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05-27-2014 12:20 PM
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  1. jayblazer's Avatar
    I recently got a Nokia icon. I liked it so much I got my son a 520. I am really liking this system. The last piece of apple equipment I have is my iPad 2. I have been thinking about how it's very close to being 4 generations behind. Well my iPad still sells for about $200 on eBay and I could pick up surface for about the same. Question is do you think it's a good trade? Would there be any huge advantages to having a surface with my windows phone?
    03-24-2014 05:15 PM
  2. ticois2nice's Avatar
    EBay has surface pro certified refurbished for 399.00. I just bought one with a refurbished keyboard and extra 2 year warranty under 500.00.
    Last edited by HeyCori; 03-24-2014 at 05:44 PM. Reason: ebay links not allowed
    dgr_874, rdubmu and TheJoester09 like this.
    03-24-2014 05:29 PM
  3. TripsG's Avatar
    Jay, keeping in mind that you are not necessarily comparing Apples and, well, Surfaces in this case, the trade off is exactly that, a trade off. I moved from Apple completely after years with an iPhone and iPad. I would not consider going back at this point for any reason. I have a Lumia 1520 and a Surface Pro, which is essentially a laptop in tablet form. The things you give up? The notorious "app" issue. But this has not been an issue for me yet as all of the apps I've ever required are on the Surface or my phone, and when not available, I use the desktop to find what I want.

    Is it a good trade? Maybe. If you're near a Microsoft store, check online for any in store sales they are having. I got my 1520 for free by trading in an old iPhone 4. I could not pass that deal up and I now have the phone I was craving. Recently I saw an ad for in store credit for turning in an old iPad which could be put towards the Surface for you.

    Lot's of options, I've been extremely happy, and I'm not one of those hung up on pixel count, screen clarity from the side, overall weight, app issues, etc. I use my Surface as my work computer daily and my tablet when I walk away from work. I would highly recommend looking into it.

    If you do, enjoy and welcome!
    xandros9, jayblazer and ternell99 like this.
    03-24-2014 05:42 PM
  4. HeyCori's Avatar
    You should know that the app ecosystem on Windows RT is virtually nonexistent. In fact, Windows RT can't even compare to Windows Phone in regards to app availability and quality. Microsoft does have a plan to "merge" Windows RT and WP by creating a more streamlined WinRT app package that will make it much easier for devs to build a WP and RT nearly simultaneously. However, in the interim, it does little to resolve the current app situation. If you, or you son, play a lot of games on the iPad 2 then you're better off sticking with Apple. The same holds true for any iPad apps you need on a daily basis. Chances are there's not a Windows RT equivalent.

    I'm not into apps and my daily life requires more Office work than anything else. Therefore, the Surface 2 has worked out well for me. In fact, being able to use it as a laptop equivalent is a pretty big plus for me. It easily takes care of my Office or entertainment needs. Plus, the full sized USB and desktop style file manager takes it to a whole new level. We have iPads at work, and even with all the bells & whistles of iOS7, it still feels like I'm stepping into the OS stone age. I like that my Surface is productive straight out of the box versus being reliant on numerous apps to increase productivity and still falling short due to lack of ports.
    03-24-2014 05:43 PM
  5. Microsoftjunkie's Avatar
    Hmm, you are talking about Surface RT, right, not Pro?

    If so, the Surface does everything your iPad does plus more, built in. -Having the ability for "home groups",
    -creating networks by command lines,
    -having Office for when you need it.
    -Its UI is definitely refreshing.
    -Full size USB port
    -Full integration with MS services (the new Bing search is amazing)
    -built in remote desktop
    -definitely, the ability for "true" multitasking. Trust me, its a life saver
    -Windows explorer for managing your files or files on other pcs in your home.
    -you can map storage,

    There's alot more, but I'm getting tired lol.

    The benefits for your WP would be easy file management, using explorer or the desktop app provided in the marketplace. (windows explorer is better imo)
    -having your calendar,contacts, tasks, email, etc in constant sync (if you choose).
    -obviously, similar interfaces


    Hope this helps, ask more if need to.
    03-24-2014 05:52 PM
  6. jayblazer's Avatar
    I honestly don't use the apps on the iPad much. For the most part as in 90% of the time I simply surf the web. Mostly Facebook.. I hate how often I cannot watch a video on my iPad. The only game I play is infinity blade. Oh I also like to have my iPad running as a slide show for pictures when I have friends or family over. I'm really just concerned that after the next major update my iPad will be unusably slow. It seems that the surface has much more horse power then my iPad.

    And yeah the interface is very refreshing. The reason I got rid of my 5s was simply I was very board with the system. It was really not much different then my 3s.
    03-24-2014 05:54 PM
  7. CHIP72's Avatar
    I honestly don't use the apps on the iPad much. For the most part as in 90% of the time I simply surf the web. Mostly Facebook.. I hate how often I cannot watch a video on my iPad. The only game I play is infinity blade. Oh I also like to have my iPad running as a slide show for pictures when I have friends or family over. I'm really just concerned that after the next major update my iPad will be unusably slow. It seems that the surface has much more horse power then my iPad.

    And yeah the interface is very refreshing. The reason I got rid of my 5s was simply I was very board with the system. It was really not much different then my 3s.
    If you are primarily looking for a cheap, web-surfing device, you should buy a chromebook. Seriously. I own an iPad 2, a Surface RT, and a Samsung Series 3 chromebook, and use the chromebook a lot more (and enjoying using the chromebook a lot more) than either of the tablets.

    If you are interested in going the chromebook route, I'd recommend buying the Acer C720 model for $200. It is the best entry-level chromebook on the market right now IMO.

    P.S. I really like Chrome OS. I also strongly dislike Android.
    Last edited by CHIP72; 03-24-2014 at 08:19 PM.
    03-24-2014 07:00 PM
  8. WillysJeepMan's Avatar
    I honestly don't use the apps on the iPad much. For the most part as in 90% of the time I simply surf the web. Mostly Facebook.. I hate how often I cannot watch a video on my iPad. The only game I play is infinity blade. Oh I also like to have my iPad running as a slide show for pictures when I have friends or family over. I'm really just concerned that after the next major update my iPad will be unusably slow. It seems that the surface has much more horse power then my iPad.

    And yeah the interface is very refreshing. The reason I got rid of my 5s was simply I was very board with the system. It was really not much different then my 3s.
    Sounds like you could make the transition from the iPad 2 to a Surface 2. We were an all Apple household for the last 4 years but recently have been making the shift away from Apple as the quality of their products is on the decline without a commensurate drop in price. For many things, the non-Apple solutions are working far better than the Apple ones.

    I replaced my Apple TV 2 with a Roku 3. Using Plex server on my iMac, I can cleanly and reliably access all of my media (100's of DVDs ripped from my personal collection, CDs ripped to MP3s, etc.) on my iPad 4, Roku 3, and Surface 2.

    The Surface 2 is an excellent device but as HeyCori said, the app situation is not great and really limits using the Surface to the greatest limits that the hardware is capable of.

    If you decide to get a Surface, I'd recommend getting a Surface 2 rather than the 1st gen Surface RT. I used to be an advocate for picking up those cheap refurbs on ebay but after owning a 2 for a few weeks, I've come around to the value of the "2". :D
    HeyCori, Lions fan and dgr_874 like this.
    03-24-2014 07:01 PM
  9. jayblazer's Avatar
    Oh In the future I will certainly get a new device. But I thought this might be a good way to check and see if this is an Eco system I can live with before I drop any real cash. I have in the past had several android tablets and a few droid phones. I then moved to all apple and now I'm going towards Microsoft. Honestly Getting rid of the iPhone was one thing. The iPad I'm finding to be a little more difficult. I spend about 4 hours a day with this thing. And letting it go may take some coaxing. That's what I'm looking for here.
    03-24-2014 08:00 PM
  10. CHIP72's Avatar
    Jayblazer - one more thing to add. If you don't go the chromebook route and want to buy a Microsoft tablet, based on my experience with the Surface RT tablet (or at least the 1st generation Surface RT tablet), I'd strongly advise AGAINST buying a Surface RT, and would recommend buying a tablet with full Windows 8 on it instead. To me, Windows RT has all of the negatives of the Windows 8 but none of the positives - slow-loading apps, a lack of basic information (like time and battery level) on the Start screen in Metro mode (unless you place a clock tile and take up room on the Start screen of course), and most of all way too many updates for a "light" operating system. (I swear, Windows RT requires as many update downloads as regular Windows 8, and it seems like Windows 8 requires more updates than Windows 7!)

    Though I don't own it, if you go the full Windows 8 tablet route and don't want to shell out big bucks for a Windows Surface Pro tablet, I'd look into the Asus Transformer Book 100 tablet. You can buy that tablet with a keyboard attachment (ala the Android-based Transformer series tablets) for $400 or less.
    Last edited by CHIP72; 03-24-2014 at 08:22 PM.
    jayblazer likes this.
    03-24-2014 08:07 PM
  11. jayblazer's Avatar
    It's probably worth mentioning that I do have an Alienware 14 laptop with windows 8. This is just an internet surfing play thing..
    03-24-2014 08:19 PM
  12. Zulfigar's Avatar
    My favorite aspect of the Surface, that isn't mentioned often, is the fact it has access to millions of drivers. Want to use a different keyboard? No sweat. How about a camera you just got done taking birthday pictures on and want to upload them to OneDrive? Not a problem. A mouse? Which one! An Xbox 360 gaming controller? Use it with Asphalt 8 and enjoy!

    Drivers, not sure why they aren't mentioned often, but is really the biggest difference between any Windows 8 tablet, either RT or Pro, and everything else.
    TripsG and jayblazer like this.
    03-24-2014 08:33 PM
  13. CHIP72's Avatar
    It's probably worth mentioning that I do have an Alienware 14 laptop with windows 8. This is just an internet surfing play thing..
    IMO, from a price/value perspective, chromebooks are the best pure internet surfing devices available today. (They also have nothing to do with Android, which is another positive IMO.) I was a little skeptical about chromebooks when I first heard about them, but when the Samsung Series 3 and Acer C700 models came out in fall 2012 at $250 and $200 price-points respectively, I figured it was worth picking one up to check it out and that if I didn't like it, it wasn't that much money wasted. After I bought my Samsung Series 3 in January 2013 and started using it, it didn't take me long to become a chromebook advocate. Chrome OS works really well because it is such a thin operating system (it is a browser/cloud-based operating system, rather than a device-based operating system like we've typically seen since the onset of the PC in the 1970s) and has very low processing requirements. The Intel Haswell Celeron models appear to function a little better than their ARM processor counterparts (which typically weigh less and are fan-less but also have poorer battery life than the Haswell chromebooks), but both types function very well (or should I say based on my personal experience, I know an ARM processor model functions very well). The Samsung chromebooks and HP Chromebook 11 have ARM processors, while the Acer models, the Toshiba 13.3" chromebook, and the HP Chromebook 14 (and the Dell chromebooks, which are hard to find commercially) have Intel Haswell processors.

    Honestly, I think browser/cloud-based operating systems like Chrome OS and Firefox OS are the future of computing, but only time will tell. Hopefully Microsoft will eventually create "explorerbooks" and integrate Office 365 into them in some way, ala Google's chromebooks with the Google "office" package. (On a related side note, you can use Microsoft's cloud products, like Office 365 and for that matter OneDrive, on a chromebook without any problems.)
    03-24-2014 08:43 PM
  14. jayblazer's Avatar
    I appreciate what your saying there but I really like the tablet form. Right now I'm laying back with the iPad on my lap watching tv over it. Sort of just surfing and chilling. I find that hard to do with the laptop style. I have a laptop for any heavy gaming or computing needs.
    03-24-2014 08:55 PM
  15. xandros9's Avatar
    Personally I would go for the Surface because I no longer have much of a stake in Apple's ecosystem. although there are some iOS games that I'd love to try that likely won't really pop up for RT anytime soon.

    The web browser is top notch, and its closer to a PC than a phone, whereas the iPad is more towards a phone.

    But my chief concern is that the iPad 2 is rather old and likely is at the end of its lifecycle as Apple stopped selling it just recently. The hardware isn't very good these days, and while the Surface 1 isn't exactly a speed demon either, it probably has more of a future at this point.
    But then again apps.

    As for having both, using services, particularly Outlook.com, you can sync contacts and whatnot OTA.
    Office documents I work on my laptop, save to OneDrive, where I can pick up quickly from my Lumia.

    They don't mesh as well as they could, but I'm banking on 8.1 to fix that.
    jayblazer likes this.
    03-24-2014 10:05 PM
  16. TripsG's Avatar
    I appreciate what your saying there but I really like the tablet form. Right now I'm laying back with the iPad on my lap watching tv over it. Sort of just surfing and chilling. I find that hard to do with the laptop style. I have a laptop for any heavy gaming or computing needs.
    Then let me add that if you were on a Surface you could be watching TV on one side of the screen while surfing the web on the other side. Something the iPad cannot do.

    As this is my work machine I routinely have 3 windows snapped on one screen while doing email on the external monitor, and I'm about to add a 2nd external monitor to this thing. While I know you want it for simply surfing and general play, these things as well as the driver comments mentioned above are big things to consider.

    I'm not a fan of the Chromebook's or Android/Google in general so I'll reserve comment there as that may work for some, but when it comes down to bang for your buck, I still can't see why the vast majority don't see the pure value in the Surface/Windows/Windows Phone ecosystem.
    03-25-2014 09:53 AM
  17. T Moore's Avatar
    I recently got a Nokia icon. Would there be any huge advantages to having a surface with my windows phone?
    Use the same MS account on your phone and surface to have the same calendar, contacts, OneDrive and email on both devices. I got a refurbished RT with touch cover for under $230. You don't have to have apps when you can use IE. Many don't realize all the RT can do. Take a look at this youtube video, "Why I love my Microsoft Surface RT" There is also a part 2. The same would apply to the Pro version plus being able to install programs.
    dakranii and drjekel_mrhyde like this.
    03-25-2014 10:38 AM
  18. dakranii's Avatar
    You should know that the app ecosystem on Windows RT is virtually nonexistent...If you, or you son, play a lot of games on the iPad 2 then you're better off sticking with Apple. The same holds true for any iPad apps you need on a daily basis. Chances are there's not a Windows RT equivalent.
    Virtually non-existent might be a little strong. There certainly aren't a ton, but I haven't found anything I'm missing. But you are correct in that if you NEED specific apps, ensure the Surface does/doesn't have them. My wife needs an iPad for work as a speech therapist because the related apps exist only in iOS. But for games, etc, sure the iPad has more but my son has his needs more than met, over 40 of them pinned to the home screen that he can pick from (although I steal my wife's iPad to play Clash of Clans and Candy Crush because I'm a weak, weak man )

    screenshot-1-.jpg

    We have iPads at work, and even with all the bells & whistles of iOS7, it still feels like I'm stepping into the OS stone age. I like that my Surface is productive straight out of the box versus being reliant on numerous apps to increase productivity and still falling short due to lack of ports.
    For work I hands down love my Surface. Putting screens up side-by-side, taking notes while viewing either email, work related documents, pdfs, having the web up at the same time as a Word document, etc. Having real keyboard, the kickstand, etc.

    The iPad is a great device, obviously, it can do a lot of stuff. But it can't do the stuff I need a tablet to do as well as a Surface. And I agree, it does feel like stepping into the OS stone age. The boring app icons that just sit there telling me nothing, going to the home screen to double tap the button to swipe up to close an app vs just swiping down from inside the app, trying and forgetting I can't have programs side-by-side...
    HeyCori likes this.
    03-25-2014 11:26 AM
  19. CHIP72's Avatar
    Use the same MS account on your phone and surface to have the same calendar, contacts, OneDrive and email on both devices.[/url]
    The above is doable with Outlook.com on non-Microsoft devices too. My Hotmail account is my primary e-mail account, and when I add something to my calendar, that information pops up on all of my devices.


    Sent from my iPhone using WPCentral Forums
    03-25-2014 11:31 AM
  20. prlundberg's Avatar
    I'll second the recommendation of a full Windows tablet. They now cost about the same as RT and you aren't restricted to IE11, which is a POS. RT is every bit as complex and difficult to manage as full Windows while giving up a lot of flexibility and power.

    I have spent most of the past year being a proponent of RT. But after countless hours of frustration I've given up. I wouldn't recommend RT to anybody at this point, especially somebody who mainly wants to use it as a web browser. For just a bit more you can step up to the Dell Venue Pro, that is if an 8" screen is big enough for you. That would be my choice if I were buying a new Windows tablet today.
    03-25-2014 12:09 PM
  21. xandros9's Avatar
    I'll second the recommendation of a full Windows tablet. They now cost about the same as RT and you aren't restricted to IE11, which is a POS. RT is every bit as complex and difficult to manage as full Windows while giving up a lot of flexibility and power.

    I have spent most of the past year being a proponent of RT. But after countless hours of frustration I've given up. I wouldn't recommend RT to anybody at this point, especially somebody who mainly wants to use it as a web browser. For just a bit more you can step up to the Dell Venue Pro, that is if an 8" screen is big enough for you. That would be my choice if I were buying a new Windows tablet today.
    A full windows tablet is becoming more compelling at time goes on. I have a DV8P
    but IE 11 isn't a POS. but besides that, full windows gives you much more freedom.
    03-25-2014 12:24 PM
  22. dakranii's Avatar
    I'll second the recommendation of a full Windows tablet. They now cost about the same as RT and you aren't restricted to IE11, which is a POS. RT is every bit as complex and difficult to manage as full Windows while giving up a lot of flexibility and power.

    I have spent most of the past year being a proponent of RT. But after countless hours of frustration I've given up. I wouldn't recommend RT to anybody at this point, especially somebody who mainly wants to use it as a web browser. For just a bit more you can step up to the Dell Venue Pro, that is if an 8" screen is big enough for you. That would be my choice if I were buying a new Windows tablet today.
    I think I would agree to a point. I'd probably get full W8 now, but I bought my Surface RT the day it was available for $599, stretching my budget. I considered the full W8 tablets available (I think an Acer or Asus one, and a Samsung one that places had a display of but none for sale). I've been happy with my RT and don't regret the purchase. But there are many more options available today than there were then. I do like the form-factor of the Surface the best, so maybe I'd go Pro at this point. But it's the OS that's the main selling point, hardware is secondary to me.
    03-25-2014 01:22 PM
  23. WillysJeepMan's Avatar
    I'm not a fan of the Chromebook's or Android/Google in general so I'll reserve comment there as that may work for some, but when it comes down to bang for your buck, I still can't see why the vast majority don't see the pure value in the Surface/Windows/Windows Phone ecosystem.
    Because it's not one ecosystem, but three. The software available for Windows RT devices is still woefully inadequate for various use cases. If you are able to do everything that you need and want to do with the software currently available then obviously the Surface is a no-brainer.

    It's ironic. Those times that I can make use of the hardware capabilities of the Surface 2 that are unique to it (that the iPad 4 doesn't have) there is no software to accomplish the task. Case in point, I have a terrific little Samson USB microphone and wanted a portable podcasting rig. The Surface 2 with multiple window capability would be terrific. Except there's no software available to do that.

    In contrast, there are professional apps like Boss Jock Studio for the iPad. But the inability to have more than one app visible on the screen is a negative.

    There are many more instances where missing apps have become a constant irritation. And it's not like I MUST HAVE a particular app. I'd be delighted to have an app that performs the same function even if it means learning something new.

    nvAlt for OSX, Notesy/Writeroom for iOS, ResophNotes for Windows.... NOTHING for Windows RT. I'm stuck with a substandard kludge of Dropbox and CodeWriter.

    It's frustrating because if it weren't for the app situation the Surface would be THE tablet for me.


    The iPad is a great device, obviously, it can do a lot of stuff. But it can't do the stuff I need a tablet to do as well as a Surface. And I agree, it does feel like stepping into the OS stone age. The boring app icons that just sit there telling me nothing, going to the home screen to double tap the button to swipe up to close an app vs just swiping down from inside the app, trying and forgetting I can't have programs side-by-side...
    I'm about function, not style. I don't spend time gazing at icons but in the apps themselves so I'm not stirred by live tiles (which I disable to preserve battery life) over icons. I DO like the start screen but it's not something that makes me prefer the Surface over the iPad.
    03-25-2014 01:53 PM
  24. bdesm's Avatar
    Go for a Dell Venue Pro 8.
    03-25-2014 01:57 PM
  25. prlundberg's Avatar
    I have a DV8P
    but IE 11 isn't a POS.
    Maybe not on your DV8P I guess, but IE11 certainly is a POS on my Surface RT. Possibly the worst browser I have ever used and easily the most frustrating. It's unstable and going "back" is an exercise in patience, when it works at all.
    etad putta likes this.
    03-25-2014 03:10 PM
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