Used games, a fee ?

[DavidinCT]

I saw a post saying that the Xbox one will play used games but, they charge a fee. Is this true ? What happends when I have a family member come over my home with a game ? What happens if I rent a game ?

This is a outrage to me, I shop for a lot of used games, about 80% of the games are used. Why ? Because if I was spending $60 on every game, I could not play as many games (as I buy month old games for around $30).

If there is a fee, what type of fee are they talking about ?

 

[Courtney S]

Yes there are rumors about a fee, but as with the always online speculation, I think we are going to have to wait and see how MS is going to handle this situation. I think many of the gaming questions we have are going to be answered at E3. Until then, I'm not going to worry about it.

I personally don't believe this huge group of gamers will get screwed over. Then again, there is a big push for a new wave of gaming that won't necessarily rely on buying used games (playing games on the cloud and such). So it's hard to speculate either way. That's why I'm waiting for confirmation.

If they are going to make people pay a fee for a second hand game, then games are going to be priced cheaper, or the cost to pay to use someone else's game will be lower.

 

[Robert Carpenter]

I saw a post saying that the Xbox one will play used games but, they charge a fee. Is this true ? What happends when I have a family member come over my home with a game ? What happens if I rent a game ?

This is a outrage to me, I shop for a lot of used games, about 80% of the games are used. Why ? Because if I was spending $60 on every game, I could not play as many games (as I buy month old games for around $30).

If there is a fee, what type of fee are they talking about ?

I think it's best to let Microsoft provide your answers.

Look at it how you want, but if they are blocking used games, they are losing less money. This strategy could result in cheaper game releases since more money goes directly to Microsoft and the developers.

Wait until E3 for the answers.

 

[DavidinCT]

Ok, so more rumors, good....ah, I feel better... I saw someone create a post saying it, I thought they read something today.

My mistake for creating this thread then. Sorry !

 

[Reflexx]

MS confirmed that there could be a fee associated with games that were installed on a different account. But they also said that they are committed to the used market and that the details behind it will be released later.

So, since the details are released later, it would be best to wait for those details before jumping to conclusions and stressing out based on those conclusions.

 

[Courtney S]

MS confirmed that there could be a fee

Haha, "confirming that there could be" a fee is like saying definitely maybe. Still no answer yet. We are just going to have to wait and see how the handle this.

 

[jlzimmerman]

Consoles are going the way of PC games in this fashion. One game per machine/account. I would bet moneyz that Sony is going to do something similar with the PS4. Some call it greed, but there's more to it. Developers/publishers are dumping so much money into games now, and there's also more pirating/hacking of games. The latter is what is driving the daily internet connection requirement of the XBox One-hundred pounds (the think is huge, right???)

I'll be the first to tell you that I don't like this, as almost all of my games are used. This is really going to hurt GameStop and GameFly unless they do something. M$ may partner with stores like this to provide the stores a bucket of registration codes. I go to buy a used game, GameStop provides a registration code with it. Of course, I'm paying more than what I do for a used game now, which is not annoying. Then there's the chance that a new fee and used game may be as much as new. That will drive a lot of the gamer base away Xbox unless PS4 does the same thing.

 

[Reflexx]

If I were to take a guess, I'd say that there will be a used game marketplace through the XBOX. You'll be able to sell or trade your license.

However, there will be a commission fee that is given to the developer of the game. And it won't be a percentage, it will be a set fee based on how old the game is.

So a game that is only a month old might have a $40 fee go to the developers when you sell it to someone else. If you want to sell it for just $40, then fine. If you want to sell it for $50, then you make $10.

If a game is 6 months old, then maybe only $25 goes to the developer. If it's a year old, then $15. Two years old? Maybe $10.

And since I'm making wild guesses... I'd say that those numbers would be determined by the developer or publisher. And the time spans for when it gets cheaper would be determined by them also.

I'd also guess that a percentage of the amount that the developer makes from a license transfer would go to Microsoft, or Gamestop, or whatever store, for facilitating the actual license transfer process.

 

[Ridemyscooter86]

just remember, most likely this is what will happen, whatever sony decides to do about it, microsoft will follow. It would be idiotic on either side, for one company to have a better used game policy, like if sony said used games, no fee, and then ms said, used games 10$ fee, that would make a lot of people want to buy sony instead, so you can bet that what one company does, the other will follow suit.

 

[JonnieLasVegas]

This is exactly why I'm waiting at least 6 months, maybe a year, after release to decide which console to buy. Wait out the inevitable buggy first wave of consoles and find out which company is going to make it easier/cheaper to play used games.

 

[Bicpug]

If there's a fee even when the original dvd is in the drive, a lot of people will ignore the xbox1 and buy ps4. Requiring the original disc for a validity check is simple to do and any other system would just be MS fleecing the customers.

 

[DavidinCT]

I'm a huge Microsoft supporter, I have spend many of thousands of dollars on their products from my PocketPC 1.0 all the way up to every version to WP8 and every game system, PC too (plus tons of games)

You wana know what ? I never hacked any of my Xbox systems, my PS3 is modded like crazy. If Microsoft blocks used games like they are planning to, I will mod my xbox and buy used games to play on it. Sure I will lose my achievements and wont be able to play on line but, I can play the games I want, with out being robbed. It wont be on day one, I know that but, give it 6-8 months, the hackers always find a way, they always do. I don't want go that route but, I will, if I have to.

If the fee is like $5 for used games, that is understandable because they already made money off the game when it was sold. There is very high chance, the game I buy used, I would not of gotten at full price anyway and would not be willing to pay $60 for a game that I don't MUST HAVE. So, By Microsoft being greedy (is where I see a full retail cost for a month old used game), they will lose sales. I know I am not the only one who buys a lot of used games and for the reason of value in game.

I can live with a small fee but, a used game costing the same price of retail after fees, then I guess I will be playing a lot less games for the "one" or spend more on a PS4 (if they are not doing this). I will be buying both.

PC market, is different if you buy retail games, If you uninstall the game, and resell it, it will reinstall and play, I believe the license says you can do this as long as you do not keep any part of the program on your PCs. Kind of how Microsoft's licenses are for Windows (retail copies) where you CAN resell as long as you keep none of the software on your systems.

I guess this will have to go back to a government case, just like Music CDs.. Microsoft is trying to own the media you pay for, you should have a right to do with the media (your copy) as you choose. When you buy something, it's worth money to a point (a dollar value used, like todays market), you know if you buy a game and you don't like it or don't want to keep it, you can sell it to a friend, eBay or get ripped off by game stop. The point I am making is what Microsoft is doing is taking the Media that you own and make it worthless or worth very little.

Maybe it's me, I just think it's wrong and should be illegal. That is something for the courts to decide. I don't think this will last very long as there will be a lot of people battling this one. Say 6 months after release, a large class action lawsuit will appear, I would almost bet on it.

 

[Keith Wallace]

It doesn't have to be a small, $5 fee. We're talking about the GAME LICENSE ITSELF. It would actually benefit consumers if they made it even a $40 license. You could get 2 copies of a game from the disc purchase for $50 that way ($60 for the disc, $40 for the second license). I actually would support Microsoft in THAT endeavor, but they have to allow for releasing a license so used games and borrowing still exist.

 

[smoledman]

I'm pretty sure Microsoft will be reasonable.

 

[Reflexx]

MS has a used games plan that they will announce.

Since they're saying there will be a future announcement, whatever the plan is, it might be a big deal and worth waiting for.

 

[Coreldan]

PC market, is different if you buy retail games, If you uninstall the game, and resell it, it will reinstall and play, I believe the license says you can do this as long as you do not keep any part of the program on your PCs. Kind of how Microsoft's licenses are for Windows (retail copies) where you CAN resell as long as you keep none of the software on your systems.

But this is not the case, not even close for most games. I guess the "retail" word might sorta make you sort of right (compared to digital downloads), but generally speaking what you are afraid of is very much the reality in PC gaming already

 

[jhguth]

And just to clarify for your question about if a friend comes over; they would just need to sign in on their live name to play the game they brought. so, it will work just fine.

 

[DavidinCT]

It doesn't have to be a small, $5 fee. We're talking about the GAME LICENSE ITSELF. It would actually benefit consumers if they made it even a $40 license. You could get 2 copies of a game from the disc purchase for $50 that way ($60 for the disc, $40 for the second license). I actually would support Microsoft in THAT endeavor, but they have to allow for releasing a license so used games and borrowing still exist.

I take it you never sold or traded in a game before ? Now that $60 game you just got(that you decided you didn't want to play after all) is worth $5 because no one will pay more than $45-50 for a used game. So, that new release, you picked up 2 days ago, is worth $5 or less. RIght now, if you pick up a game, say a 360 or PS3 game that is just released, and play it, and deside you hate it, you could turn around and get $45-55 for it, if it's a hot game.

You never swapped games with your friends or rented a game before ? This breaks all of this and you wont be able to do it, even with the person next door.

You dont have an issue with that ?

I see that as a damage to value of my media, licence or not. When you sell the game, you transfter the licence of the Media, Period. That is they way it always worked. If they charge a small fee, then I am ok with it, meaning my value in my media is still there.

Everyone will have a different thought here but, I stand by how I feel about it. Same happend with me when Music market went into the same thing with Music rights and we won the rights to do with the media as we chose as long as we dont keep a copy for ourselfs if we transfter the product.

As this not final and MS is going to be clear later on this, it's more of a discussion but, I DO HAVE AN ISSUE WITH IT.

If this does go main stream and does happen, I do forsee it will end up in court. Wonder what Sony is going to do here ?

 

[Keith Wallace]

I take it you never sold or traded in a game before ? Now that $60 game you just got(that you decided you didn't want to play after all) is worth $5 because no one will pay more than $45-50 for a used game. So, that new release, you picked up 2 days ago, is worth $5 or less. RIght now, if you pick up a game, say a 360 or PS3 game that is just released, and play it, and deside you hate it, you could turn around and get $45-55 for it, if it's a hot game.

You never swapped games with your friends or rented a game before ? This breaks all of this and you wont be able to do it, even with the person next door.

You dont have an issue with that ?

I see that as a damage to value of my media, licence or not. When you sell the game, you transfter the licence of the Media, Period. That is they way it always worked. If they charge a small fee, then I am ok with it, meaning my value in my media is still there.

Everyone will have a different thought here but, I stand by how I feel about it. Same happend with me when Music market went into the same thing with Music rights and we won the rights to do with the media as we chose as long as we dont keep a copy for ourselfs if we transfter the product.

As this not final and MS is going to be clear later on this, it's more of a discussion but, I DO HAVE AN ISSUE WITH IT.

If this does go main stream and does happen, I do forsee it will end up in court. Wonder what Sony is going to do here ?

You know, this is the basis of PC gaming, and has been for YEARS now. People love Steam, and there is no game sharing or used game market on the PC, yet no one throws a fit because the prices are usually reasonable (thanks to constant sales on Steam). Yeah, I've sold games, and you NEVER get $45-55 when you trade them in. Do you pay attention to GameStop? They, on release day, guarantee a new game for $30 in trade-in value. The second you open that game, GameStop depreciates the value by 50%, and it'll drop from there after a few months, if not sooner.

I don't have much of a problem with this model, I really don't. If Microsoft uses this to LOWER new game sales prices, I'm cool with it. If we see people able to share a disc, then only pay $40-50 for that new game license, I'll give up used games for that, seeing as used games at GameStop (who borderline has a monopoly on the used game market) are $55 for their first few months, at the least.

This is all about the implementation. If they run it like Steam, putting older games up and on-sale all the time, it'll be great. If they simply use the disc as a quick way to install (instead of slow DSL like mine), and charge the same $60 for the license and make this whole thing a hassle, it'll be terrible. However, I am currently giving Microsoft the benefit of the doubt on this matter, considering how user-friendly they got with Windows Phone, and how they've managed to stay such a big company for so long. They're not QUITE dumb enough to totally botch this. Like it was speculated, the Xbox One might have initially been always-online, but they changed that after hearing the backlash and seeing the SimCity mess. If that's true, then we can (hopefully) trust that they'll hear negative feedback and concerns here and make the small adjustments as they are needed.

 

[DavidinCT]

You know, this is the basis of PC gaming, and has been for YEARS now. People love Steam, and there is no game sharing or used game market on the PC, yet no one throws a fit because the prices are usually reasonable (thanks to constant sales on Steam). Yeah, I've sold games, and you NEVER get $45-55 when you trade them in. Do you pay attention to GameStop? They, on release day, guarantee a new game for $30 in trade-in value. The second you open that game, GameStop depreciates the value by 50%, and it'll drop from there after a few months, if not sooner.

Yes, I very well understand DIGITAL DOWNLOADS. The digial downloads is something different than my point here. I clearly understand if I buy a game off steam or Xbox live, I know I own that game and cant share it or sell it. That is something that I understand and accept. There are great values in games on digital download on Steam and I do use that service too for some PC games. There is nothing wrong with the model where you buy a game that is a month old on sale for like $40-50 that is at retail for $60 and I dont mind that.

I am disussing retail games(retail box games) and not talking about GameRip off (Gamestop for trade-ins). Yes, I know if you take that new game into gamestop, they will only give you $30ish for it. If it's over a month old, your lucky if they will give you $20 for it. I checked a few times to see their offers and was insulted (a month and 1/2 old hot game they offered $10 for). I am talking about resale. Putting your game on ebay or one of the other 3rd party sites, where you will get close to retail for. I can drive to gamestop and get $10-30 for a newer game or put it up on ebay and get between $30-55. That is the best I can get for used games where people are willing to pay for the games.

It's very hard, if not impossable to find a sale on a newly released Xbox or PS3 game, so if you want it, your paying $60+tax on it. If Microsoft made the deals fair and only had a low cost to use a used game then it might be acceptable. It all depends on how greedy they get. Time has proven that they could start at one price and just keep raising it.

I guess we agree to disagree on some of this, I agree with some of your points but, not all of them. I do stand on the fact that if I buy a game for $60, I expect if I want to sell or transfer that game to someone else, my value should still be there but, if MS charges a fee for used games, I lose value in my game and I do and always will have an issue with it.

I guess we wait to see what MS says, I am sure some people will agree with me and others wont. I have no problems with that.

Come on Microsoft, your turn.