Lumia 1030: what to expect?

[JamesPTao]

Why have a flagship camera-oriented device that doesn't have a super-slo mode(120fps capture) that the iPhone has?

IPhone is a bad comparison if the 1020 used an 8 mp, non raw, small sensor lime the iPhone it would be blazingly fast and more feature rich.

 

[JamesPTao]

I'm not sure that this megapixel war would extend further than 41 MP anytime soon...
so for me, 50 MP sensor (not 50 MP image from several stitched 13 MP pictures which is what the Oppo Find 7 does) is unlikely

8K video?
damn, even 4K is way overkill for a mobile phone
AFAIK, there is no 8K screen used in the world at this moment

the camera tech possibilities have been discussed thoroughly in this thread...
as for me now, I would prefer a 41 MP with a 1" sensor, an even more advanced OIS, ZEISS lens or Canon Liquid Lens, and adjustable aperture
for the processing part, I'd prefer Qualcomm Snapdragon 805, 2 GB RAM, and a fast 64 GB internal memory (expandable or not, I don't really care)

50 mp would be silly and a minamal improvement. It would take 61 to increase by 50% and 82mp to double the info. I don't think most people realize mp are exponential. To double the info you have to double the mp. So 9 mp increase is big for an 8 mp camera but a minimal improvement on a 41 mp camera.

 

[JamesPTao]

Tom may know what he's talking about but I for one do not think the Mc is the 1030... looking back through articles this rumour of the Mc being the 1030 first came up in comments on articles that didn't mention its predecessor and then some articles mentioned that it could be a new flagship or 1020 successor... Tom is the first reputable person that's stated that... If the tech is as new/game changing/good and has new OS features its 100% "940" or 935 or 939... From the way Microsoft have acted the last 2, 3 years, "listening" to their customers, especially the niche stuff there is no way a 1030 is anything but a 41 and up sensor... That phone has a crazy fan base with universities and labs that are finding mad uses for it and its sensor BECAUSE or its small size with monster sensor. It can do things an DSLR physically can't do because of size... Microscopes being one example... its too good to not make better....

You are right the McLaren and 1030 are not the same phone. The 1030 is separate and will be an improvement on the 1020. It is still being tweaked and worked with. The camera sensor and mp will not go down. Ms is working on ways to improve shot processing times using various ideas.

 

[salmanahmad]

IPhone is a bad comparison if the 1020 used an 8 mp, non raw, small sensor lime the iPhone it would be blazingly fast and more feature rich.

Well the 8 Megapixel approach is a good one, what I mean to say is that the iPhone's camera is blazingly fast because the processor is given only what it can chew.

Plus Apple uses a best of both worlds approach by giving the iPhone an f2.2 aperture and ISO from 32 to 3200, but this is all useless for this discussion. If you want to know more of what I'm trying to say, message me.

The guy is talking about 120 FPS capture which is not on Lumia, this is a genuine complaint but as far as this goes I don't think the current generation Lumia camera sensors can handle 120FPS, 60FPS possibly.

 

[Beijendorf]

You are right the McLaren and 1030 are not the same phone. The 1030 is separate and will be an improvement on the 1020. It is still being tweaked and worked with. The camera sensor and mp will not go down. Ms is working on ways to improve shot processing times using various ideas.

I'm not convinced. The Goldfinger seems to have been originally intended as a 930, where the McLaren was then intended as a 1030. The common rumour was that all high-end phones would come with the 3D touch system, so the McLaren wasn't unique in that regard.

 

[JamesPTao]

I'm not convinced. The Goldfinger seems to have been originally intended as a 930, where the McLaren was then intended as a 1030. The common rumour was that all high-end phones would come with the 3D touch system, so the McLaren wasn't unique in that regard.

I agree with the 3d touch being available only on high end phones by the McLaren was cancelled because Ms wasn't happy with the 3d touch on the form factor (at least not yet). If it was the 1030 and not a separate flagship meant to highlight their 3d touch it wouldn't have been cancelled simply delayed if that. The focus of the 1030 is the camera using it to promote their 3d touch and focus resources on that over the other technical challenges of the phone doesn't make much sense. It would unnecessarily complicate the process. But as is the norm with ms no-one really knows.

 

[AndyM72]

Well the 8 Megapixel approach is a good one, what I mean to say is that the iPhone's camera is blazingly fast because the processor is given only what it can chew.

Plus Apple uses a best of both worlds approach by giving the iPhone an f2.2 aperture

F-stop aperture, like f/2.2, is what is known as relative aperture. It literally means "lens focal length / 2.2". Because the iPhone sensor is tiny compared to the 1020, the lens focal length is a lot shorter for the same angle of view. So you have smaller number / 2.2 = smaller actual aperture. So there is less light coming in. Light is signal, so less light means worse signal to noise ratio.

Give me cleaner, less noisy images over slo mo video any day!

Edit: The only reason why the iPhone can do slo mo, is because it's using a high end chipset with fast data transfer from the camera module... but a low end camera (low res, small sensor size). So there is spare capacity in the interface between the chipset and camera to pump the video up to 120fps.

 

[salmanahmad]

F-stop aperture, like f/2.2, is what is known as relative aperture. It literally means "lens focal length / 2.2". Because the iPhone sensor is tiny compared to the 1020, the lens focal length is a lot shorter for the same angle of view. So you have smaller number / 2.2 = smaller actual aperture. So there is less light coming in. Light is signal, so less light means worse signal to noise ratio.

Give me cleaner, less noisy images over slo mo video any day!

Edit: The only reason why the iPhone can do slo mo, is because it's using a high end chipset with fast data transfer from the camera module... but a low end camera (low res, small sensor size). So there is spare capacity in the interface between the chipset and camera to pump the video up to 120fps.

Agreed however I find neither approach good. iPhone sacrifices detail for speed while Lumia 1020 had a much bigger preference for detail instead of speed.



In some comparisons of the 1020 and 5S's shots, 5S was able to keep the shots more in focus(but with more grain) whereas Lumia 1020 had less noisy, more detailed albeit less focused shots.



The near perfect smartphone camera approach right now, according to me would either be the Lumia 1520's or the Xperia Z2's.

 

[AndyM72]

In some comparisons of the 1020 and 5S's shots, 5S was able to keep the shots more in focus(but with more grain) whereas Lumia 1020 had less noisy, more detailed albeit less focused shots.

Cameras with greater Depth of Field don't have to be quite so accurate with their focus.

 

[JamesPTao]

Cameras with greater Depth of Field don't have to be quite so accurate with their focus.

If the depth of field is smaller than the focus is shallower meaning less is in focus away from the center of focus, pretty basic photography concept. If they wanted more in focus then use a larger aperture number.

 

[bsayegh]

I am not convinced that there will ever be a 1030.

 

[JamesPTao]

I am not convinced that there will ever be a 1030.

And that matters why?

 

[RJ Priest]

For this fall, if Microsoft / Nokia would simply create a "1025", and use the same camera from the 1020, but with a 5" or 5.2" 1080p AMOLED display and quad core processor, while maintaining the Lumia 920 design language (but with a glossy finish), I would be so satisfied for the long term, and not need to upgrade from that anytime soon.

 

[spaulagain]

In some comparisons of the 1020 and 5S's shots, 5S was able to keep the shots more in focus(but with more grain) whereas Lumia 1020 had less noisy, more detailed albeit less focused shots.

That's just normal photography characteristics. The 5S was more grainy because it used the ISO to get more light while keeping a smaller aperture and therefore larger depth of field. The 1020 however is capable of a very large aperture and therefore uses that to capture more light rather than bumping up the ISO. This will result in more detail, less noise, but a smaller depth of field (less in focus).

 

[JamesPTao]

That's just normal photography characteristics. The 5S was more grainy because it used the ISO to get more light while keeping a smaller aperture and therefore larger depth of field. The 1020 however is capable of a very large aperture and therefore uses that to capture more light rather than bumping up the ISO. This will result in more detail, less noise, but a smaller depth of field (less in focus).

Exactly what I was trying to get at but much better put!

 

[bijak_riyandi]

730 and 830 are coming, still no words about the 1030...

perhaps, they postponed it to make way for HTC One (M8) for Windows?
if it's true, then we could expect the 1030 will be released early next year...

what do you think, guys?

 

[BatteryLife]

That's just normal photography characteristics. The 5S was more grainy because it used the ISO to get more light while keeping a smaller aperture and therefore larger depth of field. The 1020 however is capable of a very large aperture and therefore uses that to capture more light rather than bumping up the ISO. This will result in more detail, less noise, but a smaller depth of field (less in focus).

You're right about the ISO part. However, I disagree with the aperture part. Both Lumia 1020 and iPhone 5S have the same aperture (f/2.2). Thus the light coming through the aperture will be the same. However, Lumia 1020 has a much larger sensor and this results in more light being absorbed. HOWEVER, Lumia 1020 also have more pixels, thus the pixel size will be reduced (1.12 microns vs 1.5 microns in the iPhone 5S).

This is compensated by the Lumia 1020's OIS, where it allows it to use a longer shutter speed reducing image blur due to camera shake (but not image motion). The shallow DoF is due to the longer focal length used.

 

[bijak_riyandi]

with the 1030 confirmed in works, we could expect leaks in near future

I just thought that the 1030 could have the same size as the 1020 was...
reason? the Lumia Camera Grip

that accessory is more than just accessory for the 1020...
and I am sure that Microsoft would like the idea of compatible accessories for both the 1020 and 1030

thoughts?

 

[maverick786us]

1) I expect, the designed to be similar to beautiful 930 (not 830) but the whole body should be made of aluminum.
2) The AMOLED screen size should be slight bigger than 930, 5.2 inch will be sweet spot and should have its buffer memory to support glance screen.
3) The speakers should be either like 1520 or 830.
4) The camera should be almost the same as 1020 or better with no camera hump
5) Snapdragon 810 64-bit processor with 4GB RAM. I know that for Windows phone, such a high end requirement isn't required. But better processor with better image processing mechanism will give better image quality and will make the camera fast for capturing burst mode at maximum resolution

 

[parsaion]

with the 1030 confirmed in works, we could expect leaks in near future

I just thought that the 1030 could have the same size as the 1020 was...
reason? the Lumia Camera Grip

that accessory is more than just accessory for the 1020...
and I am sure that Microsoft would like the idea of compatible accessories for both the 1020 and 1030

thoughts?

Why would they not want to make people buy accessories all over again? Maybe they see apple is making huge amounts of money doing just that? Just a thought...