06-21-2013 11:39 AM
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  1. DavidinCT's Avatar
    This thread alone shows we will all use or need different things in our systems. Can we just agree to disagree here ?

    Everyone's system location is different, everyone's uses is different, just because you dont like something does that give you the right to give them a hard time about it ?

    We should all agree on the DRM, 24 hour checks and a eye watching you all the time is the advantage of what the PS4 offers....
    06-14-2013 02:55 PM
  2. vertigoOne's Avatar
    This thread alone shows we will all use or need different things in our systems. Can we just agree to disagree here ?

    Everyone's system location is different, everyone's uses is different, just because you dont like something does that give you the right to give them a hard time about it ?

    We should all agree on the DRM, 24 hour checks and a eye watching you all the time is the advantage of what the PS4 offers....
    Or disadvantage, if UNO what I mean.
    06-14-2013 03:00 PM
  3. Bicpug's Avatar
    A couple of years ago it would have been the ramblings of a conspiracy nut to suggest that kinect2 may end up as a camera in every home spying on you, but given the way governments (especially the US) are lying to us about how much surveillance they now do with little to no oversight i'm not so sure.
    06-14-2013 03:06 PM
  4. coip's Avatar
    What is not to understand here ? Have you read the complants of people ? DRM is one of those evil bastards that has been created over the years that just make honest users have to feel like a crook to use their own content they paid for the right to use. Look up history on it. I even know a handfull of people who picked up a ton ($100's worth) music from a company with DRM, the company went under, all their music was unplayable with not way to get their music or money back. This has happened to a lot of people, so when DRM comes up, everyone gets upset. Same here, I hate it too as I have issues with it in the past.
    I agree with you that the 'just because others are doing it' argument doesn't mean gamers have to like it, and I agree that there are problems with it, as you pointed out. All I was saying is that I find it odd that gamers are surprised by this when they've already been doing it for years on their smartphones. If they want to be mad, they should be mad at Apple. Where was the uproar 6 years ago when the iPhone launched and they were granting 24/7 access to every stupid app they downloaded on their phones, or the fact that they purchased dozens of apps that are tied to that device? If anything, Xbox One's policy is much more lax (static check-ins, ability to share, lend, or sell games, ability to access your games on other devices, etc.). Sure, I think that smartphones users accepted all the shenanigans, because they had no basis of comparison. On the other hand, console gamers remember "good old days" -- it is much easier to get upset when something gets taken away from you.

    Nevertheless, the part that vexes me is all of it is directed at Microsoft while Sony is being praised for maintaining the status quo. Sony isn't maintaining the status quo. If they were doing so, they would say explicitly, "No DRM on PS4!", and that would be praiseworthy. Instead, what they're doing is just deflecting blame: "Oh, it's not our fault; we're just leaving it up to the developers, so blame them". They're still allowing it to happen, and they're pretending that they aren't and misleading the masses. That's what irks me. Time will tell, but anyone who is choosing the PS4 over the Xbox One for these reasons is likely to be very disappointed: PS4 games will not be DRM-free either.

    I commiserate with people who don't have regular Internet access (rural folk, people in less wired nations, military members, etc.) and I hope that Microsoft comes up with a solution to that dilemma, but I don't understand the majority of "hardcore gamers" who are spouting off on the Internet how draconian it all is when, in reality, they've already been doing it for years.
    06-14-2013 03:11 PM
  5. coip's Avatar
    Also, the check in isn't so much the problem; its the penalty for now doing it. Yes, put a hold on my account if I sign on through a hacked system. But don't do it just because I didn't let you know where I was for a day or two.

    There's no app that'll brick your phone if you don't show it your location...
    One of us is mis-interpreting the check-in policy. You seem to be interpreting to mean that if you don't check-in every 24 hours your Xbox is going to explode. I interpret it to mean that you can check-in, then you can play the game for up to 24 hours. But, if you want to take a 3-week break from that game, that's no problem (people go on vacation, after all). Then you just re-log in after 3-weeks, check-in, and pick up where you left off.
    06-14-2013 03:17 PM
  6. Bicpug's Avatar
    coip: Human nature; it's one thing to do it voluntarily but being told to submit to unnecessary DRM it triggers an automatic rebel response.
    06-14-2013 03:19 PM
  7. Only Mama Knows's Avatar
    I don't get the uproar over Xbox One and the hardcore gamer's preference for Sony's strategy of physical disc sharing. On Xbox One, with everything digital, you can lend games to ten friends, digitally and remotely, and you can access your entire game library at a friend's house just by logging in. That is way more convenient.

    Online check-ins
    I understand this sounds creepy, but everyone already does this with their cell phones. They download a bunch of apps from dozens of different companies and give authorization for those companies to track their location data 24/7. And now they are freaking out about having to 'check-in' for a second on Xbox. It doesn't make sense to me, but it wouldn't surprise me if Microsoft softened it a little bit, but I get why they are doing it: it's good for the developers and if you do what's good for developers, the exclusive games will come.

    I just find it amusing that people largely don't fuss about the smartphone stuff and are suddenly all upset about this. It suggests to me they don't really understand what they are already doing, which is scary, and how the Xbox One is better about it. Cell phone users give apps 24/7 access to their location--everywhere they go, everything they do. Xbox One is nowhere near as Orwellian: it's requiring you to check in (which most 360 users already do) from a static location, periodically. On top of that, they're all freaking out about the used/rental games, but these same people have tons of games and apps on their smart phones that are tied to those smart phones: they can't rent them, they can't sell them, they can't lend them. But, with the Xbox One, you can still sell them and you can lend them to up to 10 people.

    Restrictions on lending and selling:
    Again, people already put up with this whether they are playing games on their PC (mandatory installs, no sharing or re-selling) or on their smartphones and tablets (they buy games, those games are tied to the device, and they cannot sell them or lend them at all). But with the Xbox One strategy, you can lend them: digitally or you can re-sell the disc. Sure, there will be some restrictions, but there has to be or the industry will implode.

    DRM in general:
    This is the way it's going because piracy was destroying game developers' incentives to make games. Microsoft looks like the bad guy here, but Sony has already said that they are leaving DRM decisions up to the third-party developers on PS4, which means games on PS4 will likely have the same restrictions anyway, except instead of them being standardized, they'll be all over the place which will create confusion

    Benefits of digital:
    There are also a lot of potential benefits do going completely digital that may leave PS4 behind. Xbox One is embracing the ability to do cloud computing to aid the console, which means that in a few years down the road, while the PS4 is trapped with its current hardware specs, the Xbox One will be getting more powerful.

    Kinect vs. Eye:
    Including the Kinect explains the higher price tag, but it's the right decision. If you bundle the Kinect, developers have an incentive to develop for it because everyone with an Xbox One has one. Sony, by not bundling the Eye is essentially killing it by limiting it to a side peripheral that only a small minority of PS4 users will have, giving little incentive for developers to innovate with it. Hardcore gamers may not care about voice and movement integration, but I'd rather see how developers can innovate with it
    1. Home consoles are NOT the same as cell phones. Apples and oranges. What if my internet goes down at home, or I don't need it? I'd like to still be able to use my console.
    2. I don't play PC games, so it doesn't currently affect me. I'd like to be able to whatever I want with the physical media I have purchased, whether that's lending to someone else or selling it to a 2nd hand retailer.
    3. Yea, DRM is coming for everyone so no way to get around this. However, I view mandatory DRM for all games on a console different than leaving it up to the publisher, but not a big difference.
    4. We'll see. Benefits of digital are really just promises right now. Whatever the new SimCity is promised all of the benefits of cloud computing and that seems to have turned into a complete disaster.
    5. Couldn't care less about the eye or Kinect. I think forcing it on consumers or publishers is a mistake.

    These are just my reasons for purchasing a PS4 to start. I'm sure the Xbox One will be a great system, and when it eventually drops in price I may pick one up. For now, I just don't see the added benefit to justify the extra 100
    06-14-2013 03:27 PM
  8. _X_'s Avatar
    What I don't get is this thread supporting MS for their actions. I also don't get why this site is so MS fanatical. One thing is to like MS products but it's another level to pretend MS can do no wrong.

    The step MS is proposing is a big deal, but even a bigger deal when you see the direction their heading to. If you recall they proposed denying all used games after an outcry they revered that decision but still implemented some DRM. What's to stop them from implementing this in the future via a software update?


    Going to your phone analogy. Yes there are many parallels. If an app requires internet access for it to work(but is not a network app) It gets uninstalled. I also do not willingly give my information out to any app, it must justify the need else it will not be installed. However there is one major difference in your analogy not all apps have DRM. I use Android and I can backup my apps and have them work on any future Android device. Also the average App cost a few dollars while these console game cost $60.

    I own all three consoles and I will say this if MS does not change their direction I will only support the WII and PS.

    =X=
    06-14-2013 03:32 PM
  9. DavidinCT's Avatar
    I agree with you that the 'just because others are doing it' argument doesn't mean gamers have to like it, and I agree that there are problems with it, as you pointed out. All I was saying is that I find it odd that gamers are surprised by this when they've already been doing it for years on their smartphones. If they want to be mad, they should be mad at Apple. Where was the uproar 6 years ago when the iPhone launched and they were granting 24/7 access to every stupid app they downloaded on their phones, or the fact that they purchased dozens of apps that are tied to that device? If anything, Xbox One's policy is much more lax (static check-ins, ability to share, lend, or sell games, ability to access your games on other devices, etc.). Sure, I think that smartphones users accepted all the shenanigans, because they had no basis of comparison. On the other hand, console gamers remember "good old days" -- it is much easier to get upset when something gets taken away from you.
    The difference here is, Apple started as a digital download, so did Windows Phone, and other types of devices, Android, etc. Digital downloads are the way they are and I, with most people accept that. This is totally different from the issue at hand.

    The issue is with PHYSICAL MEDIA. When you buy a disc, you should have a right to do what you want with the disc. Sell, give away, or what ever you want. The courts decided how people have the right to sell their music CD and it would almost apply here.

    Microsoft is trying to turn everything to digital in a market that has always been based on Physical media, cart, CD or DVD based. Sony saw the reaction from people, and played off it, this is why they look like the golden child here..

    This is the problem and till it's addressed, it's a major problem with me, as others...this is the big deal with used games.

    coip: Human nature; it's one thing to do it voluntarily but being told to submit to unnecessary DRM it triggers an automatic rebel response.
    Wrong, read above.
    06-14-2013 03:57 PM
  10. In Limbo's Avatar
    So who with an Xbox 360 is going to "rebel" and switch with Halo 5 in the works? Sure some, but I have a feeling most will calm down and just buy the Xbox One.
    Graven Pshya likes this.
    06-14-2013 04:26 PM
  11. sinime's Avatar
    coip: Human nature; it's one thing to do it voluntarily but being told to submit to unnecessary DRM it triggers an automatic rebel response.
    I have to agree with that, although I have no issues with what MS is doing (did at first, then I calmed down and realized it won't really effect me.)

    And the kicker is all the Sony fanboys that "know", for a fact, that there will be no DRM on the third party PS4 titles.

    Only thing that bugs me, is that at some point down the road, probably close to release of whatever XBox comes next, I can't just sell the games with the system, I'll be forced to go to a participating retailer and take it up the bobo for the games.
    06-14-2013 04:39 PM
  12. vertigoOne's Avatar
    Only thing that bugs me, is that at some point down the road, probably close to release of whatever XBox comes next, I can't just sell the games with the system, I'll be forced to go to a participating retailer and take it up the bobo for the games.
    I read in one of the articles that came out this week that MS is already pre-planning so that the digital content of this next generation will follow you into the generation that follows it.
    06-14-2013 04:44 PM
  13. allos autos's Avatar
    06-14-2013 04:47 PM
  14. mister2d's Avatar
    1. Home consoles are NOT the same as cell phones. Apples and oranges. What if my internet goes down at home, or I don't need it? I'd like to still be able to use my console.
    2. I don't play PC games, so it doesn't currently affect me. I'd like to be able to whatever I want with the physical media I have purchased, whether that's lending to someone else or selling it to a 2nd hand retailer.
    3. Yea, DRM is coming for everyone so no way to get around this. However, I view mandatory DRM for all games on a console different than leaving it up to the publisher, but not a big difference.
    4. We'll see. Benefits of digital are really just promises right now. Whatever the new SimCity is promised all of the benefits of cloud computing and that seems to have turned into a complete disaster.
    5. Couldn't care less about the eye or Kinect. I think forcing it on consumers or publishers is a mistake.

    These are just my reasons for purchasing a PS4 to start. I'm sure the Xbox One will be a great system, and when it eventually drops in price I may pick one up. For now, I just don't see the added benefit to justify the extra 100


    1. No, they are NOT the same as cell phones, but the underlying architecture and market IS converging to be more of the same (with apps, downloads, system updates, etc). So, you can make a point that Microsoft is FORWARD thinking here as it pertains to gaming consoles.

    2. I believe that's why there is another option for you here. Microsoft isn't forcing you to buy the X1.

    3. I'm quite sure the publishers don't have a problem with it. It helps their bottom line too when you consider the used games market as it is today.

    4. Digital delivery isn't just promises right now. See point number 1. It's a proven industry that brings money to developers and providers alike. Heck anyone who has a phone these days can thank Apple for digital software delivery. It just works--unless some just doesn't want to pay for anything and pirate.

    5. Again, no one's forcing anything here. Consider that Microsoft's software/hardware vision is more directed to the future and not what you see today. The Kinect is integral to what they are envisioning 5-10 years down the line by bundling it with the X1, whereas Sony is making it optional. Meaning optionally develop for it on the PS4. Look, you may not like it, but it's all based on Microsoft's vision to be as much future proof as possible until the next iteration.
    06-14-2013 04:53 PM
  15. MerlotC's Avatar
    IMO the real problem is not the policies or limitations as, for myself and I think for most connected people, the advantages outweigh the limitations. The uproar though is Microsofts fault for not explaining long ago that the future Xbox would be a digital only system and start touting those benefits like family share etc. so people had a chance to digest it all long before reveal and E3 and then blow them away with great games at E3 and announce more features etc. I think this was their general strategy but it was poorly timed, poorly implemented and poorly communicated (and is still not being communicated).

    The more people learn and compare the old (ps4) way of doing things to the new a lot will change their view but it could have been so much easier if MS had any marketing sense. I still expect them to announce other benefits, possibly have an offline "solution" or maybe even hdmi 360 integration before launch but why hold back if these are in the works? I love the Xbox One and most MS products but their PR dept. sucks.
    06-14-2013 04:59 PM
  16. coip's Avatar
    coip: Human nature; it's one thing to do it voluntarily but being told to submit to unnecessary DRM it triggers an automatic rebel response.


    Well, the developers who lose millions of dollars due to piracy probably wouldn't describe it as "unnecessary DRM", but, yes, I understand the backlash--I just don't understand why it's not aimed at Sony too (they're still allowing it), or why it never came against Apple or Google for iOS and Android for doing the same thing.

    1. Home consoles are NOT the same as cell phones. Apples and oranges. What if my internet goes down at home, or I don't need it? I'd like to still be able to use my console.
    2. I don't play PC games, so it doesn't currently affect me. I'd like to be able to whatever I want with the physical media I have purchased, whether that's lending to someone else or selling it to a 2nd hand retailer.
    3. Yea, DRM is coming for everyone so no way to get around this. However, I view mandatory DRM for all games on a console different than leaving it up to the publisher, but not a big difference.
    4. We'll see. Benefits of digital are really just promises right now. Whatever the new SimCity is promised all of the benefits of cloud computing and that seems to have turned into a complete disaster.
    5. Couldn't care less about the eye or Kinect. I think forcing it on consumers or publishers is a mistake.

    These are just my reasons for purchasing a PS4 to start. I'm sure the Xbox One will be a great system, and when it eventually drops in price I may pick one up. For now, I just don't see the added benefit to justify the extra 100
    In a basic sense, they are pretty much the same: they're devices you use to access and play games. But, yeah, I feel the same way: it would be nice to have the option to play offline if that's your cup of tea or if the 'Net goes out or if you want to go vacation up in the mountains or whatever. But we've got to consider the pros and cons of it all. I think I'm ready to give that up to get the benefits of cloud-based gaming (not just the performance improvements of updates and cloud processing, but the ability to no longer haul around physical media, although I realize some people like this). You can still lend games and sell them. In some ways it's more restrictive (i.e., only being able to be sold once), but in other ways it's easier (sharing with up to 10 friends digitally and remotely). As for 'mandatory DRM' vs. leaving it up to the publisher, I prefer Microsoft's route as I like standardization. I memorize the rules once, and that's that. Sony's strategy is going to create chaos with some publishers doing X, some doing Y, and some doing Z. Yes, I've read that the promised cloud computing benefits of Sim City didn't live up to expectations, and I cannot comment much on it since I'm not a computer programmer, but I don't think Microsoft would be touting it so much if it was just a gimmick. My point is that I'm not a fan of the DRM thing either, particularly the check-ins, but I don't get why people think PS4 will be any better.

    As for the Kinect, that is what excites me the most. My experience with the original Kinect was piqued interest that quickly faded: most of the motion control is clumsy and quickly gets old. But, that's first generation hardware and software. With each generation it will get better, especially with Microsoft motivating developers to innovate by bundling it with the system. Sure, right now nothing beats the controller, but I for one sure hope that ten, twenty years from now we aren't still sitting on a chair holding a controller. I want full body immersion, and Microsoft is pushing toward that with Kinect and Illumi Room. Sony isn't pushing the industry in the direction I want it to go: the same old games with slightly prettier graphics aren't what I want.

    What I don't get is this thread supporting MS for their actions. I also don't get why this site is so MS fanatical. One thing is to like MS products but it's another level to pretend MS can do no wrong.

    The step MS is proposing is a big deal, but even a bigger deal when you see the direction their heading to. If you recall they proposed denying all used games after an outcry they revered that decision but still implemented some DRM. What's to stop them from implementing this in the future via a software update?

    Going to your phone analogy. Yes there are many parallels. If an app requires internet access for it to work(but is not a network app) It gets uninstalled. I also do not willingly give my information out to any app, it must justify the need else it will not be installed. However there is one major difference in your analogy not all apps have DRM. I use Android and I can backup my apps and have them work on any future Android device. Also the average App cost a few dollars while these console game cost $60. I own all three consoles and I will say this if MS does not change their direction I will only support the WII and PS.=X=
    Don't get me wrong: I'm not an advocate of what Microsoft is doing (although, I do think it's better than what Sony is doing). I just feel that people are freaking out about things they already do (being constantly connected on their Xbox 360s or smartphones), and defecting to Sony for things that will undoubtedly exist on the PS4 too. I recall them softening their stance on the used games, and I think that's good. I hope they soften it in other ways too (particularly, the 24-hour check-in). As for the price difference between consoles and smart phone apps, presumably this DRM junk is also going to result in lower prices for console games too, as it did on Steam. Here's to hoping that comes true, otherwise the consumer really is getting shortchanged.

    The difference here is, Apple started as a digital download, so did Windows Phone, and other types of devices, Android, etc. Digital downloads are the way they are and I, with most people accept that. This is totally different from the issue at hand.

    The issue is with PHYSICAL MEDIA. When you buy a disc, you should have a right to do what you want with the disc. Sell, give away, or what ever you want. The courts decided how people have the right to sell their music CD and it would almost apply here.

    Microsoft is trying to turn everything to digital in a market that has always been based on Physical media, cart, CD or DVD based. Sony saw the reaction from people, and played off it, this is why they look like the golden child here..This is the problem and till it's addressed, it's a major problem with me, as others...this is the big deal with used games.
    I think they're going to argue that the Xbox One is no longer a physical media machine, much like PC software. Yes, you get a physical disc, but it's only for installation purposes (so you don't have to download 50GB games all the time). In this sense, the past is gone. Apple and Valve changed it and everyone is going to follow suit. It will face some growing pains, but ultimately I think the pros outweigh the cons as long as we're thinking from an innovation point of view. Again, I get the backlash against this; I just don't get why gamers don't realize that Sony's move was just PR bull**** and that the PS4 will be the same way.
    06-14-2013 08:29 PM
  17. coip's Avatar
    IMO the real problem is not the policies or limitations as, for myself and I think for most connected people, the advantages outweigh the limitations. The uproar though is Microsofts fault for not explaining long ago that the future Xbox would be a digital only system and start touting those benefits like family share etc. so people had a chance to digest it all long before reveal and E3 and then blow them away with great games at E3 and announce more features etc. I think this was their general strategy but it was poorly timed, poorly implemented and poorly communicated (and is still not being communicated).

    The more people learn and compare the old (ps4) way of doing things to the new a lot will change their view but it could have been so much easier if MS had any marketing sense. I still expect them to announce other benefits, possibly have an offline "solution" or maybe even hdmi 360 integration before launch but why hold back if these are in the works? I love the Xbox One and most MS products but their PR dept. sucks.
    I totally agree with you. I have the same frustration with Microsoft's PR and marketing departments. They're just atrocious at it, in all areas too. These ads that are finally coming out now for Surface and Windows tablets vs. iPads, these should've been released 8 months ago. Same with all this Xbox One backlash. They should've had a well scripted game plan where they clearly lauded all the benefits of what they're doing. Instead, they thought they could just throw it out there nonchalantly, people wouldn't react, and they could move on. How they didn't see this coming is very perplexing, especially after the firestorm a few months ago with that one Microsoft employee on Twitter telling people to stop whining and then mocking people who live in rural areas, and then with the firestorm EA faced with Sim City over DRM they should've factored that in, and even now with the current story of the Microsoft rep telling people who don't like Xbox One policies to stick with the Xbox 360. It just all comes off as condescending and poorly thought out and it is mind-boggling to me. What they should be doing is clearly explaining the pros of everything they're doing.
    06-14-2013 08:39 PM
  18. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    So who with an Xbox 360 is going to "rebel" and switch with Halo 5 in the works? Sure some, but I have a feeling most will calm down and just buy the Xbox One.
    In my case, I'll not be truly rebelling. I'll stick solely to the Xbox 360. Nintendo makes horrid home consoles, to put it lightly. Sony doesn't give me enough franchises I like to warrant a second online subscription to PSN+ and another console investment. The Xbox One has too many terrible software design choices to support it right now.

    I want Halo 5, no doubt, but I also expect that since they say that the Xbox 360 will be supported for AT LEAST 3-4 more years, then we would likely get Halo 5, considering it is the flagship franchise under the Xbox brand. I don't think they're dumb enough to alienate owners, tell them to get/keep their 360s, then tell them they won't put out Halo on the Xbox 360 as well.
    06-14-2013 11:33 PM
  19. Etios's Avatar
    They deserve all the backlash, first they announced the 24hrs check-in thingy, then responded to the complaints by suggesting to get a 360.

    Even all this was fine to me But the final straw was the one year late release in Asia and region-locking so i can't even import, So Sony PS4 is what i will buy.
    06-15-2013 12:12 AM
  20. Mystictrust's Avatar
    I want Halo 5, no doubt, but I also expect that since they say that the Xbox 360 will be supported for AT LEAST 3-4 more years, then we would likely get Halo 5, considering it is the flagship franchise under the Xbox brand. I don't think they're dumb enough to alienate owners, tell them to get/keep their 360s, then tell them they won't put out Halo on the Xbox 360 as well.
    Not sure about that. I believe Halo 5 will stay on the Xbox One. They truly designed it completely for that system, including 60fps and the cloud-based processing. I MAY have even seen an interview with someone from 343 Industries claiming that they definitely wouldn't be bringing this to the Xbox 360. And I wouldn't say that them not bringing Halo 5 to Xbox 360 is "alienating" their previous customers. They may very well have hundreds of games coming, and that's a good thing, but it doesn't necessarily mean Halo is part of that. I don't think it is "alienating" their Xbox 360 customers because of that... are all these games suddenly invalidated because of that? I'm picking up a couple of games that have been confirmed to not be coming to Xbox One, and they will make me MORE than happy. Well, that and I'm looking forward to more sales on Xbox 360 digital downloads that I can take advantage of.
    06-15-2013 12:13 AM
  21. WPButtcheeks's Avatar
    Take that with a pinch of salt - its from a supposed programmer on the xbox team and hes saying that xbox are moving towards a steam like model - theres no reason why you couldn't get steam like prices and sales but its down to the developers to decide - and nothings been decided yet.
    You can get steam like deals from PSN now. Compared to Xbox Lives lackluster sales.
    06-15-2013 12:38 AM
  22. theeboredone's Avatar
    This happens at E3 all the time, but not surprising that MS is in the spotlight for it...

    Xbox One Games At E3 Were Running On Windows 7 With Nvidia GTX Cards
    06-15-2013 01:04 AM
  23. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    Not sure about that. I believe Halo 5 will stay on the Xbox One. They truly designed it completely for that system, including 60fps and the cloud-based processing. I MAY have even seen an interview with someone from 343 Industries claiming that they definitely wouldn't be bringing this to the Xbox 360. And I wouldn't say that them not bringing Halo 5 to Xbox 360 is "alienating" their previous customers. They may very well have hundreds of games coming, and that's a good thing, but it doesn't necessarily mean Halo is part of that. I don't think it is "alienating" their Xbox 360 customers because of that... are all these games suddenly invalidated because of that? I'm picking up a couple of games that have been confirmed to not be coming to Xbox One, and they will make me MORE than happy. Well, that and I'm looking forward to more sales on Xbox 360 digital downloads that I can take advantage of.
    I just mean that for all of the backlash that's come, it'd be tough to find something worse than telling everyone who can't find a tenable solution to owning an Xbox One as-is to buy an Xbox 360, then come back and tell them they won't be getting the franchise that literally BUILT THE BRAND. In the case of many, Halo is the whole reason they are with the Xbox ecosystem. Taking that away is perhaps worse than taking any other aspect of the console away.
    06-15-2013 12:08 PM
  24. Keith Wallace's Avatar
    This happens at E3 all the time, but not surprising that MS is in the spotlight for it...

    Xbox One Games At E3 Were Running On Windows 7 With Nvidia GTX Cards
    "[Update: PS4 developers state that their games were running on actual PS4 dev kits, not high-end PCs]"

    Makes is sound even worse. Admittedly, it's pretty pathetic that they wouldn't even use a Windows 8 machine. What were they thinking there? I must say, the first comment seems to be the best way to look at it:

    "I don't get it, did they run a drunk bet in Microsoft's offices, to see who could manage to screw up more?"
    06-15-2013 12:21 PM
  25. Mystictrust's Avatar
    "[Update: PS4 developers state that their games were running on actual PS4 dev kits, not high-end PCs]"
    Pretending for a second that dev kits don't actually have superior specs to the actual console, the smart move was to run the demos on similar hardware (not sure what to think about the video card situation, but how did they know that Nvidia was used again?). If Microsoft ran their demos off the actual Xbox One, with unfinished software, firmware, optimizations, etc... and it froze up like Sony's games did at their press conference, Microsoft would be in even MORE hot water now than they already are. Sony mostly got a free pass from the freezing thanks to the DRM situation and how they pitched it at their event, but Microsoft would have gotten no such pass.

    On that note, I could hardly watch the Destiny game play when onstage at the Sony event. There had already been freezing and stuttering in the beginning, not to mention the AC4 snafu, and I was actually looking away and hoping they would end the game play really soon, before more disaster struck. It turned out it didn't matter after the DRM announcement, but it almost mattered. And it was painful to watch.

    Idiotic for not using Windows 8 though. I mean, wtf, it's been out for nearly a year now. Lame.
    06-15-2013 02:23 PM
93 1234

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