No need to wait for Windows 10 anymore
- Thread starter seb_r
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TechFreak1
Moderator
Lets put some prospective about the points you have made. Hopefully this will stop you from perpetuating such....drivel :winktongue::grincry:.
Hmm, really?
So a over hauled outlook app doesn't address a flaw in Windows Phone 8.x?
Where one can neither attach office documents but share a single office document via the office hub. Or multiple documents via a file picker, however such practises are just wrong - sharing secure links are best practice. This eliminates the issue of multiple file versions, emails with incorrect subject headers, badly scanned files that are not compressed but at an attrocious dpi level just to get the darn thing attached or just flung into the scanner with staples attached etc etc.
So the ability to reply to text messages in line without leaving what your doing, is not an improvement?
So the addition of being able to move the keyboard & snap to either left or right hand side of the screen - not an improvement?
So the incorporation of full office is not a benefit?
So the redesign of the setting screen doesn't address the gripe of most users?
I could go on forever.
Hmm ******** way of multi tasking, if your talking about the current system.
It is far from ********, what was ******** was the multi tasking in IOS until IOS 7.
I admit how the back stack was implemented in Windows Phone prior to implementation of swipe down to close / x button was just....:angry:.
In regards to the "resuming screen" that is down to poor code optimisation and you stated that "VOIP apps need to run in the foreground", care to give examples?
It is one thing to state something as a fact with evidence and another thing entirely when no evidence is given to support such a statement.
A developer does not need to run their own cloud services to support push notifications, an indie dev can tie into Microsoft Azure and enable such notifications via a IAP. For mobile app developers with deep pockets the cost is just standard business practice (of course games don't really need such notifications).
Also It is not MS's job to implement a background agent for a developer, if the developer is lazy than there is no fix for that.
What are you referring to? Wi Fi or Cellular?
Again - be specific.
Apps operate in a secure container so they don't have access to functions / areas of the phones they have no business in touching.
That is most likely coming with Windows 10, why?
Because they are trying get back into the enterprise market, which they abandoned trying to emulate apple with the consumer centric Wp7. Despite the fact Windows Mobile 6.x had way more "pull" in the enterprise segment. Also Windows 10 has been designed to win back the enterprise as Windows 8 was far too alien and had a "perceived steep" learning curve. The additional benefit it brings back the crowd who stayed away from 8 and stuck to Windows 7 / XP.
I'm curious have you used the tools??
Or just spewing what you have read on the internet, as I really doubt you have used them.
Yes, the Microsoft apps are better on other platforms which may appear as shock to you. But it is just business, pure & simple - as this way they ensure users are not using competing services. The catch 22 is, windows phone users felt like left in the dark - many of us wanted App Parity (myself included). However there are insane amount of changes that are coming to phones with Windows 10 - it is astonishing - so I am happy to wait. [Just look at the ShenZen WinHec documentation].
Also Blackberry used an older version of Android for emulation (it is now better than before but the damage has been done - just like the silliness with the blackberry playbook) and like with anything emulated you are going to need a lot of resources for a smooth experience.
A flagship is coming which has been reiterated time & time again.
But Some just don't get it, if you had a choice in releasing a flagship product that did nothing new or was different from the competition or didn't operate at it's full potential without an update. With thanks to US carriers may take an eternity to get pushed out. Would you release it?
Your ignorance here sadly speaks volumes, the delays are down to carrier testing & approval.
The technical preview for phones, was launched near on 6 months after the desktop preview. Designing, implementing & reiterating an o/s is not as simple as pressing a button or peeling an orange.
Windows 10 for Phones is not delayed, it is called a staggered release as a) it keeps them in the news cycle thereby attracting mind share b) reduces workload, they aren't machines but people like everyone else.
Sure, I would love them release everything in one full sweep but that is not realistic let alone practical; as the scale of task would be monstrous. Let me put it into prospective {not an exhaustive list}:
In regards to desktop windows being a construction site, remind me has Google ever finished those betas? :winktongue:
They (Microsoft) have said that Windows will always be updated and to think of it as Windows as Service (not a subscription service). Never the less no software is final until it has been completely EOLed.
You haven't been using Windows Phone long enough have you?
The 1520 was launched prior to the Nokia D & S division acquisition as such Microsoft can not do much about it. Then the re-org came and that would have put quite a lot of stuff on the back burner.
The touch screen issue on the 535 was down to reduction of cost for production. In order to hit low price points with a high spec, lower quality parts had to be used. Of course they could have ordered everything in bulk to reduce cost but means you have dead stock if you do not sell along with other fiscal ramifications.
RT is not dead, RT really stands for RUN TIME and in this context your referring to O/S that ran on a limited number of tablets. The Arm version of Windows is not dead either, just the Surface 2, Surface 1, Lumia 2520 along with others won't be progressing.
As callous as it sounds - it is easier to have an unified install base as opposed to supporting legacy especially at a time when coding hours are extremely priceless.
If your looking for a playground check out Microsoft research.
Solid platform?
So remaining stagnant and not innovating can be seen as a solid platform, interesting /s.
Remind us again how big is the install base of Windows compared to say OSX or Chrome O/S?
In regards to Windows 10 being on the right track, that is subjective as some love how Windows 8 worked and loath the changes in 10. Some are resistant to change whereas others are not so.
It is just like Marmite, you either love it or hate.
I for agree, that Windows 10 is on the right track and as whole, the way forward. But there are things that I do not agree with and have given feedback via the feedback app.
Hmm, really?
So a over hauled outlook app doesn't address a flaw in Windows Phone 8.x?
Where one can neither attach office documents but share a single office document via the office hub. Or multiple documents via a file picker, however such practises are just wrong - sharing secure links are best practice. This eliminates the issue of multiple file versions, emails with incorrect subject headers, badly scanned files that are not compressed but at an attrocious dpi level just to get the darn thing attached or just flung into the scanner with staples attached etc etc.
So the ability to reply to text messages in line without leaving what your doing, is not an improvement?
So the addition of being able to move the keyboard & snap to either left or right hand side of the screen - not an improvement?
So the incorporation of full office is not a benefit?
So the redesign of the setting screen doesn't address the gripe of most users?
I could go on forever.
Hmm ******** way of multi tasking, if your talking about the current system.
It is far from ********, what was ******** was the multi tasking in IOS until IOS 7.
I admit how the back stack was implemented in Windows Phone prior to implementation of swipe down to close / x button was just....:angry:.
In regards to the "resuming screen" that is down to poor code optimisation and you stated that "VOIP apps need to run in the foreground", care to give examples?
It is one thing to state something as a fact with evidence and another thing entirely when no evidence is given to support such a statement.
A developer does not need to run their own cloud services to support push notifications, an indie dev can tie into Microsoft Azure and enable such notifications via a IAP. For mobile app developers with deep pockets the cost is just standard business practice (of course games don't really need such notifications).
Also It is not MS's job to implement a background agent for a developer, if the developer is lazy than there is no fix for that.
What are you referring to? Wi Fi or Cellular?
Again - be specific.
Apps operate in a secure container so they don't have access to functions / areas of the phones they have no business in touching.
That is most likely coming with Windows 10, why?
Because they are trying get back into the enterprise market, which they abandoned trying to emulate apple with the consumer centric Wp7. Despite the fact Windows Mobile 6.x had way more "pull" in the enterprise segment. Also Windows 10 has been designed to win back the enterprise as Windows 8 was far too alien and had a "perceived steep" learning curve. The additional benefit it brings back the crowd who stayed away from 8 and stuck to Windows 7 / XP.
I'm curious have you used the tools??
Or just spewing what you have read on the internet, as I really doubt you have used them.
Yes, the Microsoft apps are better on other platforms which may appear as shock to you. But it is just business, pure & simple - as this way they ensure users are not using competing services. The catch 22 is, windows phone users felt like left in the dark - many of us wanted App Parity (myself included). However there are insane amount of changes that are coming to phones with Windows 10 - it is astonishing - so I am happy to wait. [Just look at the ShenZen WinHec documentation].
Also Blackberry used an older version of Android for emulation (it is now better than before but the damage has been done - just like the silliness with the blackberry playbook) and like with anything emulated you are going to need a lot of resources for a smooth experience.
A flagship is coming which has been reiterated time & time again.
But Some just don't get it, if you had a choice in releasing a flagship product that did nothing new or was different from the competition or didn't operate at it's full potential without an update. With thanks to US carriers may take an eternity to get pushed out. Would you release it?
Your ignorance here sadly speaks volumes, the delays are down to carrier testing & approval.
The technical preview for phones, was launched near on 6 months after the desktop preview. Designing, implementing & reiterating an o/s is not as simple as pressing a button or peeling an orange.
Windows 10 for Phones is not delayed, it is called a staggered release as a) it keeps them in the news cycle thereby attracting mind share b) reduces workload, they aren't machines but people like everyone else.
Sure, I would love them release everything in one full sweep but that is not realistic let alone practical; as the scale of task would be monstrous. Let me put it into prospective {not an exhaustive list}:
- Making sure you have enough supply for demand
- Staff trained & clued up for sale day
- Your distribution partners primed for launch so they can gear up their staff, if there are any changes in refund policies that they all are aware of such changes.
- Marketing events going live simultaneously with the unveil such as on the day promotions, if they are region specific, market or country specific etc etc
In regards to desktop windows being a construction site, remind me has Google ever finished those betas? :winktongue:
They (Microsoft) have said that Windows will always be updated and to think of it as Windows as Service (not a subscription service). Never the less no software is final until it has been completely EOLed.
You haven't been using Windows Phone long enough have you?
The 1520 was launched prior to the Nokia D & S division acquisition as such Microsoft can not do much about it. Then the re-org came and that would have put quite a lot of stuff on the back burner.
The touch screen issue on the 535 was down to reduction of cost for production. In order to hit low price points with a high spec, lower quality parts had to be used. Of course they could have ordered everything in bulk to reduce cost but means you have dead stock if you do not sell along with other fiscal ramifications.
RT is not dead, RT really stands for RUN TIME and in this context your referring to O/S that ran on a limited number of tablets. The Arm version of Windows is not dead either, just the Surface 2, Surface 1, Lumia 2520 along with others won't be progressing.
As callous as it sounds - it is easier to have an unified install base as opposed to supporting legacy especially at a time when coding hours are extremely priceless.
If your looking for a playground check out Microsoft research.
Solid platform?
So remaining stagnant and not innovating can be seen as a solid platform, interesting /s.
Remind us again how big is the install base of Windows compared to say OSX or Chrome O/S?
In regards to Windows 10 being on the right track, that is subjective as some love how Windows 8 worked and loath the changes in 10. Some are resistant to change whereas others are not so.
It is just like Marmite, you either love it or hate.
I for agree, that Windows 10 is on the right track and as whole, the way forward. But there are things that I do not agree with and have given feedback via the feedback app.
Kram Sacul
New member
He went back to Android, Nexus 4, MS screwed up WP, Windows 10 sucks, I think.
Even if Windows 10 for Phones is a total visual and usability train wreck I don't see myself going back to Android anytime soon. Sticking with 8.1 seems like a better option.
prasath1234
New member
Ya me too am super happy with windows phone 8.1.I will use my browser to get information as opposed to apps.
Allen Rhodes
New member
So many opinions here. Especially anti WP ones. Which is ironic being that ita a WP board. I wonder if I smell an agenda or just stinky BS? No need for wannabe bloggers clogging these forums. TAke the OP and give it to MacRumors. "WP is done", lmao. All this time its been "app gap" now its security and the rest. Run away back to snicker doodle or milky way, whatever professional name they give that virus factory of a phone OS, im happy with the OS I have.
The point you should be focusing on that TP runs on same core as PC, plus Microsoft have lots in their pockets for PC. They just showed it in Build, WinHEC, Ignite. PC build is almost finished. As we consider phone build for Windows 10, it isn't. Well, bunch of APIs are non essential. Few should be excluded from the ecosystem to provide better security. Porting if Android and iOS apps are optimum solution, its like if you want to reach on 100th floor they take you halfway already, so rather than starting from scratch you actually have a beginning.
My words!
+1
All apps can. But the question is how big is the lack of functionality compared to other OS
You got an overview of these?
Do you need that kind of amount of security? I wonder. And obviously that is not the priority for most consumers, see the market share WP has.
Like on most things: no clear statement.
Good for you...
Me too, with features / functions missing.
Yeah, as usual developers fault, scnr
Well actually I refer to the way apps being treated by theOS, not the resuming. Doesn't matter which app as it is limitation by system but if you wanna have names: zoiper.Yeah...damn developers
Signal strength, traffic / data used, distinguish between H and H+ (all for cellular). I could go on forever...
Why not simply allow the user at the time of installation what the app can actually access and what not?!
Link?
For games not an option, that's true. For "normal" apps things are different.
No official statement or announcement while the 1520 disappeared in stores for months and the fanboys craving for a new flagship.
Your's too. Many carriers pushed out Updates to their phones even before the CV's got it. I experienced with my 1520 Denim.
They claim a unique user experience with Windows 10. That simply starts by the availabilty on all devices at the same time. That won't come true anyways since Windows RT won't get Windows 10. They focus on desktop, leaving the mobile-devices-playground behind.
An update is intended to fix bugs but not add new functions in general etc. Well, nice way to cover it in candy that you don't get your things done on time.
You realize you find an excuse for ANYTHING MS does? Do you work for them? lol
Any evidence?
Not neccessarily. Any proof for that theory? Well then for the 1520 must have been used the same cheap parts lol. Actually it has turned out that the reason for this behavior on the 1520 is board flexing, EMI and improper grounding. That also explains why replacing the display unit is not always a cure.
No matter what you call it, they abandon it.
Explain to those people who spent much on these devices or being early adopters. Just because you not have one of these devices you don't care. Pretty ignorant.
= ******
Good for you, nobody force you to update. Obviously you not doing much if you only need a browser on your phone and no Apps.
David_da_Silva
New member
all your answers to that persons remarks are just complete bull****, sorry if that offends you but clearly you have no idea in general what you are talking about, regardless if its about wp or not.
TechFreak1
Moderator
Check out the WINHEC Shenzen documentation on channel9.msdn.com & the other reputable sources like Mary Jo Foley's blog for instance.
That is all I will say on that.
Yeah, as usual developers fault, scnr
I see, well time will tell how the Rich Comunication Suite will evolve as at the Jan 21st event where they said they are working on building in support (into the messaging hub) so that IP based messaging systems can integrate.
Not all devs are the same.
Signal strength and for connection types would need a refresh rate of per second (most likely less). Live Tiles can currently refresh per minute (the lowest interval I'm aware of), I imagine it comes down to battery life and security as a poorly coded app would wreak havoc.
In terms off monitoring data traffic for Cellular or Wi Fi there is data sense and if your carrier has removed that functionality then blame your carrier.
Allowing third party apps to monitor your traffic does takes this into a grey area.
With everything out there are pros & cons therefore additions to for phones must be evaluated on stringent basis as they have become such an integral part of people's daily routine. If a feature or function doesn't negatively impact useability, performance & security then it either gets implemented as a feature / function or goes under further re-iteration + testing. However if a feature or function negatively impacts said factors - it doesn't make it off the drawing board / thrown down the garbage chute.
You need to understand, an operating system is never designed by a committee but influenced by said committee.
Extended permissions are coming with Windows 10 as they are in WP 8.1 update 2, however a user has somewhat a choice as all apps have to display what they will be accessing when installed. These are detailed under "Notes" in the "details pivot" in the store app, the issue here is that some devs don't tick off the irrelevant permissions not needed by their app.
There isn't a link, it is just logical as the over haul to Windows 10 is really to appease their enterprise customers and the consumers who did not take to Windows 8.x hence why I said it is most likely coming with Windows 10
However logic & microsoft don't necessarily go hand in hand :grincry: (which is both - good & bad)
Not really, the same principle applies if the emulation engine or the software emulating is poorly optimised... combined with poorly written code = crappy experience. In addition to this even if the emulating software is efficient it will still result in a below subpar performance as the emulated app is poorly written. So it goes both ways.
Microsoft commits to a Windows 10 'flagship smartphone' for 2015 | Windows Central
Sounds like your crying as well, so what does that make you? :evil: (rhetorical question)
So i'm the ignorant one, huh prior to the D & S division acquisition Nokia used to have an availability page which would list where in the cycle and update was. From which users would berate their carriers for the update sooo it's only natural that Microsoft being a US based entity is subject to other pressures from the carriers (which is clearly evident by the removal of Microsoft apps from Samsung's latest offerings by US Carriers). After the acquisition this page was dumbed down and only shows if an update is available or not, no listing of where the update is in the cycle. Plus the instance where an update was pushed back to "testing" caused a furor amongst users most likely would have contributed to that dumbing down.
In regards to Country Variant's getting updates last, well certain country variants got it first, some last for Cyan. However other factors are most likely involved so without knowing the complete facts it's easy to speculate.
So it is no means as clear cut as being just Microsoft's fault as you have so clearly indicated in your rant.
Continuum for phones, says otherwise along with the changes listed in the WINHEC documentation. Here is a tidbit since your clearly lazy to look things up :winktongue:.
Windows 10 for phone supports USB Mass Storage, peripherals and hubs | Windows Central
RT for the thousandth time is not dead, the Windows RunTime is evolving. The arm based sku's for tablets has not been abandoned either; tablets less than 7inches will run Windows 10 for phones (with some exceptions). I can understand the misconception if Microsoft had simply called the Surface RT as just "Surface", this common misconception wouldn't exist.
Here's a clue:
Office for Windows 10 free on phones and small tablets, Office 2016 on the way | Windows Central
In an ideal world, everyone would get the update on their phones at the same time.
But this not the Matrix where one can just magically conjure up a dream and manipulate it at their will.
This is reality, where limitations and last minute road blocks exist.:wink:
Shows how much you understand software development and I'm the ignorant one... eash.:grincry:
Says the one who says updates in general are just for bug fixes and then assumes i'm finding excuses... :evil:
Well I wish I worked for Microsoft just to play...err work in the "fancy play ground" (that you keep referring to) with Hololens along with the crazy geniuses at MSR :grin:.
No evidence, it's just pure business - just like how it costs Apple less than $85 for the hardware for the Apple Watch and that is apparently for their "low end model".
See above and in regards to the 1520 perhaps but that is hard to tell as many I know don't have that problem however some do. If it was as you stated than all 1520s will have a similar problem and would have been plastered all over the tech press. So source?
Apparently its how the housing is structured, just like not all screens are created equal (in terms of gorilla glass).
Yes, they most likely did and I'm not sugar coating it.
Just because they will not be progressing it doesn't mean they will just cease to work over night.
There is a trade in program for Surface 1 & Surface 2 (that is sadly US only right now) which expires on the 31st of May
Surface RT and Surface 2 owners in the US can get up to $150 off the Surface 3 with trade-in offer | Windows Central.
Also actually I bought several of these as gifts when they were reduced and to assume I don't care hah...
After going through all your points... it is apparent that your are either clearly emotional or just....full of sand... :winktongue:
aveese
New member
Cristian Constantin
New member
stenson625
New member
Windows phone is a nightmare of an OS compared to android and IOS, even to the newest Blackberry OS: Period!
You can defend this or that, but the truth is that it will forever keep having lowest market share, if it doesn't update its catch up game earlier than now that people still care about WP 10.
After WP 10 must have ignored all widely requested features in other OS's with bountiful excuses, then users and developers will find many excuses to keep to what always works, Android, IOS and Co.
You can defend this or that, but the truth is that it will forever keep having lowest market share, if it doesn't update its catch up game earlier than now that people still care about WP 10.
After WP 10 must have ignored all widely requested features in other OS's with bountiful excuses, then users and developers will find many excuses to keep to what always works, Android, IOS and Co.
Qtweeder
New member
oh my, there is always one massively long multi-quoter isn't there, addressing each and every counter point - get a room
stenson625
New member
Microsoft is still planning and re-planning, while Android and IOS are busy implementing new ideas that matter to users and developers. Let the hawks feed on the chicks! They are already owning the city!
The issue with not being able to use voip without the app in the foreground was resolved (at least on my phone) months ago. There was a time where I could only get Viber calls if I already had the app open. No longer the case. I'm willing to bet OP knows this but wanted to add some extra umph to his rant.
Charles Brown8
New member
I enjoy threads like this... Amusing... I'll keep my Icon. I'm enjoying it while my cousin with his Motorola Droid is throwing his phone against the windshield in frustration... Comical. Looking forwards to win 10 and what matters to me is it keeps the stability of WP 8.1.. All the extra features will be icing on the cake far as I'm concerned... Everyone have a great day 
Sedp23
Active member
Charles Brown8
New member
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