Wow W10 mobile went downhill

[anon(50597)]

FUTURE! What do you think now and tomorrow is? You are right about "no hurry" and if that is their mentality it won't enough to sustain the platform, and that IS the truth.

You can take it personal and get all upset if you want. They are clear on what their path is.
Trust me, I understand people want a new phone today. That's not going to happen. Running a business, especially the size of MS, means you cant always listen to the millions of voices telling you a million different things. You make a plan and stick with it. If you cant accept that then move on. I'm not sure what else to say. Peace.

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[anon(50597)]

With a market share at an all-time low (mid-2016 @ 0.7%) not sure your view is going to hold water much longer, even WM (PocketPC) had better stats. Then factor in the mobile user's perception of WP and I'm sad to say, the Phoenix won't be rising anytime soon nor will the endless money tree keep it from being seen for what it is or isn't... And yes BB's shares are at 0.2% so MS wins

You're not looking at the whole picture, just the piece you want to focus on. MS is not a Mobile phone producer.

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[anon(50597)]

Hey, I like this mTalk app. Not bad!

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[libra89]

Hey, I like this mTalk app. Not bad!

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I think it's pretty cool. I miss the notifications for when people quote you though. I get PM notifications but nothing else.

I hope it's something that I am doing.

 

[slivy58]

You're not looking at the whole picture, just the piece you want to focus on. MS is not a Mobile phone producer.

Sent from mTalk

Think most should be more concerned about the OS itself rather than the hardware… MS has been delving into the mobile/phone world with their operating systems, in one form or another, since the 90s, so what does that say in light of where it stands today? And their newest evolution of the OS (UWP) won’t cut it if they can’t get a stranglehold on is instability and inconsistency. Think in the end many are going to be sorely disappointed.

 

[a5cent]

btw for the random restart it could have been a poorly written app/game that caused the restart, not necessarily was it caused by hardware

If it's a hardware related defect, then another round of testing with a replacement device is only fair. However, if it's an app that caused the random restarts, then the device deserves a one way ticket to the trash bin! An app should NEVER be able to cause a restart of the device, no matter what the developer does. That's one of the main jobs an OS must do! An app may crash itself, but if it can take down the whole OS with it, then the OS is failing in an utterly spectacular and unacceptable way. W10M exhibited this sort of failure a lot more before the AU. This is what drove me to leave the OS. Random restarts should be considered an instant death sentence for any smartphone. WP7 never reset on me once. Ever. In my years of using WP8/WP8.1 I only ever experienced one umwanted restart after letting the device fall onto pavement.

Two random restarts in less than a year is enough to warrant rejection. I've had plenty of devices that met my reliability expectations. We shouldn't lower the bar to a level so low that any garbage product can pass.

 

[Neill Baldwin]

It's not the software for me. In fact I'm having a real hard time letting go of my Windows phone, going back to my LG G4. It's the few apps that are killing me and the fact I have Zero faith in Microsoft at the moment when it comes to the mobile platform. I understand their position in changing strategies because they feel they've lost too much ground. However, I just feel like us loyal customers have been hung out to dry while they change directions. If this was the case why in the world did they buy the hardware division from Nokia to start with? Nokia didn't do allot of advertising but they sure have it more effort than Microsoft did with the 950 and 950xl. Might not have made a difference but I know if I was an app developer and saw no effort to increase market share, I wouldn't have developed apps for the platform either

Posted via the Windows Central App for Android

 

[libra89]

If it's a hardware related defect, then another round of testing with a replacement device is only fair. However, if it's an app that caused the random restarts, then the device deserves a one way ticket to the trash bin! An app should NEVER be able to cause a restart of the device, no matter what the developer does. That's one of the main jobs an OS must do! An app may crash itself, but if it can take down the whole OS with it, then the OS is failing in an utterly spectacular and unacceptable way. W10M exhibited this sort of failure a lot more before the AU. This is what drove me to leave the OS. Random restarts should be considered an instant death sentence for any smartphone. WP7 never reset on me once. Ever. In my years of using WP8/WP8.1 I only ever experienced one umwanted restart after letting the device fall onto pavement.



Two random restarts in less than a year is enough to warrant rejection. I've had plenty of devices that met my reliability expectations. We shouldn't lower the bar to a level so low that any garbage product can pass.

Thank you for this post. Very well said.

I figured that I wasn't crazy. That makes sense why you left. I generally have the same experience as you with my devices. I have had issues, sure but never a random restart. Too many choices here to deal with random restarts in the name of being "loyal".

 

[beman39]

If it's a hardware related defect, then another round of testing with a replacement device is only fair. However, if it's an app that caused the random restarts, then the device deserves a one way ticket to the trash bin! An app should NEVER be able to cause a restart of the device, no matter what the developer does. That's one of the main jobs an OS must do! An app may crash itself, but if it can take down the whole OS with it, then the OS is failing in an utterly spectacular and unacceptable way. W10M exhibited this sort of failure a lot more before the AU. This is what drove me to leave the OS. Random restarts should be considered an instant death sentence for any smartphone. WP7 never reset on me once. Ever. In my years of using WP8/WP8.1 I only ever experienced one umwanted restart after letting the device fall onto pavement.

Two random restarts in less than a year is enough to warrant rejection. I've had plenty of devices that met my reliability expectations. We shouldn't lower the bar to a level so low that any garbage product can pass.

yes because Apps that are coded wrongly or poorly won't have an advers affect on a device? :eck: buddy apps have been responsible for ALL platforms of random restarts from android to IOS to windows computers to what have you... so you saying that is obsurd! so you're gonna bring back ALL of your devices that have a random restart? really?!! also I mentioned it could be a bad update or some other factor that caused the restart maybe he was running beta updates?... my point was he was too quick to bring it back... thats all I'm saying...

also maybe it was in the begining of w10m and wasn't as good as it is today or running beta editions, because with AU and new updates W10M is running top notch, ever since the beginning of owning my device there has been MINOR problems and that was because I was having trouble with the beta releases...when I quite that, my device has been running flawless and now the L950 I just got for my GF is running perfectly! theres so many UNKOWN variables of why his L950 was resarting... but IMO it isn't as bad as some poeple on here making it out to be...

 

[a5cent]

yes because Apps that are coded wrongly or poorly won't have an advers affect on a device? :eck: buddy apps have been responsible for ALL platforms of random restarts from android to IOS to windows computers to what have you... so you saying that is obsurd! so you're gonna bring back ALL of your devices that have a random restart? really?!! also I mentioned it could be a bad update or some other factor that caused the restart maybe he was running beta updates?... my point was he was too quick to bring it back... thats all I'm saying...

Buddy, I never claimed that a poorly coded app can't have "adverse affects" on a device. Battery life would be one such example. That's just not what libra89, you or I were previously talking about.

Libra specifically mentioned random restarts. In your post which I quoted you also limited your discussion to that specific topic. I think I was also quite clear that my point is strictly limited to an app's ability to trigger forced restarts. Forget the "adverse affects" angle. You wrote:

it could have been a poorly written app/game that caused the restart

Yes. At least in previous versions of W10M that could have been. For an OS to fail on that level however, it must be so incredibly immature that it should in no way be in consumer's hands. Such a device most definitely deserves to be instantly returned, as it should never have been released in the first place. Not even as a beta. An OS at that maturity level is comparable to an old office building with a foundation that requires a complete overhaul. Such an OS is also very unlikely to become reliable in a reasonable amount of time , as it necessarily means there is still a lot of "heavy construction" going on (by no means just polishing).

So, to be very clear, when confronted with that specific problem, it's not possible to be "too quick to bring it back". It shouldn't have been sold to begin with. That's all I'm saying.

 

[slivy58]

yes because Apps that are coded wrongly or poorly won't have an advers affect on a device? :eck: buddy apps have been responsible for ALL platforms of random restarts from android to IOS to windows computers to what have you... so you saying that is obsurd! so you're gonna bring back ALL of your devices that have a random restart? really?!! also I mentioned it could be a bad update or some other factor that caused the restart maybe he was running beta updates?... my point was he was too quick to bring it back... thats all I'm saying...

also maybe it was in the begining of w10m and wasn't as good as it is today or running beta editions, because with AU and new updates W10M is running top notch, ever since the beginning of owning my device there has been MINOR problems and that was because I was having trouble with the beta releases...when I quite that, my device has been running flawless and now the L950 I just got for my GF is running perfectly! theres so many UNKOWN variables of why his L950 was resarting... but IMO it isn't as bad as some poeple on here making it out to be...

Strange how my Android and iOS devices have never had a restart, ever. Shoot, our 1st gen iPad has never seen a reset either, not once... OOONLY in Windows :wink:

 

[beman39]

Strange how my Android and iOS devices have never had a restart, ever. Shoot, our 1st gen iPad has never seen a reset either, not once... OOONLY in Windows :wink:

strange how my android devices have... my Galaxy Note 2 and my BB phone had restarts happen! strange huh?

 

[beman39]

Buddy, I never claimed that a poorly coded app can't have "adverse affects" on a device. Battery life would be one such example. That's just not what libra89, you or I were previously talking about.

Libra specifically mentioned random restarts. In your post which I quoted you also limited your discussion to that specific topic. I think I was also quite clear that my point is strictly limited to an app's ability to trigger forced restarts. Forget the "adverse affects" angle. You wrote:



Yes. At least in previous versions of W10M that could have been. For an OS to fail on that level however, it must be so incredibly immature that it should in no way be in consumer's hands. Such a device most definitely deserves to be instantly returned, as it should never have been released in the first place. Not even as a beta. An OS at that maturity level is comparable to an old office building with a foundation that requires a complete overhaul. Such an OS is also very unlikely to become reliable in a reasonable amount of time , as it necessarily means there is still a lot of "heavy construction" going on (by no means just polishing).

So, to be very clear, when confronted with that specific problem, it's not possible to be "too quick to bring it back". It shouldn't have been sold to begin with. That's all I'm saying.

no but libra and YOU did say that restarts doesn't happen on other devides which is FALSE, also I was just saying that it might have been premature to return the device just on 2 restarts... he also didn't mention what time frame did these restarts occur? 2 in 1 day 2 in 1 week 2 in 30 days? and please stop with the nonsense, restarts can happen in how ever old the OS is... it does happen when program is not coded properly and causes a catastrophic event which cause the OS to reboot/restart... happens all the time! or sometime you get BSOD or sometimes you get freezes... it manifeste in differant ways for differant systems... so in conclusion W10M didn't/hasn't gone downhill it is getting better and better everyday... NOT INCLUDING THE BETA!

 

[slivy58]

strange how my android devices have... my Galaxy Note 2 and my BB phone had restarts happen! strange huh?

I NEVER had an unannounced restart on my BlackBerry's, Android's nor i-Device's, nor my MacBook Pro, repeat, NEVER. My first introduction to that on a portable device was, you guessed it, a Windows Phone, same experience I was use to with Windows PC, of course with the latter that soon became pretty much non-existent when W7 came along theeeeen, there was W10. Amazing how we end up coming full circle isn't it.

Now that I've ruffled your feathers... In all fairness I do know it happens on other platforms yet from my experiences and other I know, it isn't nearly as prevalent on those platforms compared to Windows in general, IMO, MS cornered the market on that one long long ago.

 

[VetDuarte]

Hey, I like this mTalk app. Not bad!

Sent from mTalk

Not bad at all.
Quite confusing, though, coming from Tapatalk.

Sent with Lumia 640XL from mTalk

 

[beman39]

I NEVER had an unannounced restart on my BlackBerry's, Android's nor i-Device's, nor my MacBook Pro, repeat, NEVER. My first introduction to that on a portable device was, you guessed it, a Windows Phone, same experience I was use to with Windows PC, of course with the latter that soon became pretty much non-existent when W7 came along theeeeen, there was W10. Amazing how we end up coming full circle isn't it.

Now that I've ruffled your feathers... In all fairness I do know it happens on other platforms yet from my experiences and other I know, it isn't nearly as prevalent on those platforms compared to Windows in general, IMO, MS cornered the market on that one long long ago.

ok so good for you its never happened on YOUR BB and ios or android, but it HAS on MINE, just like I've NEVER had a restart on my L950XL and others too... does it make our point? NO, so why try to bring it up like its only a windows thing which again is false! I find some folks here trying to spread false info and causing even a bigger problem for W10M and bigger bad rap... please JUST STOP. anyways this all I'm going to say on this matter...

 

[a5cent]

no but libra and YOU did say that restarts doesn't happen on other devides which is FALSE, also I was just saying that it might have been premature to return the device just on 2 restarts... he also didn't mention what time frame did these restarts occur? 2 in 1 day 2 in 1 week 2 in 30 days? and please stop with the nonsense, restarts can happen in how ever old the OS is... it does happen when program is not coded properly and causes a catastrophic event which cause the OS to reboot/restart... happens all the time! or sometime you get BSOD or sometimes you get freezes... it manifeste in differant ways for differant systems... so in conclusion W10M didn't/hasn't gone downhill it is getting better and better everyday... NOT INCLUDING THE BETA!

Nowhere did I say that random resets "don't happen on other devices". I'm aware of a few devices where such problems exist.

What I did say is that we enjoyed two versions of WP (WP7/WP8.x) where apps crashing the OS was practically unheard of. In fact, OS crashes of any kind, no matter what the reason, were practically non-existent on WP7. Please stop putting words in my mouth. I'm not sure if you're having trouble precisely parsing text, or if you're intentionally misunderstanding me.

Anyway, I posted because you stated that we should be somewhat tolerant of apps crashing the OS, and you implied, intentionally or not, that this was the result of poorly coded apps more so than it was the result of a dysfunctional OS. That's the only nonsense here. That's the only thing I'm refuting and it has nothing at all to do with libra89's policy for returning devices.

Isolating applications from each other, managing direct hardware access, and intercepting critical errors so as to prevent rogue apps from taking down the entire OS, no matter what they do, is one of the primary jobs any modern OS must fulfill. There will always be crummy apps in the app store. Half of them are built by hobbyists who couldn't program a reliable app if their life depended on it. That's part of reality and it's something a consumer OS must be able to handle. A consumer OS that can't do that belongs in the trash bin, as that is indicative of a systemic deficiency that can almost never be fixed in a short amount of time... that has already been born out by W10M. I have no problem with the occasional app crashing. Only if it takes the entire phone down with it does it become unacceptable. That must be pinned on the OS, and it's too critical of an issue that we should be tolerant of it just because we like WP or MS.

I hope that is now understandable. Either way I'll leave it at that.

 

[badMojo69]

I just came here to say...I really miss using WP as my daily driver. I'm stuck on IPhone after my Note7 had to be sent back.
Microsoft is just stupid. How can a company have so much money and not be able to entice developers to make good software for their mobile OS.

Hands down the best mobile OS out there.

 

[a5cent]

I just came here to say...I really miss using WP as my daily driver. I'm stuck on IPhone after my Note7 had to be sent back.
Microsoft is just stupid. How can a company have so much money and not be able to entice developers to make good software for their mobile OS.

The idea unfortunately isn't as good as it sounds. MS can pay one developer to release an app, but MS will get exactly what they payed for and not a single feature more. If the developer couldn't be bothered to develop the app on their own, independently of MS, then they're unlikely to maintain the app, meaning the app is well on its way to becoming abandon-ware as soon as MS' check is cashed.

Worst of all, by paying developers to make apps for WP, MS signals to every developer under the sun that it's better to not release a WP app, even if the developer may have originally considering doing so. It's far better to hold back, potentially forcing MS to throw money your way. This idea becomes more tempting the more important the app is, i.e. the more leverage the developer thinks they have, and the more WP users want that app. All this really achieves is to start a vicious cycle where no app gets built at all until MS pays up. In reality it achieves the exact opposite of what you'd want it to.

Paying developers to build apps has always been one of the worst ideas thrown around in these forums. Its a good replication of a small-scale centrally controlled economy. A system where a governing body picks winners and losers by deciding who gets paid to build apps for the WP eco/system/nomy, rather than letting the free market decide. You could label this small-scale communism. It has never and will never work. On any scale.

 

[beman39]

Microsoft is just stupid. How can a company have so much money and not be able to entice developers to make good software for their mobile OS.

Hands down the best mobile OS out there.

I agree 100% all that money and power and they can't get devs on board!! really?!!! like I been saying, give devs a small % of profits from the store ontop of thier money they generate from apps/games and you'll see how fast they get on board