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10-20-2014 12:38 PM
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  1. snowmutt's Avatar
    We'll have to wait and see how things pan out, but (aside from evil carrier medaling) all WP8+ devices will receive the update to Windows 10. How much benefit said update will bring depends on your device and its hardware, but everyone will get it nonetheless.

    EDIT: This is all purely my speculation. This is not officially endorsed and/or leaked info from Microsoft. Microsoft has yet to say anything on the subject, so I'm just speculating based on what I think will happen. Take my post with a grain of salt, as you should with all things written in public-forum posts on the Internet.
    Sorry swimswim- as of now I am completely sure of the future based on your legally binding post on our forums.

    Sucker....



    I feel we have about 8 months of threads like these. I also wonder if we will see any true "flagship" devices until mid next year as we wait on Windows 10 for Mobile Devices and Portable Computation Equipment, or whatever it is going to be called. But if I seem strangely silent on the matter, it is because I am trying to live down being wrong about WP7 devices being upgraded to WP8. I see no reason to jynx us again.
    Wp8 lvr likes this.
    10-13-2014 05:00 AM
  2. savagelizards's Avatar
    What would happen to the world as we know it if Microsoft simply expanded the Preview for Developers program and released OS updates and firmware directly for all users, perhaps with some licensing agreement that excluded the carriers from responsibility?

    That way we could all be on the latest firmware when we wanted.

    After all, iOS8 was released to everyone. There was no requirement for users to install it, and some who waited missed out of a few issues that early adopters encountered, but Apple and Microsoft are both capable of issuing carrier-agnostic updates.

    It sure would be nice to get the Cyan update for my Icon, and Microsoft now owns the firmware. Nokia Recovery software can correct any unforeseen errors. What would be the harm in letting tech-savvy users download and install it themselves?
    10-13-2014 06:06 PM
  3. davidewart's Avatar
    That is the carrier's job, over which MS has no control.
    I'm puzzled by this comment. Is this true for all carriers worldwide?
    10-13-2014 09:10 PM
  4. mjrtoo's Avatar
    What would happen to the world as we know it if Microsoft simply expanded the Preview for Developers program and released OS updates and firmware directly for all users, perhaps with some licensing agreement that excluded the carriers from responsibility?

    That way we could all be on the latest firmware when we wanted.

    After all, iOS8 was released to everyone. There was no requirement for users to install it, and some who waited missed out of a few issues that early adopters encountered, but Apple and Microsoft are both capable of issuing carrier-agnostic updates.

    It sure would be nice to get the Cyan update for my Icon, and Microsoft now owns the firmware. Nokia Recovery software can correct any unforeseen errors. What would be the harm in letting tech-savvy users download and install it themselves?
    See windows 10 tech preview posts. :)
    10-13-2014 11:03 PM
  5. a5cent's Avatar
    I'm puzzled by this comment. Is this true for all carriers worldwide?
    Well, I could have explained it better...

    The actual job of copying the update onto your device is done either by MS or the OEM. However, legal restrictions prevent them from doing so without carrier approval. It's the carrier's job to do what is necessary to approve an update.

    This is true for every carrier in the world, the processes carriers go through to approve an update can be very different however.
    Last edited by a5cent; 10-18-2014 at 07:06 PM. Reason: formatting
    10-14-2014 01:26 AM
  6. Mr Lebowski's Avatar
    Satya Nadella is a big fan of Spinal Tap so they've decided to skip Windows 10 and jump right to Windows 11
    10-14-2014 01:31 AM
  7. msirapian's Avatar
    Well, I could have explained it better...

    The actual job of copying the update onto your device is done either by MS or the OEM. However, legal restrictions prevent them from doing so without carrier approval. It's the carrier's job to do what is necessary to approve an update.

    This is true for every carrier in the world, the processes carriers go through to approve an update can be very different however.
    The most important risk, though, concerns operator variants. In Europe, I suspect the quantity of Country Variant models is higher than in the US (look at the 1020, ICON, etc. for instance). In France, some carriers have refused to update their variants in the past (nokia N8, even Black); in Germany (or the UK I don't remember) a carrier said they won't send Cyan but Denim directly, etc.

    But for the happy owners of Country Variant phones or, as I did for my branded 1020, owners of de-branded Lumias, the only responsible for pushing the updates is MS.

    And ironically, the CV ROM is much more versatile: the VVM registry keys in the FR CV ROM allow to use any French operator's VVM, while my original ROM contained only my initial carrier's keys.

    Back to the topic, when available, an unbranded (or debranded) Country variant device is probably the best way to mitigate the risk that an upgradeable device is not upgraded.
    10-14-2014 04:43 AM
  8. a5cent's Avatar
    The most important risk, though, concerns operator variants.

    I'm not 100% sure I understand your point, but I think I agree. Since it's mobile operators that decide whether an update that could run on our devices, actually gets installed on our devices, it follows that mobile operators are by far the biggest potential obstacle.



    With unbranded devices it can be (but isn't necessarily) MS that handles the distribution of OS+firmware. It started out that way, then Nokia started handling this for their own devices. I don't know if that changed again with the merger. I guess the important fact here, is that while it's MS or OEM that push updates to our phones, they legally control that process only for unbranded devices.
    10-14-2014 06:35 AM
  9. SSgt Bruskowiz's Avatar
    If Not ... Let us stop buying a Windows Phone even the cheapest one L530 and move to android one or IOS ..!!
    Thats a super brilliant idea..........................not.

    Jumping ship to what?
    You forget the reason why a lot of people crossed over to WP

    Besides that, does the most currently droid phones going to support Droid 5 ?
    ( not to mention that stil a lot of devices cant run 4.4 kitkat ).
    Does apple keep going to support two year old or older phones?

    Sorry dear fellow,
    i believe even without 10 on my phone, its stil a better alternative then Ios or Droid.
    10-14-2014 07:29 AM
  10. msirapian's Avatar
    I'm not 100% sure I understand your point, but I think I agree. Since it's mobile operators that decide whether an update that could run on our devices, actually gets installed on our devices, it follows that mobile operators are by far the biggest potential obstacle.



    With unbranded devices it can be (but isn't necessarily) MS that handles the distribution of OS+firmware. It started out that way, then Nokia started handling this for their own devices. I don't know if that changed again with the merger. I guess the important fact here, is that while it's MS or OEM that push updates to our phones, they legally control that process only for unbranded devices.
    Exactly. Microsoft is pushing 8.1.1 right now to the 930. In France, it's mainly the "Country Variant" (=unbranded) model. The operator branded ones (Orange, etc.) haven't received anything.

    In other terms, for a given model
    case a) Microsoft don't want to upgrade it: all devices (branded or not) are concerned
    case b) Microsoft want to upgrade it: then branded devices (for which firmwares are validated by carriers) have the risk that a given carrier says no, or doesn't want to validate the FW. This has happened in the past in France, and is happening now for some devices which won't receive Cyan just because the operator decided so.

    Anyway, the answer to the OP question is : wait & see ;)
    10-14-2014 03:24 PM
  11. Bobvfr's Avatar
    If Not ... Let us stop buying a Windows Phone even the cheapest one L530 and move to android one or IOS ..!!
    Go on then.



    But please be a gentleman about it and shut the door on the way out so we can't hear you moaning.




    Bob
    msirapian likes this.
    10-14-2014 03:43 PM
  12. eddieDOTexe's Avatar
    The hardware should be good enough to run it m8. We have Windows 8.1 tablets with 1gb of RAM being released these days!
    10-15-2014 01:08 AM
  13. Wp8 lvr's Avatar
    few days back Daniel stated its own article comments section than Microsoft already internally testing W10 on lumia 520 n 920...
    so definitely all current wp8 devices are upgradable to w10.
    10-15-2014 02:07 AM
  14. MysticForce's Avatar
    few days back Daniel stated its own article comments section than Microsoft already internally testing W10 on lumia 520 n 920...
    so definitely all current wp8 devices are upgradable to w10.
    Well if testing, it doesn't mean that all lumias will pass the test.
    Also WP10 is still not ready, if it is we would see some preview but they have nothing yet.
    10-15-2014 03:27 AM
  15. msirapian's Avatar
    Yes, we had the living images in beta on the 1020, it worked but finally Nokia decided not to release it officially. So I agree, testing doesn't mean releasing.
    10-15-2014 04:07 AM
  16. Ragazzochild's Avatar
    Nokia did a great job at incorporating mass-market hardware into their devices. Nokia devices should be easy to upgrade for this reason. To Apple iOS versions means "look & feel" not features. Different phones have different features due to changing technology. For Android, they've gradually offloaded a lot of the important parts of Android to the market place, which makes the OS upgrade less relevant. For example, with Apple, in order to have the latest camera app also required the latest OS, but with Android, you can have a 2yr old OS, and still get the latest camera app.

    The problem with WP8.x is that it's grossly outdated. Wrist devices that work with WP? How about any other accessories? It's so limited.

    Simple question for WP devices... What does it do better than other devices? Not marginally better, but drastically. Apple Pay... They way they're pushing it, honestly, no one does it better right now. What does Windows have? Tiles?
    10-17-2014 09:04 AM
  17. garama's Avatar
    Guys single platform for all devices......pcs, tablets, mobiles etc. Win 10 will be for all devices across the board. Upgrading will be possible i believe.
    10-18-2014 02:18 PM
  18. a5cent's Avatar
    Guys single platform for all devices......pcs, tablets, mobiles etc. Win 10 will be for all devices across the board. Upgrading will be possible i believe.
    A single WinRT API and WinRT runtime platform. Not a single OS!
    10-18-2014 07:08 PM
  19. ShinraCorp's Avatar
    A single WinRT API and WinRT runtime platform. Not a single OS!
    Actually the way they presented it... it is a single OS, it is a UNIFIED OS. It'll probably run a check during installation.

    Code:
    Checklist
    
    IF (CPU_x86 = 1)
    {
    INSTALL WINDOWS10_x86 (I wouldn't know how they install but let's just say that)
    }
    ELSE IF (CPU_ARM = 1)
    {
    INSTALL WINDOWS10_RT
    }
    Of course a lot of the resources it installs will be common for both CPU architectures. And Windows will optimize to the screen size of the device it is installing.

    As we saw with Continuum, Windows adapts to the Start Menu or the Start Screen if there's a touch screen or not. It's exciting to say the least.

    But ya basically it's a single OS just with a lot of variables mixed in.
    10-18-2014 07:45 PM
  20. a5cent's Avatar
    Actually the way they presented it... it is a single OS, it is a UNIFIED OS. It'll probably run a check during installation.

    [CODE]Checklist

    IF (CPU_x86 = 1)
    {
    INSTALL WINDOWS10_x86 (I wouldn't know how they install but let's just say that)
    }
    ELSE IF (CPU_ARM = 1)
    {
    INSTALL WINDOWS10_RT
    }

    [/CODE]

    Of course a lot of the resources it installs will be common for both CPU architectures. And Windows will optimize to the screen size of the device it is installing.

    As we saw with Continuum, Windows adapts to the Start Menu or the Start Screen if there's a touch screen or not. It's exciting to say the least.

    But ya basically it's a single OS just with a lot of variables mixed in.
    Nope. You're confusing Microsoft's statement of a "single platform" to mean a single OS. I agree that it's confusing. I suspect they are just trying to make it very clear that the same modern apps will run on all devices, and their marketing message is tailored to drive that point home. Technically it's incorrect however. We will have two OSes, that apparently will carry the same name.

    The differences will go far beyond just being compiled for x86 and ARM architectures. One will have no desktop, no virtualization capabilities, no disk management capabilities, no integrated flash update, and also lack a million other things... not the same...
    10-18-2014 07:54 PM
  21. Michael Alan Goff's Avatar
    Nope. You're confusing Microsoft's statement of a "single platform" to mean a single OS. I agree that it's confusing. I suspect they are just trying to make it very clear that the same modern apps will run on all devices, and their marketing message is tailored to drive that point home. Technically it's incorrect however. We will have two OSes, that apparently will carry the same name.

    The differences will go far beyond just being compiled for x86 and ARM architectures. One will have no desktop, no virtualization capabilities, no disk management capabilities, no integrated flash update, and also lack a million other things... not the same...
    They said no integrated flash or are we speculating? I wasn't aware they really went into the differences so far.
    10-19-2014 08:25 AM
  22. taymur's Avatar
    Windows 10 is designed to run on a coffee Mug, as it is the solution for the internet of things.

    My guess it will be able to run on our devices, but of course it needs modification.
    10-19-2014 08:39 AM
  23. ShinraCorp's Avatar
    They said no integrated flash or are we speculating? I wasn't aware they really went into the differences so far.
    It's mostly pure speculation thus far since the only thing we got out of Windows 10 was that presentation and the preview for enterprise/IT Pro
    10-19-2014 08:57 AM
  24. iamakii's Avatar
    It will be. No doubt about it.
    10-19-2014 09:07 AM
  25. Michael Alan Goff's Avatar
    It's mostly pure speculation thus far since the only thing we got out of Windows 10 was that presentation and the preview for enterprise/IT Pro
    I was just wondering, because the guy seemed really sure.
    10-19-2014 09:18 AM
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