11-20-2015 12:51 PM
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  1. Skyway's Avatar
    Did I? How?
    Please provide me with some math to show where I paid more.
    If you trade in before all payments on NEXT, maybe you save.
    Let's say you bought an unlocked phone for $600. You are paying full price right off the bat. If I use next on the same phone, I pay nothing up front and make payments over time, but the payments equate to about $50 more, so $650. Let's say I trade in my phone with $250 still left on the contract.

    You paid: $600

    I paid:
    $650-250=$400

    Now like I said, you still get your phone and can now sell it to put towards the purchase of your next phone, but who says it's worth very much when you do decide to sell and upgrade? You have to sell it (which takes up your time and what happens if you can't sell it for 6 months?) and hope that you got enough out of it. Then when you upgrade, you still have buy an unlocked phone and pay full price. I just have to trade in my device and pick my next one, nothing up front but taxes.

    Each has it's own merits, I'm not saying anyone is better. Everyone is going to have to decide what option is best for them. It's just ignorant to say things like 'wake up people' to those of us who choose Next.

    Not trying to argue, so no need to get hostile. This is just the way I look at it. I'm sure some of you are going to come back with all sorts of reasons why the option you chose is better. Next works great for me and many others, unlocked works for you and many others. To each their own.
    InsGadget likes this.
    11-17-2015 02:29 PM
  2. RumoredNow's Avatar
    You forgot what I saved on service that whole time.

    I didn't think I was being hostile so much as making my point.

    If you read any hostility into it, that would just be my evangelical conviction. Sorry if the tone seemed hostile.
    InsGadget likes this.
    11-17-2015 02:36 PM
  3. MiloTheOne's Avatar
    Let's say you bought an unlocked phone for $600. You are paying full price right off the bat. If I use next on the same phone, I pay nothing up front and make payments over time, but the payments equate to about $50 more, so $650. Let's say I trade in my phone with $250 still left on the contract.

    You paid: $600

    I paid:
    $650-250=$400

    Now like I said, you still get your phone and can now sell it to put towards the purchase of your next phone, but who says it's worth very much when you do decide to sell and upgrade? You have to sell it (which takes up your time and what happens if you can't sell it for 6 months?) and hope that you got enough out of it. Then when you upgrade, you still have buy an unlocked phone and pay full price. I just have to trade in my device and pick my next one, nothing up front but taxes.

    Each has it's own merits, I'm not saying anyone is better. Everyone is going to have to decide what option is best for them. It's just ignorant to say things like 'wake up people' to those of us who choose Next.

    Not trying to argue, so no need to get hostile. This is just the way I look at it. I'm sure some of you are going to come back with all sorts of reasons why the option you chose is better. Next works great for me and many others, unlocked works for you and many others. To each their own.
    On the Next 12 at 29.95 it's roughly $600.00 if you complete the full 20 month cycle. I'm sticking to Next and eliminating the bloatware, on windows phones it's easier than others to remove.
    InsGadget likes this.
    11-17-2015 02:39 PM
  4. Skyway's Avatar
    You forgot what I saved on service that whole time.

    I didn't think I was being hostile so much as making my point.

    If you read any hostility into it, that would just be my evangelical conviction. Sorry if the tone seemed hostile.
    What service did you save on? Do you not have a service plan with an unlocked phone?

    I didn't read any hostility in your post, I just wanted to make sure my post wasn't read as hostile lol. All good, no worries here!
    RumoredNow and InsGadget like this.
    11-17-2015 02:40 PM
  5. Skyway's Avatar
    On the Next 12 at 29.95 it's roughly $600.00 if you complete the full 20 month cycle. I'm sticking to Next and eliminating the bloatware, on windows phones it's easier than others to remove.
    I was just using that number hypothetically. I wasn't referring to the 950.
    RumoredNow likes this.
    11-17-2015 02:43 PM
  6. HoosierDaddy's Avatar
    You paid: $600

    I paid:
    $650-250=$400
    I thought he paid $600 minus what he sold his old phone for. Or are you saying AT&T lets you keep the phone you trade in?

    And I may have been wrong about Next commitments but I'll PayPal you $10 if trading in a phone for a $250 discount doesn't lock you into staying at AT&T.

    Don't worry about me. I'll make it all back trading my pile of 521s in for 950s and selling them on eBay.
    RumoredNow likes this.
    11-17-2015 02:45 PM
  7. 920Walker's Avatar
    What is the cost of a Next plan for one device, not an extra device on an existing multi-user plan? Say 3GB data, with taxes, excluding any insurance replacement add-on.
    11-17-2015 02:53 PM
  8. 920Walker's Avatar
    Let's say you bought an unlocked phone for $600. You are paying full price right off the bat. If I use next on the same phone, I pay nothing up front and make payments over time, but the payments equate to about $50 more, so $650. Let's say I trade in my phone with $250 still left on the contract.

    You paid: $600

    I paid:
    $650-250=$400


    .
    How do you get a trade-in credit for a phone which you owe $250?
    BLKahuna likes this.
    11-17-2015 02:58 PM
  9. Skyway's Avatar
    I thought he paid $600 minus what he sold his old phone for. Or are you saying AT&T lets you keep the phone you trade in?

    And I may have been wrong about Next commitments but I'll PayPal you $10 if trading in a phone for a $250 discount doesn't lock you into staying at AT&T.

    Don't worry about me. I'll make it all back trading my pile of 521s in for 950s and selling them on eBay.
    If he did sell an old phone to put towards the purchase of the new $600 phone, then he had to buy that unlocked too.

    I was assuming both parties would be buying new devices on a new plan at the same carrier. You start adding in a bunch of vairables and anything can happen. This was all hypothetical. He asked me to show him the math on how someone could pay more buying unlocked vs Next.
    11-17-2015 03:00 PM
  10. Skyway's Avatar
    What is the cost of a Next plan for one device, not an extra device on an existing multi-user plan? Say 3GB data, with taxes, excluding any insurance replacement add-on.
    It depends on the device and what contract you choose (12, 18, 24). Each phone costs' a different amount and the Next payments reflect the total retail value of the phone. A $600 phone payments would be around the $25-30, while a $350 phone would be cheaper (I don't know what the payments would be off the top of my head, you would have to go to ATT.com to check out each device).

    How do you get a trade-in credit for a phone which you owe $250?
    You don't get a trade in credit. What I was saying was that I can upgrade to a new device before my Next contract is done. I just upgraded to the 950 last night even though I still owe $175 on my HTC M8. So when I trade my M8 in, I will not have paid full price for the phone. I believe the M8 is $640, so:

    $640 - $175 = $465. That's how much I paid for my M8 to use it for a year and a half.
    11-17-2015 03:05 PM
  11. RumoredNow's Avatar
    FWIW...

    I've shopped ATT rates without phone purchase. And recently. I review my options all the time.

    Right now my line of service is $25 a month for my one phone. Or rather my one SIM which I swap between phones whenever I want. I have my own high speed data allotment. No "bucket" that others are dipping into fast as they can to burn up the use out from underneath me. And that $25 is flat. No taxes, fees or gotchas added in. I'm using the same ATT towers you are, so my coverage area matches yours. I can also roam. I spent 35 days recently driving around the western US and had service everywhere I went.

    I've got 4 phones bundled on Cricket, each with 2.5GB high speed data allotment apiece. $100 flat.

    For me to take those 4 phones to ATT I have to spend WAY more money every month for a bucket of data and each device has an access fee to the bucket on top of voice and SMS service!!!! The more phones I add at ATT, the more money I loose.

    For just my phone, with less high speed data a month (2GB instead of 2,5GB) my rate as a user climbs from $25 a month to $55 a month. This costs me an extra $360 a dollars a year for cellular service. And not including the taxes, fees, etc. being added on.

    capture.png


    There is no way my near mint (near only because it is has been used) 1520 sells for $360 dollars less than an ATT 1520 in the same condition with less features. That is like saying I have to pay someone to take my 1520. Nope. Incorrect and inaccurate.

    $360 dollars a year is huge savings toward my next phone. And when I get a next phone I just buy it... I don't wait to sell the phone I have now. When you get a NEXT phone you never stop paying for it because they (ATT) have you signing back up all the time.
    11-17-2015 03:12 PM
  12. zeke009's Avatar
    So... after realizing I was not getting updates to this thread, I came back to read all the way through.

    I learned that we have no freaking idea whether an unlocked phone will get updates in a more timely manner than a carrier locked/branded device. Some unlocked devices haven't received updates that carrier locked devices did.

    In short: I realized it makes no difference where I buy it, I'll be pissed at whichever carrier I have and their abandonment of the Lumia 950 after 3 months (sarcasm). So, I ordered a 950 today on the Next plan because my 920 just can't hang on anymore and the 635 is not a daily driver for me.

    If a Surface Phone is in the cards, I hope MS makes sure they control updates like Apple does. If they cannot do it... it really isn't worth it as the carriers are not in their corner and the fabled Surface Phone will be no different than Lumia, Acer or whatever else is out there. Abandoned by the carrier with no updates in sight far too quickly will not sway public opinion.
    11-17-2015 03:36 PM
  13. 920Walker's Avatar
    It depends on the device and what contract you choose (12, 18, 24). Each phone costs' a different amount and the Next payments reflect the total retail value of the phone. A $600 phone payments would be around the $25-30, while a $350 phone would be cheaper (I don't know what the payments would be off the top of my head, you would have to go to ATT.com to check out each device).



    You don't get a trade in credit. What I was saying was that I can upgrade to a new device before my Next contract is done. I just upgraded to the 950 last night even though I still owe $175 on my HTC M8. So when I trade my M8 in, I will not have paid full price for the phone. I believe the M8 is $640, so:

    $640 - $175 = $465. That's how much I paid for my M8 to use it for a year and a half.
    I see, like leasing. So you pay monthly and when you stop early, they keep it, at no additional cost to you. If you pay to the end, it is yours.

    I meant to add in my monthly Next cost question to also exclude the phone cost, as yes, that differs and is 1/12th, 18th or 24th of retail each month; what is the monthly service cost for one line?
    RumoredNow likes this.
    11-17-2015 03:46 PM
  14. fitchalcyone's Avatar
    Zeke, good summary. Many often think unlocked automatically means updates first, but that very much isn't always the case.

    Another point to consider: Some may not want to feel "locked down" through Next, but I imagine there can be potential problems to buying unlocked instead of at AT&T. Going that route robs one sale from them, and as I'm sure they're already not moving much, this could be further reason for them not to want to carry them in-store. I speak in broad terms, of course, in a scenario where both phones cost exactly the same. This isn't so much a consideration for just the 950, but also for future phones.
    zeke009 and InsGadget like this.
    11-17-2015 03:47 PM
  15. zeke009's Avatar
    @fitchalcyone: I was looking for a way to ensure my device would receive timely updates, even after the carrier washed their hands of it. I know Android goes through the same thing, but I see WinMo as different because the carrier can't lay the extra complexity of their own 'skin' on it. Updates should move quicker in that regard, but they don't.

    I am hopeful that a Surface Phone will see the light of day, but I truly hope it is more than just pretty hardware. I hope it is a stellar customer experience from the hardware to the service to the support after the sale.
    11-17-2015 03:53 PM
  16. Skyway's Avatar
    I see, like leasing. So you pay monthly and when you stop early, they keep it, at no additional cost to you. If you pay to the end, it is yours.

    I meant to add in my monthly Next cost question to also exclude the phone cost, as yes, that differs and is 1/12th, 18th or 24th of retail each month; what is the monthly service cost for one line?
    It's like leasing with the option to buy if you want. You pay monthly, but if you want, you can pay it all off early and then the phone is yours. You can also keep making payments until the end and then the phone is yours. If you upgrade early (before your Next contract is done), then you have to trade it in.

    On my plan, Mobile Value Share 10gb, it's $15/line. The way they break it down is $40/line with a $25 discount for Mobile Share Value plan and Next. Others have said that the per line cost is not $40, but in my breakdown it is. This might be because I am grandfathered in on my plan (for what I have no idea, that's what ATT is telling me on my accounts page).

    @fitchalcyone: I was looking for a way to ensure my device would receive timely updates, even after the carrier washed their hands of it. I know Android goes through the same thing, but I see WinMo as different because the carrier can't lay the extra complexity of their own 'skin' on it. Updates should move quicker in that regard, but they don't.

    I am hopeful that a Surface Phone will see the light of day, but I truly hope it is more than just pretty hardware. I hope it is a stellar customer experience from the hardware to the service to the support after the sale.
    Buy a Nexus device! Updates waaaay before anyone else and you are pretty much guaranteed them for awhile. Although that's Android and not W10M.
    11-17-2015 04:05 PM
  17. InsGadget's Avatar
    @fitchalcyone: I was looking for a way to ensure my device would receive timely updates, even after the carrier washed their hands of it. I know Android goes through the same thing, but I see WinMo as different because the carrier can't lay the extra complexity of their own 'skin' on it. Updates should move quicker in that regard, but they don't.
    The carriers do more than just throw some apps on Windows Phone, there are deeper functionalities like Visual Voicemail, Wi-Fi Calling, etc. It is somewhat understandable that it takes a little time ... but still. Too long is too long.
    11-17-2015 04:21 PM
  18. 7a2eer's Avatar
    My understanding of the strategy is that Win 10 Mo makes more functionality into Apps rather than baked into the core OS.

    Carriers still control core OS updates but have no say over Apps. It's a back door to provide more timely updates to end users. Factory Unlocked is still the most reliable update path. The impact of carriers has been lessened, but can not be completely removed. Contrary to popular opinion, even Apple is not free of carrier testing (influence) over OTA updates. They are simply getting fast tracked in a preferential manner. Microsoft is trying to do the best they can to lessen the carrier influence in the process and should have it minimized, but Unlocked still wins my vote and my money.
    +1 on Microsoft update strategy.

    Carriers generally take a business week to test updates. There are boundary cases, but in general carriers approve updates in a timely manner. There are special promotions that are too good to pass up. The -$20 LG G4 on Verizon is a good example!
    11-17-2015 04:22 PM
  19. InsGadget's Avatar
    FWIW...

    I've shopped ATT rates without phone purchase. And recently. I review my options all the time.

    I've got 4 phones bundled on Cricket, each with 2.5GB high speed data allotment apiece. $100 flat.
    So, Cricket, huh? Same towers, same service? Aren't there some limitations about LTE speeds or something?
    11-17-2015 04:23 PM
  20. uw's Avatar
    why is lumia 950 $599 on Att?.. i thought it was supposed to $549.. i was going to buy it through Att Next program, but i'd rather save that $50 if it's cheaper at the ms store..
    11-17-2015 04:43 PM
  21. Skyway's Avatar
    why is lumia 950 $599 on Att?.. i thought it was supposed to $549.. i was going to buy it through Att Next program, but i'd rather save that $50 if it's cheaper at the ms store..
    That's how most phones are on carriers. My girlfriend's LG V10 is $672 at Verizon, but AT&T is charging $699.
    11-17-2015 04:49 PM
  22. RumoredNow's Avatar
    So, Cricket, huh? Same towers, same service? Aren't there some limitations about LTE speeds or something?
    LTE speed is capped at 8mbps. I find it plenty fast. I'm not streaming a lot of entertainment.

    No tethering unless you pay a $10 monthly access fee. I don't need it so I save there as well.

    It's about balancing your needs vs cost. I used to have Straight Talk and they gave me 5GB high speed a month for bringing my own phone, but that was more data than I used every month so it was just money going for nothing. Now I pay $20 less every month for my one line comparatively.

    If you want to bring a lot of lines, Cricket Bundling makes for a really great value right now.


    Visual Voicemail,
    This may be a problem on some mvno carriers that don't support VVM, but on Windows Phone VVM is baked into the phone App. It is not carrier firmware. I had T-Mo VVM without an App on my Factory Unlocked 1520.3.

    For VVM I have long relied on YouMail on the web and ISeeVM on my phone. I have portable VVM that acts the same across SIMs, Phones and Carriers. I don't see myself going back to carrier VVM any time soon.
    libra89 likes this.
    11-17-2015 04:49 PM
  23. Craig3's Avatar
    Every type of store everywhere, including the physical Microsoft stores, want/will have their shelves fully stocked going into the first big holiday weekend (Thanksgiving). I can't believe Microsoft would be any different. I would expect that they plan to have both the 950 and the 950 XL on the shelves by the Wednesday before Thanksgiving??? Wouldn't that make sense?? Letting AT&T have it for a one week head start and then on Microsoft store shelves for the entire holiday shopping season.
    RumoredNow likes this.
    11-18-2015 09:35 AM
  24. jmajid's Avatar
    Right now, according to the Microsoft store website, they show that the ATT version of the 950 is offered in black or white (not "available" but ships by nov 20)
    However, it shows they will offer the unlocked 950 in black, there is no option for white...
    RumoredNow likes this.
    11-18-2015 10:17 AM
  25. iMcAKPYs7's Avatar
    Lumia 950 AT&T has wireless charging Qi and PMA while Lumia 950 unlocked only meets Qi standard.
    Thats the only difference.
    11-20-2015 10:15 AM
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