Windows 10 must allow access to Android Apps to be successful on Tablets and Phones

[btgusto]

To be successful- NO it does not. Android apps are not needed. Microsoft needs to build a unified OS that is appealing to developers. Build once play every where. If this happens with W10 then we'll see the apps to coming. I don't think it's going to happen quickly just because MS still has an image problem with younger people.

I will point out a couple of my thoughts. First, I think the UI change I'm seeing in W10 need to be universal to the phone as well. It's my belief the phone needs a UI change or update. It has now been what-- 4 years now and the UI is still the same. The simplicity of the get in and get campaign in the beginning no longer works. It now makes the OS look basic. Secondly, the start screen. Tiles need to go, and get back to icons. As far as the phone version of W10 goes. The tiled start screen should be an option. I say this to answer the question of being "successful" if we are talking selling more handsets. Familiarity is the biggest key to me. People want a similar experience when they change OSes. Switching from iOS to Android is much more palatable for some users. Mostly because the mirror each other with their start screen and icons (android start screen being more open). Visually to me its very familiar with icons and background picture. I think people will switch if they know they'll get a similar experience. IOS and Android app are visually similar too. This just makes it easier to switch. While using the same apps on WP can be a different experience. This is why I believe people don't chose WP. Similar (not the same) experience, then its easier to switch, more people switch, then more apps come. Tile are better for tablets. Icons & widgets for phone and PC

 

[prasath1234]

If tiles become icons I would go back to android.come on MS do this and drive everyone to android anyway you earn through licensing on android. Lol
From Windows phone

 

[kgaouette72]

ABSOLUTELY NOT!
I find it amazing that anyone would think this is a good idea. Windows Phone is in a tenuous position for sure and all incentive to develop apps for WP would disappear. Perhaps I am overly optimistic, but I am counting on MS to reinvigorate the ecosystem once 9 (or 10) is out. At that point, logically we should see the flagships return. Understandably but also at their own peril it seems a decision was made not to "waste" a flagship on 8.1 when the hardware and software opportunities of 9 are just around the corner. Personally I think they should have put out a couple or even just one Flagship martyr to help avoid some of the negative press about this void.
But once 9 is out and some flagships start hitting the market we will still have the two largest and most difficult obstacles to increased market share - APPS! and nearly as important - commitment from the carriers namely Verizon who has above 35% of the US market. AT&T at roughly 27% has been a "reluctant" partner but still leaves a great deal of room for improvement. These carriers must not only sell WP, but they must also push updates out or allow Microsoft to work with them to push out MS updates as well as Firmware. And then, simply having the devices for sale is not enough. We all have either experienced or heard anecdotal evidence that the carriers not only don't push WP they actively push buyers AWAY from WP.
So what is the solution? Microsoft will be stuck in the same vicious circle - no apps or carrier support equals not enough customers to drive up developer support and gain leverage with the carriers. We have been stuck on this merry-go-round since the beginning. So instead of simply pushing forward and losing millions without gaining market share - perhaps it is time to lose millions AND GAIN market share. It's all about the almighty dollar. Clearly with MS pushing Exon out of 2nd place to be the highest valued publicly held US Company we know that MS has deep pockets. It's time to INVEST in Windows Phone - and don't consider it a loss, simply the cost to finally push the market share into double digits until it can support its own growth. And in my opinion this means at least two things. First - developers are not motivated to create WP apps - so pay them. Pay them very well for high quality apps. I am sure an "App Wish List" and analysis of what apps are selling on the other OS's app stores could pinpoint what users want. Then either create and in-house app dev team or collaborate outside MS and once and for all get the apps out that people want. Structure the agreement such that as soon as the apps are generating enough for the developers to continue without subsidies from MS then the contracts end or are restructured. Second: I won't pretend to know much about the relationships between the OS / OEM's and the carriers but I don't need to... i do know at the root it is about money. So "invest" in these relationships and then if they are not living up to the terms of the incentives, reduce the incentives. Money is the only motivator. Perhaps some incentives to Samsung, LG, HTC and others to bring some great WP?s to market would be another avenue to pursue.
So then imagine the scenario: Windows 10 and Windows Phone 9 or 10 (or is it going to be Windows?) are released, flagships are rolling out, the apps we want are in the store and the carriers are on board. Market share will follow. I truly believe the Windows Phone is a superior OS and am confident that Microsoft's acquisition of Nokia ensures the hardware will be equal to or better than the best from Samsung or Apple. I am sure I have oversimplified but I don't think it is rocket science. You have to spend money to make money - and if Nadella is truly playing the long game with Microsoft then this would seem to fit. Hell, they spent almost a billion dollars on the Surface RT and that was arguably a total loss. A couple hundred million on propping up Windows Phone for a few years - or less if it can begin to sustain itself and grow sooner - would be a much better use of resources. Apple had YEARS to build its app ecosystem almost entirely in a vacuum until Google emerged - and Google then had to BUY their market share. Microsoft has to be ready to compete pretty much right out of the Windows 10 Gate. It's not going to be cheap, but that's the price you pay for allowing Steve Ballmer to let Apple and Google take your market share domination right out from under you.
If you don't give us what we want, we can't wait forever, and we have all made it clear what we want. Now it's up to you Microsoft to buy it for us. I am sure in the end the money will have proven to be well spent. I don't think 2nd place would be an unrealistic goal - but it won't happen organically at this stage. You must MAKE IT HAPPEN.

 

[gadgetebz]

I upgraded to the Galaxy Note 4 as I saw no HIGH END option on Windows Phone and basically I wanted more APPS......... I only have a years contract so I plan to get a Windows Phone next September if the situation has improved. At this point the main feature I miss is being able to PIN anything I want to the START SCREEN to me this is the best feature of Windows and much more useful than LIVETILES
I feel slightly sad that I can`t recommend Windows Phone to any family or friends at the moment... Most of the people I persuaded to try a Windows Phone 2 years ago are now likely to get and Iphone or Android simply because they feel they are missing out. They will say to me can we use a particular new social network or play a new game and I have to say it will probably come put in a few months but knowing full well it is more likely to be a year away and when it does come out it will likely be of poor quality. That`s the reality!!!!!!

 

[Blacklac]

Clearly people have no idea what its like running apps on one platform that were built for a different platform.

What good are the Apps if they don't work properly/100%?

 

[gadgetebz]

ABSOLUTELY NOT!
I find it amazing that anyone would think this is a good idea. Windows Phone is in a tenuous position for sure and all incentive to develop apps for WP would disappear. Perhaps I am overly optimistic, but I am counting on MS to reinvigorate the ecosystem once 9 (or 10) is out. At that point, logically we should see the flagships return. Understandably but also at their own peril it seems a decision was made not to "waste" a flagship on 8.1 when the hardware and software opportunities of 9 are just around the corner. Personally I think they should have put out a couple or even just one Flagship martyr to help avoid some of the negative press about this void.
But once 9 is out and some flagships start hitting the market we will still have the two largest and most difficult obstacles to increased market share - APPS! and nearly as important - commitment from the carriers namely Verizon who has above 35% of the US market. AT&T at roughly 27% has been a "reluctant" partner but still leaves a great deal of room for improvement. These carriers must not only sell WP, but they must also push updates out or allow Microsoft to work with them to push out MS updates as well as Firmware. And then, simply having the devices for sale is not enough. We all have either experienced or heard anecdotal evidence that the carriers not only don't push WP they actively push buyers AWAY from WP.
So what is the solution? Microsoft will be stuck in the same vicious circle - no apps or carrier support equals not enough customers to drive up developer support and gain leverage with the carriers. We have been stuck on this merry-go-round since the beginning. So instead of simply pushing forward and losing millions without gaining market share - perhaps it is time to lose millions AND GAIN market share. It's all about the almighty dollar. Clearly with MS pushing Exon out of 2nd place to be the highest valued publicly held US Company we know that MS has deep pockets. It's time to INVEST in Windows Phone - and don't consider it a loss, simply the cost to finally push the market share into double digits until it can support its own growth. And in my opinion this means at least two things. First - developers are not motivated to create WP apps - so pay them. Pay them very well for high quality apps. I am sure an "App Wish List" and analysis of what apps are selling on the other OS's app stores could pinpoint what users want. Then either create and in-house app dev team or collaborate outside MS and once and for all get the apps out that people want. Structure the agreement such that as soon as the apps are generating enough for the developers to continue without subsidies from MS then the contracts end or are restructured. Second: I won't pretend to know much about the relationships between the OS / OEM's and the carriers but I don't need to... i do know at the root it is about money. So "invest" in these relationships and then if they are not living up to the terms of the incentives, reduce the incentives. Money is the only motivator. Perhaps some incentives to Samsung, LG, HTC and others to bring some great WP’s to market would be another avenue to pursue.
So then imagine the scenario: Windows 10 and Windows Phone 9 or 10 (or is it going to be Windows?) are released, flagships are rolling out, the apps we want are in the store and the carriers are on board. Market share will follow. I truly believe the Windows Phone is a superior OS and am confident that Microsoft's acquisition of Nokia ensures the hardware will be equal to or better than the best from Samsung or Apple. I am sure I have oversimplified but I don't think it is rocket science. You have to spend money to make money - and if Nadella is truly playing the long game with Microsoft then this would seem to fit. Hell, they spent almost a billion dollars on the Surface RT and that was arguably a total loss. A couple hundred million on propping up Windows Phone for a few years - or less if it can begin to sustain itself and grow sooner - would be a much better use of resources. Apple had YEARS to build its app ecosystem almost entirely in a vacuum until Google emerged - and Google then had to BUY their market share. Microsoft has to be ready to compete pretty much right out of the Windows 10 Gate. It's not going to be cheap, but that's the price you pay for allowing Steve Ballmer to let Apple and Google take your market share domination right out from under you.
If you don't give us what we want, we can't wait forever, and we have all made it clear what we want. Now it's up to you Microsoft to buy it for us. I am sure in the end the money will have proven to be well spent. I don't think 2nd place would be an unrealistic goal - but it won't happen organically at this stage. You must MAKE IT HAPPEN.

I think the problem is Microsoft has not been able to bribe the developers who either have huge HITS on IOS and Android or who are HUGE Multinational Companies. What is even a $1 Million payoff when a company is in a race to gain market share which allow them to be sold for billions of dollars. These companies are not going to be distracted unless there is volume on a platform which gains them enough new users to make them more valuable.. I think the only hope for Windows Phone if they don`t take the Android APP route is pray that Desktop Users start using the WINDOWS STORE in huge Numbers.. Unfortunately most people I know never login to it...

 

[MrElectrifyer]

Personally, I think the app problem only affects WP side. On the Tablet side, it's really not an issue for Windows, at least I don't think it is an issue on my Surface Pro 2. Loads of iPad apps (including games, ports of websites, etc.) on the AppStore are to counter-act the fact that you don't have a web browser with the ability to run flash content, you don't have a central file manager, AND you can't try an app before purchasing it (hence loads of lite and pro duplicates).

Windows tablets come with Internet Explorer, which has full flash content support. So, there's no need for apps of websites (like engadget, spotify, instagram, youtube etc.), nor is there a need for ported flash games (like Commando by Miniclip). Loads of flash gaming websites (like miniclip com/games/en/) are easily accessible and there's probably a lot more on just that one website than there are on the AppStore.

On top of that, you have a central file manager, File Explorer, that allows you to transfer media/documents between your local storage and external storage. So, there's no need for proprietary apps for proprietary storage solutions AND no need to connect to some other PC with iTunes just to give some app access to a file. Also, no need for different kind of apps for managing FTP shares, Samba shares, etc. It's all handled by File Explorer.

Finally, you have the ability to try out paid Windows Store apps before paying for them, all through one installation. So, no lite and pro duplicates making up for the numbers.

Take all that into consideration and you'll realize that that app excuse barely holds any water in the Tablet market. In the SmartPhone market though, it sure is a problem...the only way I would consider a WP is if Microsoft makes it as customizable as Android OR whenever we get to the point where SmartPhones are transforming into Tablets as powerful as the Surface Pro with full Windows functionality, maybe we'll then see a Surface Phone, similar to this Android guy:

 

[SammyD97]

The simplicity of the get in and get campaign in the beginning no longer works. It now makes the OS look basic. Secondly, the start screen. Tiles need to go, and get back to icons. As far as the phone version of W10 goes. The tiled start screen should be an option. I say this to answer the question of being "successful" if we are talking selling more handsets. Familiarity is the biggest key to me. People want a similar experience when they change OSes. Switching from iOS to Android is much more palatable for some users. Mostly because the mirror each other with their start screen and icons (android start screen being more open). Visually to me its very familiar with icons and background picture. I think people will switch if they know they'll get a similar experience. IOS and Android app are visually similar too. This just makes it easier to switch. While using the same apps on WP can be a different experience. This is why I believe people don't chose WP. Similar (not the same) experience, then its easier to switch, more people switch, then more apps come. Tile are better for tablets. Icons & widgets for phone and PC

Utter rubbish.

 

[Jas00555]

Clash of Clans is already on WP....

Wait, what?

 

[N_LaRUE]

Wait, what?

Woops. Sorry. My mistake.

 

[anon(5969054)]

Why are you guys so impatient. The app problem will end some day. It's a long way. But is the only way.

 

[N_LaRUE]

Why are you guys so impatient. The app problem will end some day. It's a long way. But is the only way.

If I had a ?1 for every person who said that in last year I'd be a little bit richer.

What does impatience have to do with this thread? This is about whether Android apps should run on WP and if it's essential to success of the platform.

 

[neo158]

If I had a ?1 for every person who said that in last year I'd be a little bit richer. What does impatience have to do with this thread? This is about whether Android apps should run on WP and if it's essential to success of the platform.

Being impatient has everything to do with it, look at the title of the thread and then tell me it has nothing to do with it!!

 

[N_LaRUE]

Being impatient has everything to do with it, look at the title of the thread and then tell me it has nothing to do with it!!

So someone saying that Android should be on WP is an indication of impatience? This discussion was around a while back. Same nonsense as before.

To me it's an indication of frustration of being on a platform that has been crawling since it's release. That's what I see. My perception is different than yours. Should we argue semantics next?

I already made my point a page or so back. Since you may not be inclined to go there, I'm against the idea. Just FYI.

 

[hagjohn]

Oh, hell no. Just a bad idea.

 

[jleebiker]

As someone pointed out earlier, if you exclude games from the mix, I'm not sure WP even in it's current state is really missing anything that's actually relevant to a grownup.

My issue is not the "App gap" per se, but App parity. If an app is on say, iOS, it should work the SAME on the other OS's. Regardless of OS. Case in point, Netflix. While the app is there, it lacks some of the features of the other OS's. Now while this isn't a Microsoft issue, people are going to see it that way. Facebook is another. App is there, but the features aren't the same as other OS's.

*Edit: Well, paint me purple and call me Frannie. Netflix just updated their app today and looks like it is more on par with the other OS's. You can pick which profile to watch with now.

 

[DavstarApps]

My issue is not the "App gap" per se, but App parity. If an app is on say, iOS, it should work the SAME on the other OS's. Regardless of OS. Case in point, Netflix. While the app is there, it lacks some of the features of the other OS's. Now while this isn't a Microsoft issue, people are going to see it that way. Facebook is another. App is there, but the features aren't the same as other OS's.

*Edit: Well, paint me purple and call me Frannie. Netflix just updated their app today and looks like it is more on par with the other OS's. You can pick which profile to watch with now.

I agree with you that app parity is as big a problem as the actual gap, which isn't near as big anymore. Developers throwing out a WP app just to have one doesn't mean they put much effort into it or ever keep it up to date with the newest features they come out with on other platforms. They usually don't. The money isn't there for them to care about it. Microsoft has been doing a lot to try and convince them to bring apps to the platform. It's starting to work but when's the last time a commercial for any app (or even most web pages for an app) had the Windows Phone Store logo on it? It's just not mainstream enough yet and there are few WP exclusive things to make someone pick it over others right now.

Netflix did a great job with the last update that came out today. I don't know if they make native apps is or if they use some cross platform web apps but I no longer feel that the Android version has anything over the WP version. If more of them got to that point it would go a long way. So would getting Google apps that hundreds of millions rely on, but that's not Microsoft's fault that Google is sand bagging them over that.

I'd rather see the push for native apps continue the way it has been in the last year, which has been significant, than to be able to run Android apps that would no doubt provide as poor of an experience as it does running them on Blackberry, That's a half baked solution that sounds good in theory but is clunky to deal with in reality and most people won't bother.

 

[gMaesterUK]

It's starting to work but when's the last time a commercial for any app (or even most web pages for an app) had the Windows Phone Store logo on it? It's just not mainstream enough yet and there are few WP exclusive things to make someone pick it over others right now.

Got to admit, I saw my first ad on TV the other day which included a Windows Phone Store logo, and that was for Pastry Paradise. I did raise a smile.

Getting back to the original subject on the post, I personally would not want Android apps on Windows, I do believe however that the numbers of apps are irrelevant, I would rather have 500k apps from first-party companies, then 5m apps from all and sundry. Quality over quantity!

I believe MS are looking at the app situation and seeing how best to create a better environment, I think that's why they've recently acquired an app matrix & analytics company and also an app advertising company. Also, Win10 especially in the corporate environment will have the option to only allow software to be downloaded/installed from WinStore (and the company's own signed software), which will force a number of major companies to write software for Windows and thus universally for WinPhone. I think MS have tried the Carrot, now they're going to use the Stick. I wouldn't be surprised if MS made a security setting (as an option, not compulsory) for the consumer market to ONLY allow software from the app store, again this will force major companies to develop software.

As for Unity, you develop on the Unity package, and then at the end you put in your controls based on the platform, which you then "build". Unity & MS have a video (I think YouTube) of how easy it is to Build for WP.

G.

 

[Muessig]

This thread has been extensively cleaned to remove all the bickering and is now as on-topic as it can be. Any further moderation required in this thread will result in its closure.

Your call, guys.

 

[Guytronic]

I think we've all suffered enough.

Closed