How do people see you when you say to them that "You are using Windows phone”?

[Drael646464]

I'm more so the person that reacts when I see someone with a Windows Phone.

I say: "Oh you have a Windows phone!"

Then, I think to myself: "Oh, you're an oddball like me. Either that...or a Microsoft employee, and even they don't use Windows phones anymore."

I'm disappointed that Microsoft ditched 2 potentially great products. First, the Microsoft Band. Then, Windows Phones.

I own the Nokia 1020, love its features, especially its camera. But now, I wonder how long do I have before I get completely frustrated with not being able to use any major app on the phone, because its closed-source and no developers will support it.

I wouldn't stress. In the future all computers will be more like a cross between a smartphone and a PC, including smartphones. To get to that future, a lot of things will be pruned, like the branches of a tree to keep it growing. Same stuff will happen with other companies and their users. I expect Google to cut android in a few years. They'll definately be focusing on ChromeOS for tablets. And after a while of whatever hybrid OS they decide to settle on (Chrome or Fuschia), they'll likely cut app support for various platforms (like android apps or Linux support).

And just like for us MSFT fans, that will pain their fanbase. This is just an inevitable path to the future.

The smartwatch thing isn't much different either. They all run incompatible hardware specific platforms, have tiny software ecosystems, have limited device compatibility, and in their primitive form are useful but either lack battery life, or power. Smartwatches will go through generations of changes before they find their final form. Probably at least a decade really (graphene for larger curved flexible screens, and perhaps some kind of AI or gesture technology would be a vast improvement - touch on a tiny screen is fiddly)

Chances are when MSFT releases their next smartwatch, it'll be running windows core, have full UWP app compatibility, decent battery life and some real device compatibility - ie a vastly more refined product. Or perhaps it'll be another OEM, like fitbit (let's not pretend the fitbit OS will last). In the meantime, at least fitbit has MSFTs back, and they are pretty decent products.


My point being, TLDR, is that every brand will go through this. The loss of app platforms, hardware platforms, product lines and general familiarity as we try to bridge the gap between now and convergence and the ubiqituous computing era.

 

[anon(50597)]

While all brands will go through eventual change (we don’t know that timeline) people don’t care about that, they care about now. It’s fun to think about the future and how things will turn out but people have lives to lead now and need devices that assist their lives. Thats why people are worried and leaving for other mobile platforms.

 

[Timbre70]

Finally pop in both my sims into Nokia 7 Plus Android bought a month ago. In less than 15 minutes, I pop them off and put back to my Lumias again.

Can't stand it...

Even WhatsApp also looks terrible.

For now, use Android only for apps that WP don't support, tapa talk...

Trying to use the dual sim function is also not as straightforward as Lumia.

 

[Drael646464]

While all brands will go through eventual change (we don’t know that timeline) people don’t care about that, they care about now. It’s fun to think about the future and how things will turn out but people have lives to lead now and need devices that assist their lives. Thats why people are worried and leaving for other mobile platforms.

Then leave windows mobile. and then leave those new brands when the get axed/have issues( like they ditch android ). If complete contuity is primary you'll just have to jump around. The only thing about convergence is app systems, OSes will be axed, app systems will be all over the place util the move is done - so want that 'now machine' -be prepared to switch a bit

 

[anon(50597)]

Then leave windows mobile. and then leave those new brands when the get axed/have issues( like they ditch android ). If complete contuity is primary you'll just have to jump around. The only thing about convergence is app systems, OSes will be axed, app systems will be all over the place util the move is done - so want that 'now machine' -be prepared to switch a bit

People have left Windows Mobile but there’s no need to leave the others and won’t be for quite a while unless they don’t have a smooth transition to the next phase. Most people have lost faith in Microsoft getting the job done because of past experience. It all looks good on paper or when reading articles on the internet, but reality has yet to be determined.
JMHO.

 

[Drael646464]

People have left Windows Mobile but there’s no need to leave the others and won’t be for quite a while unless they don’t have a smooth transition to the next phase. Most people have lost faith in Microsoft getting the job done because of past experience. It all looks good on paper or when reading articles on the internet, but reality has yet to be determined.
JMHO.

Well I think it's clear with Googles recent moves on Chrome, it intends to replace Android on Tablets with Chrome. My suspicion is that it a few years they'll dump android. Many actions scream a lack of interest in android long term. Either to be replaced by fuschia or chromeOS.

Certainly they seem to have the same hybrid future mindset of MSFT, so sooner or later androids out. Whatever replaces will run android apps of course, and PWAs, but like with windows 10, the intention will be to move all apps onto the new platform. So there will be the loss of android, and then the loss of some app systems.


A very similar experience that micosoft users have experienced.

Because that hybrid OS will have multiple strains of app platforms. In ChromeOSes case for example -pwa, android apps, Linux emultation and chrome apps. These all come from different places (chrome store, play store, web pages + Linux repository), and like with early windows 10 -Linux apps would not generally scale to phone sizes, or be touch or stylus friendly (and it's emulation, so same issue as windows on arm - no power apps or games), android apps won't scale up to desktop or larger screens and they''ll want everything moved to a single native app system eventually any way.

A similar experience to what Microsoft users have experienced.

I don't when it happens, but yeah I think if people want continuity they will have to bounce between devices until someone has a whole hybrid system, that's polished and one app system has been mostly embraced. I don't think it's realistic than in incremental periods of 3 years over the next ten, that you'll be able to get continuity from the same type of device.

Apple - well their iPhone business will collapse over the next 5 years. Basic, inevitable post-market dynamics (this is a rule of tech, that has always, every time been the case- the shift to price point competition and away from premium, and you can already see the beginning of that trend over the last 3 years).

That's their major income. ipad has been losing sales for awhile, and their very low sales of ipad pro, so that it is not found to be the same kind of hybrid by consumers as the rest of the hybrid sector which has not only highest tablet growth, but also highest PC growth. The market isn't liking it, and that's a problem for the fastest growing segment - clearly iOS doesn't cut it next to real desktop OSes.

I'm not sure what apple will do, but I forsee a major need for pivot. And they've specifically said they won't merge ios and osx. They need a new product catergory. But that general loss of momentum is likely to affect consumers too. Just based on murrent market trends and predictable changes.

For example, a wise, profit saving measure would be start making budget phones. But will consumers like that? Will they be able to compete with cheaper midranges on android? Or compete with google in search. IDK what else will keep their king status.They are on the top of a money train, but I worry about their future, and I know it won't be long before the market starts making a big deal about apple losses, and low performing years.

I guess what I am saying is that is seems fairly likely apple and google are both heading into a period where they have users loosing faith just has you have Google for good reasons (the same pathway to hybrid OS), and apple, AFAIK, just because they appear to have no idea what they are doing under current leadership.

Even if apple were to catch up, by touch and stylus redesigning iOS, there's chipset converstion to do, emulation layers, all those scaling issues, the nessasary merger of the two app systems - in order to create a properly competitive hybrid tablet, and that again, has all the same bottlenecks and pitfalls of any hybrid OS (scaling, emulation layers, multiple initial app systems) - and that wouldn't make then enough money to stay as big as they were, nor would selling budget apple devices - it would keep them relevant, but they would be number 4 or 5 or 6 at best total profits.

So from where I sit, I can't see a platform that users won't lose their faith in, and in every case, not in a long period of time either. Perhaps one will be better than another for a time, and then not, hard to say what we unfold when. But it's all just a consequence of the direction mobile computing is trending/heading. Things will be chopped, hearded, disorgazied, app platforms a jumble, people will lose products they love.

 

[anon(50597)]

How do people see you when you say to them that "You are using Windows phone”?

Well I think it's clear with Googles recent moves on Chrome, it intends to replace Android on Tablets with Chrome. My suspicion is that it a few years they'll dump android. Many actions scream a lack of interest in android long term. Either to be replaced by fuschia or chromeOS.

Certainly they seem to have the same hybrid future mindset of MSFT, so sooner or later androids out. Whatever replaces will run android apps of course, and PWAs, but like with windows 10, the intention will be to move all apps onto the new platform. So there will be the loss of android, and then the loss of some app systems.


A very similar experience that micosoft users have experienced.

Because that hybrid OS will have multiple strains of app platforms. In ChromeOSes case for example -pwa, android apps, Linux emultation and chrome apps. These all come from different places (chrome store, play store, web pages + Linux repository), and like with early windows 10 -Linux apps would not generally scale to phone sizes, or be touch or stylus friendly (and it's emulation, so same issue as windows on arm - no power apps or games), android apps won't scale up to desktop or larger screens and they''ll want everything moved to a single native app system eventually any way.

A similar experience to what Microsoft users have experienced.

I don't when it happens, but yeah I think if people want continuity they will have to bounce between devices until someone has a whole hybrid system, that's polished and one app system has been mostly embraced. I don't think it's realistic than in incremental periods of 3 years over the next ten, that you'll be able to get continuity from the same type of device.

Apple - well their iPhone business will collapse over the next 5 years. Basic, inevitable post-market dynamics (this is a rule of tech, that has always, every time been the case- the shift to price point competition and away from premium, and you can already see the beginning of that trend over the last 3 years).

That's their major income. ipad has been losing sales for awhile, and their very low sales of ipad pro, so that it is not found to be the same kind of hybrid by consumers as the rest of the hybrid sector which has not only highest tablet growth, but also highest PC growth. The market isn't liking it, and that's a problem for the fastest growing segment - clearly iOS doesn't cut it next to real desktop OSes.

I'm not sure what apple will do, but I forsee a major need for pivot. And they've specifically said they won't merge ios and osx. They need a new product catergory. But that general loss of momentum is likely to affect consumers too. Just based on murrent market trends and predictable changes.

For example, a wise, profit saving measure would be start making budget phones. But will consumers like that? Will they be able to compete with cheaper midranges on android? Or compete with google in search. IDK what else will keep their king status.They are on the top of a money train, but I worry about their future, and I know it won't be long before the market starts making a big deal about apple losses, and low performing years.

I guess what I am saying is that is seems fairly likely apple and google are both heading into a period where they have users loosing faith just has you have Google for good reasons (the same pathway to hybrid OS), and apple, AFAIK, just because they appear to have no idea what they are doing under current leadership.

Even if apple were to catch up, by touch and stylus redesigning iOS, there's chipset converstion to do, emulation layers, all those scaling issues, the nessasary merger of the two app systems - in order to create a properly competitive hybrid tablet, and that again, has all the same bottlenecks and pitfalls of any hybrid OS (scaling, emulation layers, multiple initial app systems) - and that wouldn't make then enough money to stay as big as they were, nor would selling budget apple devices - it would keep them relevant, but they would be number 4 or 5 or 6 at best total profits.

So from where I sit, I can't see a platform that users won't lose their faith in, and in every case, not in a long period of time either. Perhaps one will be better than another for a time, and then not, hard to say what we unfold when. But it's all just a consequence of the direction mobile computing is trending/heading. Things will be chopped, hearded, disorgazied, app platforms a jumble, people will lose products they love.

Interesting post. Don't take this as an attack, but I think you are overly biased positively towards MS and negatively towards Google and Apple.
You keep saying "just like what happened to MS", but I think you cannot compare the two scenarios. Similar but different.
Also, the iPhone will collapse in 5 years? Perhaps but I'm not so sure what you predict will be full scale that quickly. New technology develops every day and influences the direction going forward. Having the audience and what they desire has importance also.
Interesting times ahead. I like your enthusiasm. Only time will tell.

 

[nate0]

Re: How do people see you when you say to them that "You are using Windows phone”?

Like above I get reactions from people as if I'm being questioned. They don't get why I would be using a windows phone or why I am enthusiastic about it. They need to ask....And I tell them that is ok. What works for me works for me.

 

[Drael646464]

Re: How do people see you when you say to them that "You are using Windows phone”?

Interesting post. Don't take this as an attack, but I think you are overly biased positively towards MS and negatively towards Google and Apple.
You keep saying "just like what happened to MS", but I think you cannot compare the two scenarios. Similar but different.
Also, the iPhone will collapse in 5 years? Perhaps but I'm not so sure what you predict will be full scale that quickly. New technology develops every day and influences the direction going forward. Having the audience and what they desire has importance also.
Interesting times ahead. I like your enthusiasm. Only time will tell.

The iPhone sales profit is merely based on post-adoption behaviour and general market trends. I've known about this for many years. Basically you have this adoption boom (the period where people who have never used a smartphone, get one), and during that premium product sales rule the roost. It's a boom, a wave. It's not a permenant condition.

The you get to post-adoption, which we have in most west nations (there is still adoption in development markets like india. In the markets you can already see the faltering sales of premium devices, and the rise of price point competition. Which is what happens post product adoption in tech markets - you get slowed upgrade cycles, price point competition, and premium falls by the way - it becomes less profitable that cheaper segments. And, like I knew would happen, you can see all those trends rising in the market already, and we haven't been at post-adoption long, and their are still some markets yet to saturate.

I'm not saying the iPhone will be dead in 5 years, I'm just saying it's sales will be a lot lower. Enough that apple will need some new tricks. iPhone is apples main profit source, and they are the number 1 profit tech company due to this. They have a lot of cash, and you'd expect them to do something, anything, to replace that profit stream. And quick. It seems like they are resting on their laurels.

As for google, I think my post wasn't at all sceptical of google. I think they like Microsoft are seeking future technologies, and in this particular area convergence. Which I personally think is super smart of them. They'll be in that ultramobile space within the year, battling windows on arm with chromeOS. So I don't know how anything I said was harsh to google. All I said was - there are essential and unavoidable bottlenecks and issues along the way to convergence, and those do cause issues for users, so I expect users of basically all products to have those sorts of experiences as we march along this road. (IDK if apple has any plans for convergence or not, I hope so, because competition cant hurt)

Indeed what I am predicting with google is that ChromeOS will be right along side their competing against windows on arm/windows core, and I absolutely think they are still in this game. It's just that it won't be android that they use as the basis for convergence. It's not powerful enough to be a PC when it needs to be. And ChromeOS, or Fuschia will have the same sort of troubles with hearding users from multiple app platforms to one, and scaling apps to multiple input methods that windows has had. Juts part of the territory.

But I would not be at all surprised if googles OS is co-released with windows core on the first graphene screen device in however many years. I expect google wants it so that their offering runs on exactly the same hardware, crossplatform as windows does.

 

[anon(50597)]

Re: How do people see you when you say to them that "You are using Windows phone”?

I'm not saying the iPhone will be dead in 5 years, I'm just saying it's sales will be a lot lower. Enough that apple will need some new tricks.

This is different than what you said originally, and I can’t say I disagree. As devices become more similar in function (already happening) a lot less people will be willing to pay a premium price. Apple perfected this revolution and they will need to find a way to advance it.
I don’t have the knowledge to say what the next big thing will be, but I think we have to stay cognizant of what people want and use. I know, for instance, Apple is working on prescription glasses with AR function. That to me is revolutionary and something consumers might use. I can see it in both the consumer and business segments. A person walking down the street of a city they’ve never been to before getting directions on where to eat or the nearest museum. Also a firefighter responding to a building fire and knowing exactly where the staircases are or the nearest water source. Real life functions that can be used by most people. Will it ever come to life? Not sure but the iPhone could be a catalyst to these new innovations.
Having a consumer base is what separated Apple and Google from MS, which is why I said it’s not the same. MS has more to prove and would need to hit a home run with consumers. Yes they have lots of businesses in the fold but we know that’s not where things are headed. It could be these systems are not focusing on the same market and, therefore, not really in direct competition but I’m not sure that’s possible any more.
To me, I’m not married to any one system, I can easily switch (and have before) anytime I want. As things develop or change I will decide what works best for me and gives me the best bang for the buck. I’m an observer holding on to my money until I decide where to spend it. I’m perfectly happy right now though with my iPhone 7 which I bought used and has all the modern conveniences I want and need.

 

[Drael646464]

Re: How do people see you when you say to them that "You are using Windows phone”?

This is different than what you said originally, and I can’t say I disagree. As devices become more similar in function (already happening) a lot less people will be willing to pay a premium price. Apple perfected this revolution and they will need to find a way to advance it.
I don’t have the knowledge to say what the next big thing will be, but I think we have to stay cognizant of what people want and use. I know, for instance, Apple is working on prescription glasses with AR function. That to me is revolutionary and something consumers might use. I can see it in both the consumer and business segments. A person walking down the street of a city they’ve never been to before getting directions on where to eat or the nearest museum. Also a firefighter responding to a building fire and knowing exactly where the staircases are or the nearest water source. Real life functions that can be used by most people. Will it ever come to life? Not sure but the iPhone could be a catalyst to these new innovations.
Having a consumer base is what separated Apple and Google from MS, which is why I said it’s not the same. MS has more to prove and would need to hit a home run with consumers. Yes they have lots of businesses in the fold but we know that’s not where things are headed. It could be these systems are not focusing on the same market and, therefore, not really in direct competition but I’m not sure that’s possible any more.
To me, I’m not married to any one system, I can easily switch (and have before) anytime I want. As things develop or change I will decide what works best for me and gives me the best bang for the buck. I’m an observer holding on to my money until I decide where to spend it. I’m perfectly happy right now though with my iPhone 7 which I bought used and has all the modern conveniences I want and need.

Yeah MSFT is working on the same thing sorta:https://forums.windowscentral.com/e...s-virtual-augmented-reality%2F&token=6PjD13zE

Seems like the technology has some initial limitations. What MSFT has created doesn't display anything like as nicely as the HoloLens. It's monochromatic and somewhat see-through. And there's no computer parts inside it yet (those smartglasses that go have computer parts, like the google 'glass' or some camera glasses have thicker computer parts in the bits that go ontop of your ears)

The other issue with this tech is the health hazards associated with 3g/LTE etc. Ie the suspected brain carcinogencity from heavy use of cellphones.

It almost makes sense to have another seperate device, like a smartwatch for the computer parts and network access. And of course, how to control it - without the gesture detection of HoloLens, one might need something like the voice control of the google glass. Or gesture detection using a smart ring or smart watch.


I've heard the rumours about this from apple, and I'm keen to see what they've come up with. It's not an easy set of technologies to combine at this early stage. Perhaps they have some new display tech. Definately keen to see it.

The other suspect for me, personally, is an AI based search. Something like a search engine that you ask a natural language question, it understands the question, and gives a single answer. Like amazon echo, or google assistant, but actually powered by AI, instead of a bot and an algorithm. No ones given any rumours about this, it's just me watching their business acquisitions (such as an AI catergorizer/indexer, that could be used to organise the web into subject catergories) and partnerships (IBM- Watson answers natural questions). If apple entered search I'm pretty sure they could easily steal 15-20 percent of googles profits, and that would be a solid holdover till the next big thing.


I don't think anything will hit the adoption rates of the smartphone again for quite some time. Certainly not IoT, AI isn't mature enough, nor AR IMO (yet - and in this is not just hardware its software ecosystem too). Folding tablets won't come for awhile.

VR would be my only bet for something that will really grow soon. Especially once they are cheap, cable-free and can be used without set-up from a game console. But those certainly won't reach smartphone adoption levels. But they might prove to be a bit of a boom for the console and gaming industry.

Myself on a purely intellectual level, I'm interested in the evolution of technology, and also the business strategies. So I have that sort of big picture, objective angle on things. I also respect the unique contributions and philosophies of each company.

As a consumer, I'm experimental. I like playing around with things a bit. I don't just use what works, I like to discover. I owned an Amstrad a vic20, used the bulletin boards before the internet, used blackberry, windows phone, android. I'd quite like to give chrome a spin when it gets Linux, and if osx ever goes touch I might give that a trial.

But as a person, I think one of these major tech companies (apple, google, Microsoft), will probably become the overlord of our future. When you consider matter printing, AI, etc, at some point most labour, and most commodities will probably be the IP of some tech company. If I had to pick one company that constructed my house, and was my GP, had all of my data, and provided my food - I'd probably pick Microsoft over the others. I simply trust their ethics more. So I do have a team I root for, it's just that when I look at the technical advances, the present day, the business, I don't really think about it that way. I guess the same way you can watch an MMA fight and see a chess battle, instead of some dude pounding the bloody life out of some other dude.

 

[anon(50597)]

I can see that there may be room for all.
Not everyone will want prescription glasses with AR.
Not everyone will want a folding tablet nonphone that runs the same as your computer.
Not everyone will want to continue to carry a smartphone.
Perhaps there’s room (markets) for all of these things?
Interesting.

 

[Drael646464]

I can see that there may be room for all.
Not everyone will want prescription glasses with AR.
Not everyone will want a folding tablet nonphone that runs the same as your computer.
Not everyone will want to continue to carry a smartphone.
Perhaps there’s room (markets) for all of these things?
Interesting.

Sure, although there also "scroll" devices (like a literal scrollcase with a screen that rolls out). So some variations on the flexible screen for different people. For mobile devices, quite a bit of variation I'd expect. Smart watches and wearables too.

Same with stationary computers. Some things more like consoles (with PC functions), some VR, perhaps some holograms, some sever like setups, some AI, some touch screens. Probably sort of distributed through the home and office and connected to all the devices.

I don't see a single device being used by everyone. More like a jungle of devices. Which is part of why a hybrid OS is important. But there's probably room for more than one company in all that too, so long as they "play nice" with other companies. Like if one company locked down the best AI, or IoT devices, and they worked with whomever made the best hybrid OS.

 

[Sick Freak]

Yep - that happens to me almost every week. People see me (still) using my Windows phone and almost always someone is very interested and they never knew there was such a thing. Microsoft did a great job of advertising the Surface, but I never once saw an ad for any of their phones.

 

[Dwarf_King]

They envy my awesome Lumia 950 XL camera and the sexy screen. I then tell them that I do not need to handle over all my personal information to google or Facebook and they then start asking about apps. I then show them the pin to start function in Microsoft Edge and Monument Browser and then they want the phone badly When I show them that I can bring extra batteries fully charged along and even easily change them they are all like woow! When I show them how my phones sms pops up on my desktop and laptop they go all fan beserk. Then I show them how powerful gaming is on the phone and they instantly go and search for one only to realize that the mighty Lumia 950 XL is only available as second hand now in most places... I am a proud Windows 10 mobile user.

Sendt from my Lumia 950 XL and edited from my Win 10 PC.

 

[Keith White Jr]

I still don't understand why everyone uses inferior phones such as Android and iPhone.

Apps

 

[anon(50597)]

Apps

Plus they are supported and still developed.
Far from inferior in many eyes.

 

[fatclue_98]

Plus they are supported and still developed.
Far from inferior in many eyes.

Inferior no, different........yes. Inefficient? A case could be made. But the mobile landscape is littered with "better" systems that never took hold and Windows is on the "via dolorosa".

Sent from my Lumia 950 on mTalk

 

[anon(50597)]

Inferior no, different........yes. Inefficient? A case could be made. But the mobile landscape is littered with "better" systems that never took hold and Windows is on the "via dolorosa".

Sent from my Lumia 950 on mTalk

Efficiency is of course subjective. So is “better”.
I find it impossible, and ridiculous, to argue those points because we all want and need different things. I ultimately wish BlackBerry, WP and even your favorite, webos, were all still going strong. Think how that would push innovation!
But it all comes down to survival and that’s determined by many things: marketing, support and even luck. I’ve used them all and suppose I will continue to do that and use what’s best for me at the moment. At this moment it’s iOS. Next week might be different.

 

[anon(8532178)]

LoL they tell me it's trash well when I use it for media consumption like today.