06-05-2017 09:35 AM
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  1. Markeyse Jamar Mundy's Avatar
    I wonder it the user is downloading software illegally? That is one reason that programs can crash a lot, and there is a handful of people that download software illegally, and is having issues because the code is changed in order to get past the authentication phase of the app.
    04-19-2017 01:41 PM
  2. dk21's Avatar
    This may be unpopular, but after returning four, yes four defective Windows computers, I bought a Mac and haven't looked back. Full disclosure, though, I'm fairly OS agnostic and was already quite familiar with Mac OS. Why not switch? You'll get quality hardware that also has the flexibility to run Windows if you want.

    Signed,
    A past Microsoft fan
    04-19-2017 03:00 PM
  3. molla101's Avatar
    I've always been a Windows guy but I'm so fed up with my Surface Book and Microsoft I don't even know what else to do. I need my computer to do audio work at home and for weeks now I've been plagued with Surface Book issues one after another. I do music production and my SB kept crashing every single time any notification would come in. It would crash my audio drivers. It would crash my audio software. Just left and right crashes for no reason. I think I must've reset my computer 10 times with no results so I contacted Microsoft and they sent me a refurbished SB. The refurbished one never even booted up. I had to send it back and wait for them to process the return to get them to send a second replacement. They sent another replacement. It's been a week and haven't even fully set this new one up with my software and it's having ridiculous issues. The shutdown option in Windows suddenly just stopped working. It takes 5 minutes for it to boot. It takes like 30 minutes for it to reset and usually it BSOD with a power failure before it finally shuts down. The keyboard and touch pad completely stop working on it and occasionally come back on but only after about 20 minutes or so after the computer has been running. I reset it already twice and the power issue still persists. I'm tired of contacting Microsoft only to be sent broken refurbished SB's. I feel like Microsoft is doing everything in It's power to push me over to Apple. What should I do?
    I have the same issue. Even after one replecment, the unit is still faulty, noisy, freezes
    04-19-2017 06:25 PM
  4. ButtersB's Avatar
    Well, it's definitely not a Windows issue. It's a hardware issue. I would first test to see if the drivers of your I/O interfaces are incompatible with something.

    I used to record/mix on a Mac PowerPC, but haven't looked back since I started building my own mid-level PC desktops. I've also recorded on $99 Walmart Nextbooks with no problem (with Reaper). To me the PC leaves you so many more (and cheaper) hardware, DAW, and plugin options. And I have all kinds of other programs running in the background while I'm running over a hundred tracks and dozens of plugins. No hiccups.
    04-19-2017 09:29 PM
  5. Christopher Lindsay's Avatar
    I wonder it the user is downloading software illegally? That is one reason that programs can crash a lot, and there is a handful of people that download software illegally, and is having issues because the code is changed in order to get past the authentication phase of the app.
    I absolutely do not use illegal software.
    04-19-2017 10:22 PM
  6. Christopher Lindsay's Avatar
    This is really odd, as I just did an EP project on my base-level Surface Book and had no issues at all. I used ASIO drivers, shut off WiFi during recording and editing, and used Reaper with 40 - 50 plugins on a 16 track project with no issues at all. Never a crash, no audio issues...nothing. What DAW are you using? Which audio drivers? Plugins? Do you turn off your WiFi while working? What buffer rate are you working with?
    I use either my default interface's drivers or the Steinbergs generic audio driver. I do not turn off my wifi and buffer rate I use varies based off of what I am doing. As for what plugins and DAWs I use. I own more than I have time to list but here's a portion of the things I own (I do not install everything on this list. As an example I own Bitwig 8 track because it came free with my Roli Rise but I do not use it. My DAW of choice is Cubase Pro 9)...
    IMAGE-LINE
    FL Studio Signature Bundle
    Juice Pack (VSTi)
    Edison WAV editor (VSTi)

    IZOTOPE
    Insight (Educational)
    Ozone 6 (Educational)
    DDLY Dynamic Delay
    Vinyl
    Neutrino
    Music Production Bundle 2
    Trash Expansion - Classic Textures
    Trash Expansion - Edge

    KV331 AUDIO
    SynthMaster (FACTORY)

    ADAM SZABO
    JP6K

    NATIVE INSTRUMENT
    Komplete 10

    ARTURIA
    V Collection 5

    KORG
    M1 Le
    KLC M1
    KLC MS-20
    KLC POLYSIX
    KLC MONOPOLY
    KLC WAVESTATION
    KLC MDE-X
    KLC LEGACYCELL

    TONE2
    Nemesis
    Gladiator
    Saurus
    Electra 2

    KLANGHELM
    DC1A2
    DC8C2
    MJUCjr
    IVGI

    ACON DIGITAL
    Equalize
    Multiply

    CAKEWALK
    Rapture Pro

    STEINBERG
    Cubase 9
    Groove Agent 4
    Steinberg Halion 6

    ABLETON
    Live Lite

    AIR
    Xpand!2

    BOME
    Midi Translator Classic

    UHE
    Satin

    VENGEANCE SOUND
    Tapestop
    Glitchb*tch

    FXPANSION
    Strobe2

    BITWIG
    8-Track
    04-19-2017 10:28 PM
  7. Christopher Lindsay's Avatar
    Just to understand from a technical standpoint.
    Do you use an external soundcard? Could it be a third party driver problem?
    Did you do a full reset, via the defender security center?
    Are you running latest version of Windows?
    What settings do you have on 'non default' settings?
    Did you do a clean boot to isolate the problem?
    Thanks, I care for my SB and audio very much too, so happy to help resolve this!
    I do have an external soundcard. My current SB issues occured without doing anything at all to in regards to the sound card. I bought it home, and let it update and that is all. I never even got to install my software or hardware into it. I updated from whatever came with it to the creators update and that is all. Yes I did clean boots and completely reset it. Both Microsoft support and I troubleshot it with no luck getting it from disconnecting and reconnecting.
    04-19-2017 10:33 PM
  8. Christopher Lindsay's Avatar
    I love my MS devices as well - including my Surface Pro.

    However, I also record, mix, and master music. There is nothing that MS, or any other PC manufacturer for that matter, offers that can compete with the stability and ease of use of a Mac. I won't go into detail here but I'll just say that, strictly from an audio production standpoint, it's night and day. It's a generational leap in terms of ease and usability.

    In 2007, I switched to an iMac strictly for music production. We have multiple PC devices I try to record on and it's just cumbersome and really ruins the creative aspect for me - there are too many barriers and annoyances. And this isn't coming from someone who just dabbles with Windows.

    Again, I love my Surface but I wouldn't even think of using a PC for music production anymore.
    I've never looked at a Mac before but I will admit the cool thing about macs is if I hated it I could always run windows on it anyway lol.
    04-19-2017 10:35 PM
  9. Christopher Lindsay's Avatar
    Thanks everyone for the replies. Jenn has taken time out to help me get leg up on my Surface Book woes.
    Last edited by Christopher Lindsay; 04-20-2017 at 08:06 AM.
    Matt Manahan likes this.
    04-19-2017 10:36 PM
  10. hopmedic's Avatar
    I would NEVER purchase a refurbished unit, nor will I accept one in exchange for a defective unit.
    Except that in the case of a defective unit, you do not have a choice. The terms and conditions of the warranty are a legally binding document, and the T&C states (in section 3, subsection b):
    If Microsoft or the retailer determines that the Microsoft Hardware or Accessory malfunctioned due to a defect in materials or workmanship during the Warranty Period under Normal Use Conditions, Microsoft or the retailer will (at its option) repair or replace it, or refund the purchase price to You. Repair may use new or refurbished parts. Replacement may be with a new or refurbished unit.
    If the user has the Microsoft Complete extended warranty, here is the applicable portion of the contract:
    (Under Definitions)
    13. “Repair”: the actions We take to mend, remedy, or restore Your Product to a sound functioning state following a covered Breakdown. Parts used to Repair the Product may be new, used, refurbished or non-original manufacturer parts that perform to the factory specifications of the original Product.
    (under SURFACE PLANS / NOTICE - ABOUT REPLACEMENTS UNDER ANY "SURFACE PLAN")
    WE RESERVE THE RIGHT TO REPLACE A DEFECTIVE PRODUCT WITH A NEW, REBUILT OR REFURBISHED ITEM OF EQUAL OR SIMILAR FEATURES AND FUNCTIONALITY, WHICH MAY NOT BE THE SAME MODEL OR COLOR AS THE PREVIOUS COVERED PRODUCT.
    I have worked in the insurance industry, specifically in the area of extended warranties for computers and related electronic equipment (peripherals, cameras, etc.), and the document is binding. Trust me, I know what I'm talking about.

    The key takeaway from this should be "Always read your contract."

    Reference:
    Microsoft Surface Warranty Documents
    04-19-2017 11:24 PM
  11. excalibur1814's Avatar
    I'm typing this on a perfectly working Surface Book, which is probably a refurb, as I purchased it as a broken item and paid for a fix. It's never crashed. Not once. The moment I opened the box I did the usual setup stuff then refreshed Windows 10. Updated, tweaked, no issues at all.

    Even if you move to HP, Dell, or Apple, the machine lottery is in play. Check out the apple forums for issues on that side (That's if the admins haven't erased them).


    It matters not if you're on Windows, or oSX, when creating music, as you're using applications so your choice should be based on that. There is a magical distortion field, when it comes to Apple, that makes me laugh. A lot of people, who've moved across, often compare a £350 HP to an expensive mac. We use windows all day, every single day, so I know that there can be issues but, for the most part, Windows is fine. So are macs. Neither afford the owner anything really special over the other. To think otherwise is a 'personal' opinion.

    Options:
    -Refresh Windows, update until no updates remain. Done (You've done this.)
    -If that doesn't work then return for a replacement. (Time to return it)
    -If you still have no joy you can at least SELL as brand new.


    P.s. To repeat... There's nothing overly special about macs. They're not cool. Try not to be suckered by marketing.
    04-20-2017 02:54 AM
  12. Christopher Lindsay's Avatar
    I'm typing this on a perfectly working Surface Book, which is probably a refurb, as I purchased it as a broken item and paid for a fix. It's never crashed. Not once. The moment I opened the box I did the usual setup stuff then refreshed Windows 10. Updated, tweaked, no issues at all.

    Even if you move to HP, Dell, or Apple, the machine lottery is in play. Check out the apple forums for issues on that side (That's if the admins haven't erased them).


    It matters not if you're on Windows, or oSX, when creating music, as you're using applications so your choice should be based on that. There is a magical distortion field, when it comes to Apple, that makes me laugh. A lot of people, who've moved across, often compare a £350 HP to an expensive mac. We use windows all day, every single day, so I know that there can be issues but, for the most part, Windows is fine. So are macs. Neither afford the owner anything really special over the other. To think otherwise is a 'personal' opinion.

    Options:
    -Refresh Windows, update until no updates remain. Done (You've done this.)
    -If that doesn't work then return for a replacement. (Time to return it)
    -If you still have no joy you can at least SELL as brand new.


    P.s. To repeat... There's nothing overly special about macs. They're not cool. Try not to be suckered by marketing.
    It's not that I believe Macs have some sort of magical components or anything like that. I only considered Macs because I'm not getting things done and I need current reliability.

    Sent from mTalk
    meoverhere1 likes this.
    04-20-2017 08:01 AM
  13. Christopher Lindsay's Avatar
    If I didn't mention before. My Surface Book is the i7, 512GB SSD, 16GB RAM, with dGPU version, which I understand isn't there most popular configuration due to it's pricing and tier.

    Sent from mTalk
    04-20-2017 08:03 AM
  14. joaoalbuquerque's Avatar
    I've always been a Windows guy but I'm so fed up with my Surface Book and Microsoft I don't even know what else to do. I need my computer to do audio work at home and for weeks now I've been plagued with Surface Book issues one after another. I do music production and my SB kept crashing every single time any notification would come in. It would crash my audio drivers. It would crash my audio software. Just left and right crashes for no reason. I think I must've reset my computer 10 times with no results so I contacted Microsoft and they sent me a refurbished SB. The refurbished one never even booted up. I had to send it back and wait for them to process the return to get them to send a second replacement. They sent another replacement. It's been a week and haven't even fully set this new one up with my software and it's having ridiculous issues. The shutdown option in Windows suddenly just stopped working. It takes 5 minutes for it to boot. It takes like 30 minutes for it to reset and usually it BSOD with a power failure before it finally shuts down. The keyboard and touch pad completely stop working on it and occasionally come back on but only after about 20 minutes or so after the computer has been running. I reset it already twice and the power issue still persists. I'm tired of contacting Microsoft only to be sent broken refurbished SB's. I feel like Microsoft is doing everything in It's power to push me over to Apple. What should I do?
    If you live in Europe and, because that seems, somehow, an intermittent issue, the tech support does nothing. You send it and they return it with a "No Issue Found" on the report like they do with Lumia Smartphones. I guess you are not in Europe so, I think you have more luck than us, at least Microsoft is doing something like replacing your device. If after those replacements your problem persists, move to Apple and make sure they know about it. If you do work with audio, Apple is the best choice. I'm still a Microsoft guy, but I have to admit that Microsoft's Tech Support is the worst ever here in Europe.

    BTW, have you checked that issue with Sound Blaster's guys?
    04-20-2017 03:43 PM
  15. meoverhere1's Avatar
    joaoalbuquerque, I'm in Europe (UK) and return my Surface Pro 4 to Germany under the standard warranty - I'm just awaiting the return of my fifth device so have a fair bit of unwanted experience on this side of things! (separate story, see further up the thread).

    What has been the problem you've sent your device back for?

    As much as I am furious and frustrated about my experience with the device, and the QA on the refurb devices I've been sent... the actual replacement process has been quite easy in my experience so far - after talking to MS Support online and doing any requested trouble shooting, I drop it off at the local UPS depot, and usually within 5 working days of that I have a different refurb device delivered, no further questions asked.

    I've also been offered advanced replacement (they send me a refurb device and then I return the existing device) on at least one occasion, although didn't take up the offer.

    [Microsoft - if your reading, these positive comments do not mean I am a happy customer - it means thanks to the convenience of a process I should never have to experience, my anger levels haven't gone super sonic, but be assured they will if device five does not meet my expectations!]

    Here in the Europe the process seems to be outsourced to a company called iQOR.
    04-20-2017 04:07 PM
  16. garak0410's Avatar
    Sorry to hear this. My main problems with my Surface Book have been the "hot bag" issues where it won't sleep and I reach for it in my laptop bag and it is either hot from running or a drained battery. With the Creators Update, Windows Hello is OFF THE CHARTS when logging in but often, the screen wont come back on unless I detach screen and reattach.

    I've considered selling mine for an Alienware but hard to let go of this since it is indeed a very nice machine.
    04-20-2017 04:15 PM
  17. nt1n's Avatar
    While I don't do music work, I do use my laptop a lot for university research and data-heavy work. Last year I switched from an HP Elitebook to a Surface Book. I have mixed feelings. The Surface Book is great as a 2-in-1. But Microsoft's hardware and drivers are somewhat unreliable. The Surface Book occasionally bugs up forcing me to perform a restart (I'd say 1-2 times a month), vs my EliteBook which only crapped out 2-3 times a year. The only reason I'm sticking with the Surface Book is for the detachable screen. If I wanted a more reliable device, I would recommend you go with laptops designed for business, which are a lot more reliable (both hardware and drivers) than consumer-grade laptops. So stuff like HP EliteBooks, Dell Latitude, Lenovo Thinkpads.
    04-20-2017 04:31 PM
  18. garak0410's Avatar
    While I don't do music work, I do use my laptop a lot for university research and data-heavy work. Last year I switched from an HP Elitebook to a Surface Book. I have mixed feelings. The Surface Book is great as a 2-in-1. But Microsoft's hardware and drivers are somewhat unreliable. The Surface Book occasionally bugs up forcing me to perform a restart (I'd say 1-2 times a month), vs my EliteBook which only crapped out 2-3 times a year. The only reason I'm sticking with the Surface Book is for the detachable screen. If I wanted a more reliable device, I would recommend you go with laptops designed for business, which are a lot more reliable (both hardware and drivers) than consumer-grade laptops. So stuff like HP EliteBooks, Dell Latitude, Lenovo Thinkpads.
    I love the look, feel and idea of my Surface Book. Sadly, I am getting frustrated (as mentioned above) with the sleep problems lately. The resale value isn't too bad and thought about selling mine for one of the new Alienware laptops.
    04-21-2017 09:17 AM
  19. Tim Stone's Avatar
    Trust me, I know what I'm talking about.
    I'm sure you do, and of course your references are all correct. Yes, I do read the contracts. Two days ago, after having my Surface Book i5 256GB go crazy with the Creator's update, I took it back to my point of purchase. The problems were all too familiar to them, and we had a very pleasant chat. In essence, I was given multiple options, and all were new equipment. I ended up adding to my credit ( purchase price ) to transfer to a Surface Pro 4 i7/16GB/512GB. I could have exchanged for a current release Book, or made other choices.

    To me, it is all about attitude. I only purchase from that store, and they have always been very supportive. As the sign on the mall entry states, it's much easier to smile than frown, and I carry that attitude into the store whenever I enter it. The staff changes, but they are always wonderful, well informed, and have heard it all. They know the problems which can exist with the equipment, and willingly work with me if an issue exists. However, with most of my purchases, no problems ever come up.

    So, your point is it's "at their option". Well, approaching them with a smile, precise facts, and a willingness to listen gives them reason to exercise an option in our best interest. It also helps to be there face to face with the device in hand.
    meoverhere1 and rdubmu like this.
    04-21-2017 10:32 AM
  20. hopmedic's Avatar
    To me, it is all about attitude. I only purchase from that store, and they have always been very supportive. As the sign on the mall entry states, it's much easier to smile than frown, and I carry that attitude into the store whenever I enter it. The staff changes, but they are always wonderful, well informed, and have heard it all. They know the problems which can exist with the equipment, and willingly work with me if an issue exists. However, with most of my purchases, no problems ever come up.

    So, your point is it's "at their option". Well, approaching them with a smile, precise facts, and a willingness to listen gives them reason to exercise an option in our best interest. It also helps to be there face to face with the device in hand.
    I completely get it. I took a SP3 that had been replaced four times, that I'd purchased on launch day, into the Atlanta store, added a handful of money to it (got full credit for purchase price of SP3 and keyboard), and walked out with an i7/16GB/1TB Surface Book with Performance Base. You talk nice to them, they talk nice to you. But still, it is at their option.
    04-21-2017 01:52 PM
  21. Christopher Lindsay's Avatar
    I completely get it. I took a SP3 that had been replaced four times, that I'd purchased on launch day, into the Atlanta store, added a handful of money to it (got full credit for purchase price of SP3 and keyboard), and walked out with an i7/16GB/1TB Surface Book with Performance Base. You talk nice to them, they talk nice to you. But still, it is at their option.
    I wasn't aware you could trade up. How does that work?

    Sent from mTalk
    04-21-2017 08:36 PM
  22. hopmedic's Avatar
    I wasn't aware you could trade up. How does that work?

    Sent from mTalk
    You can't. But you can't have exceptional customer service without exceptions. The exception was because I had so many problems over two years with my SP3.
    04-22-2017 11:45 AM
  23. netwirejohn's Avatar
    FYI, I had presented Microsoft via a Notice of Demand letter last month about my countless amount of hours wasted between tech support via the store & answer desk to no resolve. I even cited what you cited above. I did finally get a call from Global Escalations after they received my overnighted FedEx envelope with my Demand letter, 3 page letter of my detailed experience and opened support cases and even at that level they did absolutely nothing. They just wanted to give me another Surface book (refurb, even though the store replaced it with a new one) that was also defective. (I have the global escalations test report that they performed did in writing and shows the defect.) I even reached out to Anibal Sousa, Director of Engineering and he said he just passed my info along to Customer Support and that went into a black hole as well.

    Needless to say, after fighting with the microsoftstore.com supervisors they agreed to take back my Surface Book outside of the return window and I did just received a refund for it even though the amount they refunded me was incorrect. That is another battle I'm going to have to fight now.

    These guys sell the idea of a premium device at a premium cost but with very little testing and QA. I was very supportive of Microsoft from the early days of Windows phone but their devices are terrible.
    04-23-2017 10:02 PM
  24. meoverhere1's Avatar
    Just a brief update on my current situation... having received my 5th replacement SP4 on Monday, although it's early days and I will take some time before I trust it, the replacement is so far all good. Screen is perfect, and it's been reliable so far... which isn't long I know - but longer than the others have managed! Fingers crossed it's 5th time lucky!

    I'll be watching it like a hawk for the 3 months remaining on my warranty.

    I still won't be recommending the device to anyone due to my experience getting to this stage - but happy for now that I can use what is a fantastic device, if your lucky enough to have a good one!

    Will report back if bad things happen.
    04-26-2017 11:20 AM
  25. Christopher Lindsay's Avatar
    Hey everyone. Thanks to Jenn I was finally able to replace my Surface Book with a brand new unit. This time it booted up just fine, there's no disconnecting and reconnecting issue and it's performing solid. Thanks to everyone at Microsoft for helping me stick with Windows.

    Sent from mTalk
    04-29-2017 12:24 PM
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