013)...you do need a Gmail account in order to access the playstore...and if you wish to leave reviews on apps, you now are required to use google+ to do so....so yes, actually you DO have to use google services in some shape and form in order to use Android...unless you get a forked version like a kindle or something where it completely bypasses all of Google services.
    You need a Gmail account for Android, Outlook for Windows Phone and an Apple ID for iOS. What's the big deal in having a Google account to download apps?
    01-26-2014 08:56 AM
  22. Bahamen's Avatar
    You need a Gmail account for Android, Outlook for Windows Phone and an Apple ID for iOS. What's the big deal in having a Google account to download apps?
    You would agree that Google has been far more aggressive in monetizing your personal information compared to Microsoft and Apple? Actually, not signing into Outlook on Windows Phone doesn't hurt Microsoft - its already made its money in a proper sales & purchase transaction when you buy the phone. It even makes some money from Android devices thanks to licensing of its intellectual assets. In other words, good old making products/services and R&D. Google's business model is giving you free service and getting paid from other parties. Conflict of interest, and I think they would place their paymasters interest above yours. Stopping the flow of your personal information to Google is like starving the beast. So yes, there is a difference.
    01-26-2014 09:56 AM
  23. Bahamen's Avatar
    Go to credible sites and read reviews; I suggest ... AndroidCentral.
    LMFAO... that's got to be the joke of the day...
    FinancialP likes this.
    01-26-2014 09:58 AM
  24. FinancialP's Avatar
    Um unless Android has changed since i last used it(August 2013)...you do need a Gmail account in order to access the playstore...and if you wish to leave reviews on apps, you now are required to use google+ to do so....so yes, actually you DO have to use google services in some shape and form in order to use Android...unless you get a forked version like a kindle or something where it completely bypasses all of Google services.
    The user wanted to avoid google services and just use android. So no, the user wouldn't be doing any of that. You don't need anything to just use android.
    01-26-2014 10:06 AM
  25. CrockettGTO's Avatar
    Unless you want to download and/install any apps. Android requires a Google Play account. Not unlike any other. Microsoft and Apple are all the same when it comes to this aspect. Folks are just becoming more and more leery of Google's intrusive practices.
    01-26-2014 11:28 AM
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