How come no call recorder yet in the store ????

[DJCBS]

Call recording is illegal all over Europe unless you warn the person being recorded and give her/him the chance of refusing to take the call beforehand.
And that's basically how it works in almost all Democratic countries.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

Nothing good ever comes of recording conversations unless you are a business and it is a call center environment.

There is a reason it is disabled on these personal devices.

I disagree that it should be prevented just because it is illegal some places. It's illegal to run red lights but not a good idea to have a steel wall with claymores pop up when the light changes.

It's legal to record in some places and as you say has some uses anywhere. It should NOT be actively prevented; a warning to check local laws would be acceptable.

 

[rhapdog]

I agree. Even with the laws against it, most laws everywhere permits it t be done "when you obtain permission." So, for someone who routinely tells people, "I have to record this call, is that okay?", then they should be allowed to use it when people agree to be recorded.

I would guarantee that for a freelance computer programmer who has contracted with someone, if that programmer gets permission to record phone calls and discussions where features of the program are determined, that programmer would have less issues (which run rampant in the industry) with what is commonly referred to as "scope creep" or "feature creep". That is, someone who states what they want up front what it is they want the program to do, and are constantly changing their minds about the scope of the program or the features the program should have, which causes the programmer to lose a lot of time (thus money) having to constantly re-work the program. If it was recorded, it would be easier to make people pay for changes, thus compensate the programmer for the time on the additional work needed to rework the program again, because it could be proved what the initial feature set was supposed to be.

I was a freelance computer programmer for many years. Even though my years as a corporate programmer were not as lucrative, at least I got paid the same even if the boss changed his mind about what he wanted. Just glad to be retired and not need this any longer.

However, the legal issues is not why the phone microphone gets locked down in Windows Phone. It's for security to protect the owner of the phone from malicious apps, and to prevent those malicious apps from being created in the first place. I don't know for sure, but I heard a friend once talking about his Android, and how he had installed malware without realizing it, and he found out it was taking pictures and uploading them, recording from the mic and uploading it, etc. I don't know for sure if that really happened, but he seemed to believe it did. I'm sure it is possible on that platform as open as it is to pretty much anything.

Yeah, if I needed it for work, I'd want the additional hardware to make sure the recordings were clear. I did notice there are quite a few Bluetooth models which are wireless. Not sure how they work exactly, but seems like they would be more discrete. Quite small, too.

 

[gomezz]

Call recording is illegal all over Europe

Incorrect. I refer you to my previous post.

 

[gMaesterUK]

Put phone call on speakerphone. Then record the call with an installed voice recorder app such as Audio Recorder.

My understanding is that won't work. MS have purposely sandboxed every app, meaning if there is a call access to the mics will be disabled for any apps to stop calls being illegally call recorded.

As I've said earlier, I do believe MS will allow call recording, this will probably come in Win10 and be strictly controlled via Group Policy. As some professions require for compliance calls to be recorded. Well certainly here in the UK for financial services, etc... So unless you've got a Windows server setup (that probably won't be Small Biz Server) you're going to be out of luck ever getting this facility.

G.

 

[DJCBS]

Incorrect. I refer you to my previous post.

Mate, I'm a lawyer, I know what I'm talking about.
As I said, it's illegal unless you warn the other person beforehand and give her the option of not taking the call. Not even as "memory aid" is it allowed.
The only people allowed to record calls without knowledge and/or consent of one or both parties involved is the police and, even then, they need a Court order prior to the recordings.

 

[Loco5150]

Yep its illegal to record like that. That's why often apps like this have this beeb sound when recording.

 

[Kevin Rush]

Yep its illegal to record like that. That's why often apps like this have this been sound when recording.

May I ask, what does "have this been sound when recording" trying to say?

 

[Loco5150]

Auocorrect sorry. "beeb" sound I meant. Back in the days on other platforms I remember seeing apps like this, and all made a "beeb" sound in intervals.

 

[rhapdog]

Ah, you are referring to the beep much like occurs on a land-line phone in the US when the phone line detects recording equipment hooked up. This used to be in place many years ago, but more modern recording equipment gets around the detection and the beep no longer occurs. It used to beep every 15 seconds and could not be stopped by the recording party, so the person on the other end was always warned that the call was being recorded, unless it was a wire tap by law enforcement.

Early apps used to mimic this behavior, which was an attempt to prevent people from using it in an illegal manner.

Okay, people, I keep hearing, "It's illegal to record like that" without any further clarification. Please be more specific. You can't just say, "It's illegal to record like that." When you say it like that, it means illegal everywhere, which it is not. I happen to live in the USA, in the state of Mississippi. Mississippi is known as a "One Party Consent State" when it comes to recording telephone conversations. That means if I call someone, or someone calls me, I can record that call as long as I am part of the conversation and I want it recorded, as long as the call is to or from someone else in Mississippi OR to or from someone else in another One Party Consent State.

So it isn't illegal everywhere.

Yes, perhaps it is illegal in all or most areas of Europe. Europe isn't the entire world. I would not be surprised to find that there are some countries in the world with no governance on the issue whatsoever.

Back to the case in point. The opening poster asks "How come no call recorder yet in the store". The answer isn't about the legalities, because you can get permission to record the calls even in any place in Europe.

The issue boils down to security and privacy of the owner of the phone, and allowing the mic to record during calls could have some pretty major concerns where malicious apps are concerned. That's my opinion. This is why I believe it would be important for people who have this legitimate need, and plan to use it within the confines of the laws of the countries and/or states where they live, should buy the appropriate hardware to allow them to do the recording in a safe and secure manner that won't compromise any of the parties involved.

 

[srikanth reddy4]

It's the same in iOS and I guess by default also in Android? It may be possible with rooted/jailbreaked systems. It's simply not allowed in non-hacked OS and the purpose is to protect people privacy. If it's so important to you, then you can use a 3rd party device attached to your phone to record your calls.

in android there is no needing of rooting there are many apps in the play store

 

[gomezz]

Mate, I'm a lawyer

A bad one by the sounds of it. Unless perhaps you can quote a case in English law were someone was found guilty purely for making a recording rather than for using it?

 

[LTTG]

All I want now is an FM Radio recorder...

 

[rhapdog]

A bad one by the sounds of it. Unless perhaps you can quote a case in English law were someone was found guilty purely for making a recording rather than for using it?

There's no need for being unkind or judgmental. We aren't here to assign blame or pass judgment, only to offer help.

All I want now is an FM Radio recorder...

Hmm... I used to have one of those laying around. Ah... it's in the box I was about to take to a charity thrift store. Old AM/FM Radio with Cassette Recorder. That's just what you need.

Seriously, an audio cable with a male plug on each end, one end to your phone's headset plug and the other to a digital recorder input plug, and you'd be good to go on that one.

 

[Gunbust3r]

I love how any company you call records for "quality assurance" (aka to screw you over if it comes to it) but a $650 piece of hardware has it locked out.

 

[rhapdog]

If you can afford a $650 piece of hardware, you can afford the additional for proper recording. You can do it for as little as $30 or as much as $250. the $30 gets you less features, no voice activation so you have to turn it on manually, and less recording time (250 hours as opposed to several thousand.)

As far as companies recording for "quality assurance", I have worked for several call centers in the past. Each person has a number of their calls recorded, and you never know which ones. Then management listens to the recorded calls to determine if you treated the customer correctly and if you followed proper procedure. If you didn't, you can get fired, or lesser disciplinary actions depending on the infraction. I've never heard of a recording used against the actual caller, and not all calls are recorded. Less than 2% generally. At least that was my experience back in the day.

 

[DJCBS]

A bad one by the sounds of it. Unless perhaps you can quote a case in English law were someone was found guilty purely for making a recording rather than for using it?

Perhaps go acquaint yourself with European privacy laws which, in case you aren't aware, prevail over English laws as the UK is part of the EU and agreed to abide by them.
If you want me to find specific cases in English court history, pay me. I don't work for free, even less when it comes to finding court rulings from a country that isn't mine.

 

[RumoredNow]

...If you want me to find specific cases in English court history, pay me. I don't work for free, even less when it comes to finding court rulings from a country that isn't mine.

Yep... That's a lawyer all right.

Bill him an hour each time you read a post of his (5 minutes time) and another hour for each reply (2 minutes time). That'll learn 'em. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLz.

Sorry, I worked for the buggers once and did the phone, mail, fax, copier billing breakdowns per client. Had a bad flashback, I did. :winktongue:

 

[saras112]

Yes...

Be sure to announce each and every time that the call is being recorded (just like the call centers do) or you could face problems. This way if someone does not want you recording them they can disconnect.

Again, I think it goes to these being personal communications devices. There are huge issues with recording personal conversations.

​Call recording has not ever been baked into a mobile OS, so far as I know. This has always been a 3rd party area.

Old Nokia phones with Symbian used to record calls

 

[HoosierDaddy]

Yep... That's a lawyer all right.

Bill him an hour each time you read a post of his (5 minutes time) and another hour for each reply (2 minutes time). That'll learn 'em. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLz.

Sorry, I worked for the buggers once and did the phone, mail, fax, copier billing breakdowns per client. Had a bad flashback, I did. :winktongue:

It evens out later. Like the 38 year old lawyer who pleaded with St. Peter there must be some mistake because he was too young to die. St. Peter said: Too young? Based on your hourly billing you're at least 85.