Win 8 features seem to be coming back... how far?

[swanlee]

It would be confusing for the user if tablet mode is too different from desktop mode. They have to compromise the quality of the user experience in both modes to merge them, but It seems desktop mode will be privileged in Windows 10.

Well why even have two modes if Tablet mode doesn't really work well on Tablets? Having two separate modes means that each mode should be tailored for the exact device your running it on.

 

[swanlee]

My info is coming from talking to people who are using the Win10 TP. Are you sure these things are all wrong? Why would TP testers be lying? Sounds unlikely to me.

If this is where you are getting your info then I'm sorry but they are either lying to you are they don't know what they are talking about.

I've been running TP since day one on my gen one Surface and am on 10061

Taskbar is still present at all times, Autohide of the taskbar is barely working and is not a viable option to get rid of the taskbar. Their still is no Full screen Metro IE like Web browsing experience. Their is no charm bars at all in this build or any previous Win 10 builds.

10061 barely addresses the major issues with Win 10 on tablet and is more of a GUI polish.

 

[b0blight]

If this is where you are getting your info then I'm sorry but they are either lying to you are they don't know what they are talking about.

I've been running TP since day one on my gen one Surface and am on 10061

Taskbar is still present at all times, Autohide of the taskbar is barely working and is not a viable option to get rid of the taskbar. Their still is no Full screen Metro IE like Web browsing experience. Their is no charm bars at all in this build or any previous Win 10 builds.

10061 barely addresses the major issues with Win 10 on tablet and is more of a GUI polish.

Spartan, heck, even all the new modern apps are designed to work with one UI regardless touch or keyboard/mouse. This is done to keep a consistent experience across all devices. There is no "Metro Mode" in Spartan because it is designed to work for both. Someone explain it above already. Please read.

 

[swanlee]

Spartan, heck, even all the new modern apps are designed to work with one UI regardless touch or keyboard/mouse. This is done to keep a consistent experience across all devices. There is no "Metro Mode" in Spartan because it is designed to work for both. Someone explain it above already. Please read.

See the thing is this line of thinking doesn't work on tablets. The currently "designed to work on both" attitude is BS because it is simply not optimized for a real tablet experience. Firefox and regualr IE "work" with touch devices but it certainly isn't optimized for touch like Metro IE was.

Currently what MS considers designed to work on both = Taskbars, Address bars, Tab bars being always visible always taking up screen space. That is hardly a real Tablet optimized experience when Tablets will always have smaller screens. Right now Web Browsing in Win 10 either on Spartan or IE 20% of screen real estate is taken up by static Taskbars, Address bars, Tab Bars, Navigation bars etc.

Metro IE gave you 100% of your valuable Tablet screen space for content consumption. And if you wanted to pull out the address bars, tab bars and other options you could do so without it ALWAYS taking up screen space.

And as far as Metro Apps go they are not FULL Screen in Win 10 they are "maximized with taskbar" not full screen cause the always on Taskbar is still present. This really hampers RDP metro apps like VMware Horizon that will not correctly display full screen RDP sessions unless you hide the taskbar.

 

[AndyCalling]

This is both worrying and hard to understand. When I ask questions of some TP testers on these forums they confirm that full screen is working fine and even in this thread that Spartan is a Metro app (with IE being only a desktop app now, I presume?). Then others report that such is total nonsense and not true at all. Some say the task bar can now be disabled in the Metro full screen interface, others claim it can't and the only option is to 'hide' it (which would affect both desktop AND Metro interfaces) which would not be suitable at all. Same seems to be true of all the questions I have asked?

How come understanding is so confused about the Win10 TP? Is this because some testers are on this 'slow ring' version and perhaps these changes are only in the 'fast ring' version? It certainly seems like people are talking about two different Win10 concepts here.

Really, I'm trying to work out what is the LATEST information here and form it into a concept of how the Win8 mechanisms are being ported to Win10. Very hard when contradiction seems to be the main concept behind Win10.

Perhaps I shall just have to abandon the whole Win10 idea until the basic concept of the thing is better formed and more communicable. Currently it seems a mess, as even people testing it can't agree on the basics of what they are seeing.

If anyone has any clue as to what is going on here I am keen to hear it. I can't promise to understand it though.

 

[swanlee]

I'm on the Fast ring and am running the current Build on a Gen one Surface Pro and I can assure you what you've been told is Bullcrap

Taskbar cannot be disabled. You can select to "Autohide" the taskbar just like you could in every windows build since Win 98. However Autohide does not work well, it is not touch sensitive like the Charm bars were here is the key you can't manually swipe to make it appear and then swipe to make it disappear it stays on and turns off on it's own quirky timer that you can't adjust, it stays on screen to long and doesn't come back well when you need it. This is not a currently viable option because of how buggy and intermittent it is.

Their is ZERO way to Surf the Web right now in Win 10 WITHOUT on screen Address bars, Tab Bars, Navigation Bars etc. Maybe you could install Firefox or Chrome and disable all these elements but as far as IE or Spartan their is absolutely NOT a full screen web browsing mode that acts like Metro IE did in Win 8.

Seriously watch this video as someone posted above, this is Win 10 10061 on a tablet. Notice all the Taskbars, Address bars, Tab bars, Navigation bars etc. This is what it is right now.

https://youtu.be/W93cq713X7U

 

[AndyCalling]

I shall watch that tonight after work.

Sounds like there's a significant group of people giving out false information regarding Win10 though. Sounds like it's not going to be an option for users unless they only use a desktop PC without touch functionality. This was what I thought it was before this miss information campaign got going.

So, basically none of the points I have been led to believe were corrected have been addressed at all by MS? Great. So Win10 is headed bin-ward then.

Doesn't look good for the future of Metro touch apps then. Universal they may be, but why would a desktop PC user with no touch interface choose a touch oriented app over a desktop app (even if you can force it into a desktop window for some reason)? Makes the MS Store kind of pointless in Win10, and unlikely to attract devs.

Win8 sounds like the way forward. I can't even really see the point of running 10 under Hyper-V at this point. It just seems dead in the water. How disappointing.

 

[swanlee]

I shall watch that tonight after work.

Sounds like there's a significant group of people giving out false information regarding Win10 though. Sounds like it's not going to be an option for users unless they only use a desktop PC without touch functionality. This was what I thought it was before this miss information campaign got going.

So, basically none of the points I have been led to believe were corrected have been addressed at all by MS? Great. So Win10 is headed bin-ward then.

Doesn't look good for the future of Metro touch apps then. Universal they may be, but why would a desktop PC user with no touch interface choose a touch oriented app over a desktop app (even if you can force it into a desktop window for some reason)? Makes the MS Store kind of pointless in Win10, and unlikely to attract devs.

Win8 sounds like the way forward. I can't even really see the point of running 10 under Hyper-V at this point. It just seems dead in the water. How disappointing.

Yep the points you say are corrected are not corrected in your first post. Win 10 is still chock full off always on Taskbars, Address bars, Tab bars, Navigation bars even in Tablet mode. The full screen start menu still looks and acts like it did before. Win 10 is still also missing alot of swipe gestures from Win 8 like being able to quickly swipe through your open apps.

They are also doubling down on the taskbar being always on as the leaked vids of later builds show Cortana is built into the start button on the taskbar.

So yippee TASKBARS FOR EVERYONE !!!!!!

 

[AndyCalling]

Yea, looks like W10 is only going to be useable on the decreasing pool of legacy non-touch devices. We'll have to wait for Win12 to get an upgrade from Win8.

How disappointing. I can't see this Win10 bringing in much trade for MS if it is to be for legacy devices only. And I was starting to think differently. Thank goodness some properly informed people on this forum have been able to correct all the BS that some people are putting out there.

I wonder why all the lies from some testers? Very odd behaviour.

 

[synsh3k]

Windows 8 actually is made for touch screen device but its great when it come to processing as it does freezes unused background application on your RAM

 

[swanlee]

I've been watching the Build conference and I think we can say we have seen what Win 10 is going to look like and that is pretty much what we've seen so far Taskbars, Tab bars, Address bars, Navigation bars everywhere always on and always taking up screen space, also no full screen web browsing.

They even put a freaking taskbar on a phone in the demo.

So those saying we should WAIT WAIT WAIT to complain can really drop that excuse now.