Why Isn't Windows Phone Doing Better?

Status
Not open for further replies.
You are moving goal posts. You were taking about performance and price, and I brought up a comparable Android handset, now you want to talk about awareness of said product.

Well I can be blunt and say who knows someone with a Lumia 521/520/525/630?

I saw maybe 2 people out of literally hundreds of iPhones (with some Samsung Galaxy devices) at my college with a Lumia 521. I have seen more Chromebooks at my college than people with a WP device. That's funny.

Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app

Sad, but true. I've only seen one WP device in the wild since they came out in '10. That was an Arrive, of all phones. I guess it depends where you live but Miami is iPhone country. It's hard to even see an Android. Heck, I see more BlackBerry Bolds than I see Androids.
 
Like many things, people choose smart phones based on what they have been exposed to. If your family and friends all have iPhones, you'll probably get an iPhone. Likewise for android. Or you might have to choose between one or the other. With its current market share, Windows Phone needs to do something to break that cycle or be patient and be happy with incremental growth.

Good reply. It kind of goes along with my theory that the iPhone really isn't going to be innovative anymore because everyone is "comfortable" with the way it works and they just want their apps.
 
- The OS is basically in permanent beta.

Ding Ding Ding! I have to say I can agree on this in some respect. I was a long time Zune user and then went to WP8 in November of 2012. XBOX Music is still Beta, dare I say, Alpha. Yes, they are finally making an effort to improve but it should be excellent, stable and premiere in two years. And now look in 8.1, the removal of several hubs. I loved the hubs. One of my favorites, FAMILY ROOM, is still there but scared it may be on the list to be gone soon. I've been very patient, mainly because I really don't want IOS nor do I want to go back to Android. But it is frustrating at the "Beta" of it all.
 
At my work i see more and more WP's popping up, most of them in the hands of the IT crowd (i love that show :) )
When i take my L1520 out of my pocket most of the people who see it are amazed, and when they feel how smooth it handles i can almost hear them thinking that they want one too.
I for one am fed up with Android, i had three android Phones and the last one, indeed an HTC One i gave to my daughter and bought a cheap L800 just to pas the time untill i could get a new one with my T-Mobile account.
The L800 was a real eye opener, it was the first Smartphone that i dearly loved, because everything worked seamlesly and it looked and felt like it was made out of one piece of black marble.
The next was a L920 which on my holiday in Tuscany made me realize that i wouldn't need to take a laptop, a videocamera, a photocamera and an E-reader with me on my holiday if it just was a bit bigger.
So i bought the L1520, and g**d*mn!, what a treat is that.

I am loving it, it's the best piece of hardware i have ever bought.
.
 
Sad, but true. I've only seen one WP device in the wild since they came out in '10. That was an Arrive, of all phones. I guess it depends where you live but Miami is iPhone country. It's hard to even see an Android. Heck, I see more BlackBerry Bolds than I see Androids.

I live in Atlanta and this is iPhone city. Hell, surrounding towns like where my college is at (Lawrenceville) are iPhone havens.

Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
 
Sad, but true. I've only seen one WP device in the wild since they came out in '10. That was an Arrive, of all phones. I guess it depends where you live but Miami is iPhone country. It's hard to even see an Android. Heck, I see more BlackBerry Bolds than I see Androids.

I've got you beat. I've seen three!
 
Yesterday I heard two reasons from friends on different mobile operating systems:

IPhone user: I tested it short term for the company and found it doesn't have VPN, offline mapping, good ssh tunneling, scp, or really anything that we use multiple times daily.

Android user: my phone model is waterproof, and after I smashed my stand alone gps in Panama, I used the offline mapping software (osmand) to continue my trip flawlessly. There is no offline mapping/routing solution on wp. Besides, I already have all the applications I need paid for on android.

Personally, I'm waiting on the mapping development to mirror what is on android as a guide to so finally being a same solution to mobile.
 
Yesterday I heard two reasons from friends on different mobile operating systems:

IPhone user: I tested it short term for the company and found it doesn't have VPN, offline mapping, good ssh tunneling, scp, or really anything that we use multiple times daily.

Android user: my phone model is waterproof, and after I smashed my stand alone gps in Panama, I used the offline mapping software (osmand) to continue my trip flawlessly. There is no offline mapping/routing solution on wp. Besides, I already have all the applications I need paid for on android.

Personally, I'm waiting on the mapping development to mirror what is on android as a guide to so finally being a same solution to mobile.

My reason is that I use Google Services too much and I vastly prefer sharing and intents on Android, a very underrated feature on Android.

Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
 
In my opinion it comes down to the salespeople. If they are not educated about the phone and motivated to sell it to people who walk in off the street, it doesn't matter how good the phone is.
 
Everyone keeps saying that they entered the smartphone market late...Actually, they re-entered it. HTC, Motorola, Samsung...Remember the Q, Blackjack and the Dash running Windows Mobile? Microsoft was there they had a fairly decent presence, but, they didn't react to the changing environment fast enough. Combine that with Marketing and the lack of push from reps in the stores and you find yourself in the current predicament.

as true as this is, its also true that (in my mind) they were late to the game. considering android came out on the G1 in 2008, and WP7 came out in 2010. now if i'm not mistaken, WP7 was when they started having an app store? I don't remember windows mobile having a store, anyway...which I could be mistaken about.

While I love my windows phone to death and wouldn't get rid of it (except for maybe a 1020. *drools*) they were a bit late to the game for the end-users. Most people I saw with windows phones back in circa 2006 or so were business professionals. Mostly using the Audiovox 6700/6800. (I had one of the 6800's because I thought it was an amazing phone. :D)

Has WP made leaps and bounds recently? Yes, at least I would say so.

Were they lagging behind during the great smartphone races? Again, in my mind, yes.
 
In the US, I believe it is because of carrier exclusivity deals. Until all phones are available on all carriers - or at least their high end handsets, WP will not sell the numbers they need to be relevant in US markets. Blocking their most enthusiastic fans from buying their phones (whoever may be at fault -- OEMs or carriers) can't be good for increasing marketshare.
 
In the US, I believe it is because of exclusivity deals. Until all phones are available on all carriers (or at least their high end handsets), WP will not sell the numbers they need to be relevant in US markets. Blocking their most enthusiastic fans from buying their phones can't be good for increasing marketshare.

I agree with you wholeheartedly. Its ridiculous the 1520 was an AT&T exclusive and the Icon is a Verizon exclusive. Get one high end Nokia phone on all networks.

Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
 
I agree with you wholeheartedly. Its ridiculous the 1520 was an AT&T exclusive and the Icon is a Verizon exclusive. Get one high end Nokia phone on all networks.

Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app




Its a 2 way street. The networks need to want the high end WP device, and actually do something to sell it once they get it.

Something like a 1020 should be easily available to networks and something they could give away with cheap contracts. I don't see that anywhere.





Sent from my RM-821_eu_euro1_342 using Tapatalk
 
You are moving goal posts. You were taking about performance and price, and I brought up a comparable Android handset, now you want to talk about awareness of said product.

Well I can be blunt and say who knows someone with a Lumia 521/520/525/630?

I saw maybe 2 people out of literally hundreds of iPhones (with some Samsung Galaxy devices) at my college with a Lumia 521. I have seen more Chromebooks at my college than people with a WP device. That's funny.

Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app

Well I've been out of college for several years. I don't know anyone with a Chromebook nor have I seen any in the wild. But to get back to the original point, I pointed out that the good price for performance ratio with lower end Nokia handsets and you pointed out that Motorola has offered comparable Android handsets. Fair enough, but where is that getting either company?

Most of my friends, family members, and business associates/clients have iPhones or Galaxies. A few have WP. I've seen WPs in the wild here in Pittsburgh but like others, not very many. I can remember maybe 6 instances that I saw someone in the wild using a WP. So the next question is many of these people with iPhones and Galaxies can't afford to spend a lot of money on a phone every year or two so why not buy a Nokia or Motorola handset? So here is the situation: iPhone and Samsung Galaxy have become established brands. They each have at least 5 or 6 versions, right? If you can't afford to get the latest one, you buy the previous version for a much lower price or you get the previous version from a friend or family member who has upgraded to the latest version.

Peoples mindsets are that most people they know have one of these 2 brands so they don't want to be different nor do they want to risk it being incompatible with some app or accessory or whatever they want to use so they buy one of these 2 phones. In addition since these phones are top sellers, they are what are recommended by store sales reps.
The average consumer does not have enough technical knowledge to figure out that a different manufacturer and operating system may meet their needs or even work better for them than an iPhone or Samsung Galaxy. They know of the company Microsoft and the brand of Windows but with the very long history of Windows for PCs, they associate it with inconsistent performance and complexity rather than stability and flexibility.

So what needs to be done to resolve this problem? Several things actually and many are already in the works. One is to increase the number of OEMs; this is being done. What this will do is help increase marketshare, particularly in countries outside the U.S. where many people look for budget phones and want to replace their dumbphones. Even if it helps double its marketshare in the next couple of years, developers are going to start taking the platform more seriously.
Second thing, end exclusivity among U.S. carriers. The Lumia Icon should be available from at least AT&T, T-Mobile, and Sprint, in addition to Verizon. The 1520 should be available from at least Verizon and maybe even T-Mobile in addition to AT&T, etc. Many people like 1 of these 2 handsets but don't want to switch carriers.
Third thing - rebrand. The Surface may not be a super popular tablet but it doesn't have a bad reputation either; it can be as big of a name as XBox. Combine RT and Windows Phone. Use the Surface brand for phones and don't call them Windows phones. They could simply be Surface phones.
Fourth thing - This has been discussed over and over again and there is no need to discuss again right now but improve the quality and selection of apps. Also many companies have WP apps but don't advertise them; you only see the Apple App Store and Google Play logos in their ads. This needs to be corrected.
 
Well I've been out of college for several years. I don't know anyone with a Chromebook nor have I seen any in the wild. But to get back to the original point, I pointed out that the good price for performance ratio with lower end Nokia handsets and you pointed out that Motorola has offered comparable Android handsets. Fair enough, but where is that getting either company?

Most of my friends, family members, and business associates/clients have iPhones or Galaxies. A few have WP. I've seen WPs in the wild here in Pittsburgh but like others, not very many. I can remember maybe 6 instances that I saw someone in the wild using a WP. So the next question is many of these people with iPhones and Galaxies can't afford to spend a lot of money on a phone every year or two so why not buy a Nokia or Motorola handset? So here is the situation: iPhone and Samsung Galaxy have become established brands. They each have at least 5 or 6 versions, right? If you can't afford to get the latest one, you buy the previous version for a much lower price or you get the previous version from a friend or family member who has upgraded to the latest version.

Peoples mindsets are that most people they know have one of these 2 brands so they don't want to be different nor do they want to risk it being incompatible with some app or accessory or whatever they want to use so they buy one of these 2 phones. In addition since these phones are top sellers, they are what are recommended by store sales reps.
The average consumer does not have enough technical knowledge to figure out that a different manufacturer and operating system may meet their needs or even work better for them than an iPhone or Samsung Galaxy. They know of the company Microsoft and the brand of Windows but with the very long history of Windows for PCs, they associate it with inconsistent performance and complexity rather than stability and flexibility.

So what needs to be done to resolve this problem? Several things actually and many are already in the works. One is to increase the number of OEMs; this is being done. What this will do is help increase marketshare, particularly in countries outside the U.S. where many people look for budget phones and want to replace their dumbphones. Even if it helps double its marketshare in the next couple of years, developers are going to start taking the platform more seriously.
Second thing, end exclusivity among U.S. carriers. The Lumia Icon should be available from at least AT&T, T-Mobile, and Sprint, in addition to Verizon. The 1520 should be available from at least Verizon and maybe even T-Mobile in addition to AT&T, etc. Many people like 1 of these 2 handsets but don't want to switch carriers.
Third thing - rebrand. The Surface may not be a super popular tablet but it doesn't have a bad reputation either; it can be as big of a name as XBox. Combine RT and Windows Phone. Use the Surface brand for phones and don't call them Windows phones. They could simply be Surface phones.
Fourth thing - This has been discussed over and over again and there is no need to discuss again right now but improve the quality and selection of apps. Also many companies have WP apps but don't advertise them; you only see the Apple App Store and Google Play logos in their ads. This needs to be corrected.

You say several things but besides taking on more OEMs they are still not putting the effort if they want WP to do well. I feel they are doing it just to have a decent mobile option and that is it. Little advertising, little carrier push, little Dev support. If they really cared they should have been done something not take years after the fact to do something.

Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
 
Its a 2 way street. The networks need to want the high end WP device, and actually do something to sell it once they get it.

Something like a 1020 should be easily available to networks and something they could give away with cheap contracts. I don't see that anywhere.





Sent from my RM-821_eu_euro1_342 using Tapatalk

Agreed, but at this point in the game, Microsoft should be doing whatever it takes to get one high end handset in each of the big 4 US carriers. If I were to switch operating systems, I would have no problem getting the exact high end phone that I want from my carrier. But as it is, with the operating system that I really love, I'm on the outside looking in. I'm not sure where to direct my frustration -- the carriers or the OEMs, but the current model seems to be an impediment to their success.
 
You say several things but besides taking on more OEMs they are still not putting the effort if they want WP to do well. I feel they are doing it just to have a decent mobile option and that is it. Little advertising, little carrier push, little Dev support. If they really cared they should have been done something not take years after the fact to do something.

Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app

Agree on the little advertising, little carrier support, and little developer support. Disagree on the lack of caring. Instead the problem is part mismanagement and part that Microsoft divisions haven't worked together well as a team. Both of these are being corrected; new CEO and other management staff, new divisions and more cooperation between them, and buying a hardware division from Nokia. Changes don't happen overnight. With a company as large as Microsoft, it will take several months before you start seeing more change.
 
Marketing and advertising... Offering things that are unique instead of playing catch up to features that other OS's had long ago. Carrier exclusives IMO have been holding down the Lumia brand big time as well as far really taking off
 
I went from a BlackBerry to WP7 to WP8 to BB10 back to WP8 and finally gave in and got an iPhone.
For me, it was about the apps. Simply apps that I wanted/needed. WP was ALMOST there, but not quite. The Pebble watch was the deal breaker for me.

Microsoft hasn't made a compelling reason for the average user to switch from the duopoly. I want competition (which is why I carry a Lumia 925 and an iPhone 5s). BlackBerry is in a somewhat similar (but poorer) boat - limited apps (even with their vaunted Android apps) and no compelling reason to change.

I look forward to switching back to a Windows Phone. But today is not that day. :(
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Members online

No members online now.

Forum statistics

Threads
339,823
Messages
2,262,854
Members
428,769
Latest member
Adhibadhi