Will 'Blue' be bringing the start button back?

[Wacft]

I hope they do add the smaller icons. Apps like calc or paint don't need even the size of the current 1x1 tile. Of course it would be more efficient to search for those but those are two apps I always like to have pinned on the taskbar. If they were 1/4th the size of the 1x1 I would put them on my start screen.

 

[tgp]

How many programs/apps do you use? I find most of the apps I use I'm able to fit on the first part of the Start Screen. It does sound like MS will be adding smaller tile options like WP8 which will allow for more apps on the screen.

Smaller tiles would be great! Unless there's some live info to display, the tile only needs to be big enough to show what app it's for.

I don't expect my opinion on this to be popular here, but to me the Modern UI as a whole wastes a lot of space. I first thought about it on WP. People complain about the "boring" rows of icons on iOS & Android, but they are a much better utilization of space, which is especially valuable on a +/- 4" screen. For example, when I go to the app drawer on my WP I can see about 8 apps without scrolling. On my Android I can see 25 apps.

spaulagain, I know you're a Windows fan all the way, but as a designer what's your honest opinion? What are the advantages to making everything bigger that outweigh the disadvantage of higher real estate use?

 

[spaulagain]

Smaller tiles would be great! Unless there's some live info to display, the tile only needs to be big enough to show what app it's for.

I don't expect my opinion on this to be popular here, but to me the Modern UI as a whole wastes a lot of space. I first thought about it on WP. People complain about the "boring" rows of icons on iOS & Android, but they are a much better utilization of space, which is especially valuable on a +/- 4" screen. For example, when I go to the app drawer on my WP I can see about 8 apps without scrolling. On my Android I can see 25 apps.

spaulagain, I know you're a Windows fan all the way, but as a designer what's your honest opinion? What are the advantages to making everything bigger that outweigh the disadvantage of higher real estate use?

What many people think of as wasted space is actually very valuable. In design, white space is a very great tool to manage content and separate sections of it.

Also, there is an element of user interaction that is often ignored or overlooked, Decision/Choice Paralysis. People usually assume more choices are always better, when in fact too many choices may result in no action at all. Users become overwhelmed with the options in front of them and can't make a decision. So in many cases, less is more. By giving fewer options, you make the decision easier.

When you are on the go, the ability to glance and go is important. If you have 25 icons on a screen, that's a lot to sift through (visually) to find what you need. I've used a couple of my friends Android phones and can't stand it. Between their distracting backgrounds and a zillion app icons. Its difficult to find something.

I can understand how some people don't like the big text in the People hub, but think about how you interact. Would it really improve the experience if you have 3 more contacts on the main screen? most of the time you just search or use the letter jump link.

 

[spaulagain]

In general, I think people are just very used to the old computer interfaces. Heavy skeumorphism and cramming a lot of content into one area makes usability worse. Did you ever see GoDaddy's website about 5 years ago? So much going on the home page you couldn't find what you were looking for. Domain search, the primary use case, was buried in the rest of the content. Now look at their site, one giant search box in the middle.

 

[_Emi_]

start button is a waste of space... also there is already like 3 start buttons, well 4 if you press ctrl+esc. I don't understand why people would want it anyway... it would only help new users but it would be better if Microsoft made a better tutorial you check "don't show next time" to get rid of it. because then... I guess it would be turned off by default since I don't want to disable (because I hope there is an option to disable it) everytime I install windows 8 in a machine.

but yeah... start button is a waste of space, some people say they find it useful if they are in remote desktop or something like that. but I can navigate good with existing start buttons.
I like taskbar as it is now, clean and only useful icons with programs I will use or im using. not a button that will not do much difference (since it will open start screen anyway)

but this is of course my experience, and I hope they don't bring it back and instead walk around about it making useful tutorial how to navigate windows 8, because new win8 apps wont have start button so people need to know how to navigate around them aswell not only desktop.

 

[tgp]

Also, there is an element of user interaction that is often ignored or overlooked, Decision/Choice Paralysis. People usually assume more choices are always better, when in fact too many choices may result in no action at all. Users become overwhelmed with the options in front of them and can't make a decision. So in many cases, less is more. By giving fewer options, you make the decision easier.

You mean like trying to choose laundry detergent at the grocery store? You nailed it here!

When you are on the go, the ability to glance and go is important. If you have 25 icons on a screen, that's a lot to sift through (visually) to find what you need. I've used a couple of my friends Android phones and can't stand it. Between their distracting backgrounds and a zillion app icons. Its difficult to find something.

Yes I see your point here, but I'm not totally on board. I think that most people don't need to search for stuff. After using our devices for a bit we know where everything is. We just need to navigate to the location. In this case 25 icons on a screen is better than 8. I know that I spend a lot more time opening apps from the app drawer on my WP than my Android. On the WP I need to swipe, swipe, swipe until I get to it. If I "shove" it I have to stop it eventually, and then it may or may not be anywhere close to where the app is. Using the search is easy enough, but it takes more taps. Overall it takes more time. In my opinion the only advantage WP's UI has over iOS or Android is appearance. I think the looks is better, but I don't think it's more practical in real life.

And just for interest's sake, I use a plain black wallpaper on my Nexus 4 (technically on Android it's no wallpaper). Partially to eliminate distraction, and partially for battery conservation. I'm not big on customization, and I don't use a fraction of what's available. I do use widgets though.

 

[Reflexx]

In general, I think people are just very used to the old computer interfaces. Heavy skeumorphism and cramming a lot of content into one area makes usability worse. Did you ever see GoDaddy's website about 5 years ago? So much going on the home page you couldn't find what you were looking for. Domain search, the primary use case, was buried in the rest of the content. Now look at their site, one giant search box in the middle.

I don't think people are really stuck on the skeumorphism. I think it's more about workflow.

Certain actions are automatic. You know exactly where to go and what to do because you've done it a million times before.

It's not that the Start Menu is "better." It's that the changes are drastic enough to hamper speed and productivity because people have gone from what is easy and automatic, to relearning how to do something. The same task they were able to do just fine before.

A nice and easy transition would have been preferable.

A Start Button that is visible. Even if it opens up the Start Screen. That at least tells the new user that the Start Screen is the new Start Menu.

People will need to transition to a new way of working. But there's something to be said about making that transition as easy as possible.

 

[Daniel Ratcliffe]

[WARN]And if one moderator wasn't enough, there's another one here now. Any more personal attacks and I will fearlessly hand out infractions. Consider mine and my colleague's posts as official warnings.[/WARN]

 

[spaulagain]

I don't think people are really stuck on the skeumorphism. I think it's more about workflow.

Certain actions are automatic. You know exactly where to go and what to do because you've done it a million times before.

It's not that the Start Menu is "better." It's that the changes are drastic enough to hamper speed and productivity because people have gone from what is easy and automatic, to relearning how to do something. The same task they were able to do just fine before.

A nice and easy transition would have been preferable.

A Start Button that is visible. Even if it opens up the Start Screen. That at least tells the new user that the Start Screen is the new Start Menu.

People will need to transition to a new way of working. But there's something to be said about making that transition as easy as possible.

I agree that they needed to be more incremental with the changes. Especially with them switching to more frequent updates. My issue is the people that already know about it, and want the button back. That's just silly.

Microsoft's demo video in the beginning is not detailed enough. It only shows the charms bar.

 

[berty6294]

The charm bar SHOULD be the replacement of the start menu.