So has BUILD basically outlined the future of Windows Phone?

[anon(601415)]

I seriously believe that they are purposely keeping us in the dark and keeping it very low key because they want the WOW factor when they release some new next-generation device (Surface Phone anyone?). Obviously, I could be wrong, but that is my take on the situation.

Earlier this year, I purchased an Alcatel Idol 4S with Windows and it is a great phone (except the camera is disappointing after moving from a Lumia 1520). However, I'm a web developer and am adding new tools to my toolbox to better serve my clients -- many of those tools require (at least in terms of my plans) to have mobile apps to support them. Sadly, apps do not exist for these platforms on Windows Mobile.

So I bit the bullet and bought a Galaxy S8+. While I can say it is a great phone, at least when only compared with other Android phones, I already miss Windows Mobile. With Android, everything (EVERYTHING) is more complicated than it needs to be and a lot of stuff is buried or hard to find. In fact, I think it is over-saturated with "features". I have attempted to simplify some things and have had some success. But in the end, it's still Android.

Also, the Outlook app is a bit buggy -- when I receive a notification that I have a new email, I tap on the notification and it opens Outlook, then attempts to open the message. After about 30 seconds, it gives up and says it can't open it. The message doesn't even appear in the list of messages -- but wait -- if you just let it sit for about another minute, the message will magically appear in the list and then you can read it.

I'm also using the Arrow Launcher (by Microsoft) and it's pretty nice (for Android). I really wish they'd at least make it look like Windows Mobile, but I also understand why that's probably not a good idea.

So yeah, I really, really, really, REALLY miss Windows Mobile and find myself considering going back to the Idol 4S and trying to find a way to deal with the missing apps I need. But, for now, I'm forcing myself to stick with it to see if I can "conform" until the Surface Phone surfaces (see what I did there?) and hopefully that kickstarts app developers to come back. PLEASE tell me there will be a Surface Phone....

 

[VITNE]

I seriously believe that they are purposely keeping us in the dark and keeping it very low key because they want the WOW factor when they release some new next-generation device (Surface Phone anyone?). Obviously, I could be wrong, but that is my take on the situation.

Earlier this year, I purchased an Alcatel Idol 4S with Windows and it is a great phone (except the camera is disappointing after moving from a Lumia 1520). However, I'm a web developer and am adding new tools to my toolbox to better serve my clients -- many of those tools require (at least in terms of my plans) to have mobile apps to support them. Sadly, apps do not exist for these platforms on Windows Mobile.

So I bit the bullet and bought a Galaxy S8+. While I can say it is a great phone, at least when only compared with other Android phones, I already miss Windows Mobile. With Android, everything (EVERYTHING) is more complicated than it needs to be and a lot of stuff is buried or hard to find. In fact, I think it is over-saturated with "features". I have attempted to simplify some things and have had some success. But in the end, it's still Android.

Also, the Outlook app is a bit buggy -- when I receive a notification that I have a new email, I tap on the notification and it opens Outlook, then attempts to open the message. After about 30 seconds, it gives up and says it can't open it. The message doesn't even appear in the list of messages -- but wait -- if you just let it sit for about another minute, the message will magically appear in the list and then you can read it.

I'm also using the Arrow Launcher (by Microsoft) and it's pretty nice (for Android). I really wish they'd at least make it look like Windows Mobile, but I also understand why that's probably not a good idea.

So yeah, I really, really, really, REALLY miss Windows Mobile and find myself considering going back to the Idol 4S and trying to find a way to deal with the missing apps I need. But, for now, I'm forcing myself to stick with it to see if I can "conform" until the Surface Phone surfaces (see what I did there?) and hopefully that kickstarts app developers to come back. PLEASE tell me there will be a Surface Phone....

Im not a developer, but in the past year and a half, ive used four different mobile platforms. iOS, Android, W10M, and Ubuntu Touch. As much as I attempted to like Android, and it does have it's moments, it is my least favorite. Like you said, the apps can be buggy. I've noticed the same regarding Outlook. As a whole, I'd say the Microsoft app experience is much more solid on iOS. The only app I've had crash on me in iOS is Groove sometimes. Outlook works well, as do OneDrive, OneNote, Word, as well as their other apps like MSN news and Money. I think the only thing I really like about Android is that the emulators (like Playstation) are quite good.

Ubuntu was an interesting experience, and strangely enough I liked it better than Android. It felt original and I loved the gestures and the slide-out menu, though it was obviously quite beta. Its no longer in development anymore though.

I keep coming back to Windows on phones. I just enjoy it. I've been switching back and forth from my new iPhone 7 Plus, which I got based on logical thinking (Facetime and iMessage with family and friends since they all have iphone), but I keep switching back to my Lumia 950 XL to see how I fare without some "needed" apps, and testing the differences between apps. No matter how much I think to myself that it makes more sense to use iPhone because of iMessage and stuff, I feel a more emotional connection to Windows I guess you would say. Its just fun. Pretty deep stuff huh? Hahaha

I do think something is coming on the Windows-on-phones front.

 

[sumton]

Before BUILD I know a lot of us around here were hoping that Microsoft would have some news regarding the future of their mobile vision. Since that didn't happen... Silence says it all? Anyone want to make their own interpretation?

Seems like more than anything Build highlighted Microsoft's commitment to platform agnostic growth. My own take is they're going full speed ahead with mixed reality and cloud. Windows Phone is not a priority, it no longer completes either of those two visions. It's like everyone else said... the future is devices you can bring with you, just not the kind we currently put in our pocket. But until a full transition is made it's better to focus on the devices currently shaping the market and not ones of MS' own design.

Considering what they showed off this seems like the right move. Windows Phone was clearly holding them back. Without having to commit so heavily to the platform they can invest elsewhere... and it seems to be paying off in spades.

its a clear massage there is no future for this OS in the company future the investment goes to android, ios and windows 10 ( . )

 

[MrockNroll]

Thank you Harness Tech for confirming what I already knew about android OS. That its STILL a convoluted mess and that they should include a 40 page manual on how to use it!! While I will agree that Samsung has a great looking phone/hardware it could be even better if they released a Win 10 mobile version. Good luck on your Android journey, meanwhile I will keep enjoying my Lumia 950XL even more, its working even better after the latest update. ;-) PS don't sell your Alcatel 4s Yet!

 

[jeffchapik]

I'm also using the Arrow Launcher (by Microsoft) and it's pretty nice (for Android). I really wish they'd at least make it look like Windows Mobile, but I also understand why that's probably not a good idea.

Try Launcher 10. My Android start screen now looks just like my Lumia 640 did. That, combined with Textra for SMS and the SwiftKey keyboard, and it's almost like W10M again.

 

[tczinder]

I was really hoping for some good news re: W10M at build. Loved my HTC 8X, Lumia 635, Lumia 640, and Lumia 650. Became increasingly frustrated and saddened by the state of W10M...BUILD did nothing to help me feel better about defending W10M and using it in spite of its quirks and workarounds and whatnot.

I bought an iPhone 7 on Friday. I use a Mac at work. Seemed like a no-brainer. I'll tell you...so far, so good. Everything just...works. I had an iPhone back in the days of the iPhone 3G, and I'm amazed at the innovation that has taken place between then and now. W10M feels clunky by comparison.

While I miss the W10M interface (second to none, in my opinion), I see iOS serving me well for years to come.

 

[captblaze]

I learned that if an iPhone is good enough for them (many a Microsoft leader) it is good enough for me, although I will take a hit initially on a new eco system, at least the fruit company stands by their products for longer than most

 

[Xaxxus]

I think BUILD was positive for Windows mobile enthusiasts. Although the focus was on integrating Microsoft services with android and IoS was the focus, Windows powered mobiles were present. This would simply not have been the case if Windows mobile was "dead".

I have a theory that Microsoft is integrating its services with android and IoS not only because it's great business sense, but also in order to pinch those customers later on. A big stumbling block for Windows mobile was that too many people were too integrated with Google or Apple services which made switching to Windows mobile out of the question. If Microsoft can get people using Microsoft service, OneDrive instead of iCloud or Google Drive, etc, then it will make it easier for those consumers to switch to a Windows powered device in the future whatever that iteration may be. Windows 10 S already seems like an effort to boost the Windows store by locking people into it which should hopefully help with the app gap by attracting developers to create UWP apps. And the prestige they're building with the Surface brand means a phone with that brand, with all other factors included, could be huge.

The problem is, Microsoft cant really integrate its services properly into iOS and android.

The devices dont come out of the box with microsofts services on them. Most consumers arent going to go out of their way to download onedrive or skype or outlook if they arent handed them on a silver platter.

You get an iOS device, you are handed icloud and apple services. You get an android device, you are handed google services.

If microsoft wants to get its services to be the most used services, they need to have a phone that is popular enough to get a large enough audience into the microsoft ecosystem.

As it stands now, regardless if you have a windows PC or not, if you have an android, your more likely using gmail and google drive. Iphone is a wierd beast.

Most people who use iphones dont use the icloud as their primary service. Mainly because they came so late in the game and with lesser functionality.

 

[mymarcio]

To be very short and direct - their new developing tool for Windows/iOS/Android if takes off would most likely allow the apps to show up in iOS/Android/Windows(PC/Mobile).

Of course just because a tool exists, it doesn't mean it will be used. With Microsoft really trying to make Windows a developer machine who knows? It's a switch that won't happen over night since this will fall now on the next generation of new developers to pick up and leverage.

I'm not confident well established companies will try to leverage this just yet -- until they see it being successful first.

Where does this leave Windows Mobile? (Well since Windows mobile essentially will run what's on Windows 10 PC... it's just a matter of time they make a Windows 10 Pro phone)

 

[Julian Barker]

The future of our beloved platform lies in Windows On ARM which was certainly mentioned. Windows phone, Windows RT and Windows mobile is already a hobbled version of WOA. The great thing about WOA is that it loads exe files without any issues so Continuum will run smoothly. Now the unanswered question is whether the Google suite will work ok. In theory they should be fine, right?

The future of Windows on phones is bright in my opinion.

I look forward to the live tiles being shown via the cshell.....

 

[wolfpack219]

I will change from Android immediately if Microsoft can get ARM working reliably on mobile! Having a true PC experience in my pocket is a dream come true....... I just hope they can get this out to consumers in the next year to year and a half. Microsoft needs to pursue this with the upmost intensity. Windows on ARM will change the game and bring several consumers like myself back. Apps won't matter as much because I really don't use as many apps on my PC anyhow. However something like this could very well make some app developers think twice about making an app for Windows as they will only need to make it once with UWP.

 

[ucyimDa_Ruler]

Windows Mobile is dead and I realized that on day 2 of BUILD. And I am okay with it because I now see the big picture. If you missed it, there was a demonstration of ARM at BUILD showing off a version of Windows running on a Qualcomm handset. This opens up Windows to run on any device.

So what you may ask. We'll let us factor in several points:

1. ARM on Windows works by incorporating an EMULATION LAYER. Which allows x86 applications to run. This grants us access to the millions of applications already built for Windows.
2. Windows 10 S is basically Windows Mobile. We can only install applications from the store.
3. CSHELL is another explorer that will adapt based on the device. So when we have a small viewport (a.k.a. screen) the OS transforms into what we know as Windows Mobile view. Next is tablet and then standard desktop. I'm certain it'll have other views to support XBOX, HoloLens, watches and readers. Microsoft is being tight lipped about the implementation.

Merry these points together and you get a team at Microsoft that is maintaining a "Feature2" branch because they are focused on the new true path of uniting a single OS for everything. They made it work.

The only drawback is the one that Windows Mobile diehards have been suffering from for years. Lack of communication. When do we get it? Which devices will be supported? Will my 950 XL work with it?

And for that we are still stuck in wait mode.

 

[muvig]

MS had been dropping features since WP7. they were not listening to feedback, or were selective. they were not doing it according to number of votes.
when they moved to w10p a lot of things were left out though those new that were introduced were good, but we couldn't do without those that were left out.

 

[muvig]

and were mainly working on cosmetics like changing pictures from square to round, background colors etc instead of working on features like gestures to be same on w10m, working on maps to have something similar to Here Drive+

 

[tgp]

and were mainly working on cosmetics like changing pictures from square to round, background colors etc

Don't forget their crowning achievement - the new share icon!

 

[Johnny Tremaine]

The only drawback is the one that Windows Mobile diehards have been suffering from for years. Lack of communication. When do we get it? Which devices will be supported? Will my 950 XL work with it?

And for that we are still stuck in wait mode.

Microsoft has been pretty up front about the fact that to run Windows on ARM or 10S, you'll need a Qualcomm SD 830 and above, which eliminates the Lumia 950/XL, the HP x3 and the Alcatel Idol, the latter two of which run on the SD 820. The end of the road for these devices will likely be some modified version of Restone 3, largely consisting of more bug fixes; it'll be similar to WP 7.8, a dead-ending of the OS.

 

[Scott McBurney]

Well, I was at build. I heard nothing specific about W10M either way. But they did release another update during the conference (and the wifi was really slow that morning...lol)

My assumption is that Microsoft is still updating W10M, still shipping it to manufacturers, even if Microsoft themselves are not making any phones.

Now - anticipation. I'm guessing at some point Microsoft will introduce some new Surface branded devices that have phone capabilities. My guess is that a high end one may run full W10 on Arm, while mid range and low end devices would probably continue running W10M. But that is only a guess.

 

[CristianCson]

I was at Build, and the first day was kind of depressing, but that was because almost nothing was about Windows at all, only a few old stuff..

But after day 2 when they actually used w10m devices to demo on, and the crowd cheered the first apperence... It was a clear message that it is wanted..

And at a Open Q&A Session that doesn't seem to have gotten a published video yet https://channel9.msdn.com/Events/Build/2017/B8908 the audience asked about mobile future and Kevin Gallo answered with that they are lovin all the users devices... but the question come up again later more clear, what are the future of windows 10 mobile, and Kevin Gallo answered that they want the w10m platform to grow and that are their goal, I was extatic..

I really hope that the video do get published, so that it could be really clear what the answer was but I think the message their was clear, Windows 10 on phones are going to live on and they are building for it..

I think it is clear that what has been missing is developers in the store, and they want to show that with Microsoft Technolgies the developers could build the best solutions, on whatever the platform, this will make way for Xamarin and also uwp apps.. And they also need customers to the store so that they can get the developers to develop for the store, and that is also helped by the Centeniall bridge... So I will be waiting with a great hope for the windows phone future, hopefully sometime next year (to be realist I don't think they can turn the market any faster than that so that the developer support will be there)

 

[Drael646464]

Does anybody really see mainstream phone consumers wanting a phone with the potential complications of a desktop OS- sorry I can't call you, I need to re-install my graphics driver...

 

[tgp]

Does anybody really see mainstream phone consumers wanting a phone with the potential complications of a desktop OS- sorry I can't call you, I need to re-install my graphics driver...

This is what I think. I believe full Windows 10 on mobile will create more issues than it solves. I'm not yet convinced that Microsoft intends to make Windows 10 S its next phone OS, but I believe it is closer to the answer than WoA.