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[Daniel Rubino]

I find it interesting that the numbers increased without any type of announcements. Are those numbers based on new unique victors or the usual suspects just clicking around more?

Our internal numbers show massive increases in forum traffic and store traffic during the A/B testing phase and since then. We also do other normal tests, including mouse tracking, engagement, time on site, etc.

A surge in numbers on a site redesign normally means users are kicking the tires to see what else has changed.

Maybe? I'm not going to presume why the increase, I just know it's not a decrease (subtle or sharp), which would indicate people are really put off from the design and do not come back.

Seeing no value in a front-page poll sounds like you don't want to see the actual results Also it's not a "designed by a committee" it's getting valuable feedback from visitors on how to make the site better which would drive up viewer count and ad revenue even more.

But how? We do a poll: 'Do you like or hate the new frontpage design?' Let's say 80% say they do not like it. Now what? Okay, we need to redo it, but what is it they do not like? Time for another poll. Then going off of that, what do they want? Another poll. Pretty soon, we are swimming in data from the power users of the site, where there is usually a negative bias towards complaining.

Meanwhile, I have numbers that show increased engagement, forum traffic, time on site, returns, and general increases in site traffic and very little negative feedback from users. Asking people what they think on design vs. what they are actually doing are just two different things.

As for me I'll be sticking to RSS and the Windows Phone app to get my content being the current design IMHO is done by someone that doesn't know how to layout data properly and needs to go back to design school.

That's fine, it's why those things exist I appreciate your feedback, but in the end, I'm a numbers man. I can't make changes to the site based on a few disgruntled users, I need to trust our dev team, our designers and our bean counters who can provide me numbers, charts and demonstrate the desired results.

We have had the new layout for nearly a week now and unless we see a sudden, massive turn in user satisfaction and those numbers start to drop, unfortunately, this format will stay. Granted, there is still more to come, there will be tweaks and some changes (that I want) coming too, so this isn't the end all, be all. For instance, I believe the option to turn off the Forum highlights on the front page for registered members is something in the works.

 

[primortal]

But how? We do a poll: 'Do you like or hate the new frontpage design?' Let's say 80% say they do not like it. Now what? Okay, we need to redo it, but what is it they do not like? Time for another poll. Then going off of that, what do they want? Another poll. Pretty soon, we are swimming in data from the power users of the site, where there is usually a negative bias towards complaining.

Thought would be an announcement about the design change. Poll: What are your thoughts? Do not like it (explain why in the comments section). I like it. I'm impartial.

I'm not asking to constantly poll till you get more positive numbers. Just to get a temperature of how users feel. Look at the most common complaint among the feed back and work on it. It's like going to the doctors and the doctor sees you in the exam room and asks you nothing and ignores everything you're saying what wrong with you. Takes your temperature and blood pressure, checks your ears/throat/nose and says I see nothing wrong and tells you the numbers looks good so there's nothing wrong with you.

I'm a fan of you cannot please everyone mentality but just to hear what people have to say goes a long way.

That's fine, it's why those things exist I appreciate your feedback, but in the end, I'm a numbers man. I can't make changes to the site based on a few disgruntled users, I need to trust our dev team, our designers and our bean counters who can provide me numbers, charts and demonstrate the desired results.

We have had the new layout for nearly a week now and unless we see a sudden, massive turn in user satisfaction and those numbers start to drop, unfortunately, this format will stay. Granted, there is still more to come, there will be tweaks and some changes (that I want) coming too, so this isn't the end all, be all. For instance, I believe the option to turn off the Forum highlights on the front page for registered members is something in the works.

Anytime. Numbers positive as they may be can lead you down the wrong path.

Glad to hear there more tweaking coming down the line.

For kicks show someone that's impartial and ask them if the site is easy to read or follow.

 

[michail71]

I'm rather impartial and I think it is easy to navigate.


I'll say it could use a little tweaking, such as presenting the articles in kind of a tiled like box or something, as we are seeing in much of Microsoft's newer designs. That's what I would do if it were my project. But it's not my project .

I'd guess the boost in traffic could be related to faster performance. I'd check the analytics of the different browsers before and after the change. If the results show most of it on IE's side that could explain it as that's what suffered performance wise.

 

[TheArcaneFlame]

I understand wanting to make decisions based upon the numbers. Having good data is definitely an important part of any thought out decision making process. But you have to make sure that you aren't misinterpreting the data that is there. And I think it is for this reason that you do need to consider why there has been an increase in site traffic, etc.

This is just a scenario to consider but perhaps the upswing in site traffic has more to do with an increasing number of people clamoring to get/share information about Windows 10 that than it does with the site design... As the newer, more usable Win10 builds are released and with more people continuing to join the Insiders program there is a growing demand for the latest info on all the changes and latest happenings... And with that more people want to discuss and voice their opinions on all of it further increasing comments and forum traffic.

So then you see the increased numbers and assume the design is having a positive impact when in reality that may not be what the numbers actually show. It's at least something to consider as to WHY there has been an increase because without knowing that, then you could be using the increase to support design changes when it isn't justified. Just food for thought.

As to why you wouldn't see a dramatic decrease in visits if people had a problem with it... This is just a guess but I would wager that for most people, if they are familiar with and trust a news site such as this, they are more than likely going to put up with design and usability issues that may inconvenience them rather than find new sources for their information.

Case in point, I don't care for the newer design... it doesn't benefit by method of browsing the site. But that said, it's currently not bad enough that I'm going to black list this site never to return. That would be reactionary and way overkill. I just don't think you're going to see that happen over design changes. I've been coming here for years and have seen many changes take place, some of which have been good, some not so much. But that's the nature of things... either they change or they tend to stagnate and die or become irrelevant.

My intention with voicing my criticisms here is not to be whiny... it's to see the site be more accessible and usable for everyone. If I'm in the minority, I can accept that. Hell... as Windows Phone advocates we should all be used to being in the minority at this point. That doesn't mean we're wrong though. And perhaps it's that mindset of always being in the minority which is why you see so much passion with people trying to plead their cases on things here. Because so often we feel like we get overlooked and aren't listened to.

With that said... I have seen some improvements on the site today though I think it's mostly on account of the ads having been removed so things line up better and are given a bit more space. At the end of the day, I know you're working on it. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt because overall I value Windows Central. It's kind of like Windows 10... I have submitted my feedback and done my part to contribute to voice my criticisms. Beyond that you either choose to accept it for what it is and try to see the benefits rather than getting hung up on the flaws or you need to move on to something else. And just like with Windows 10, I'll continue using it even if it isn't perfect in my eyes with the hopes that improvements will continue to come and it will get better (or I'll adapt) over time.

 

[michail71]

They did simultaneous side by side A/B testing so that's not very likely.

My guess is #1, performance and #2 is the infinite paging. People are far more likely to scroll down then click on a next page link. That requires a click and expectations it's going to take a bit of time for the next load. Also, you'll have to page back if you want to see the top again.

Traffic engineering on a website is a fascinating process. Besides better performance, changing a color or moving a link can have drastic results.

 

[dfaris]

The new site is terrible and should be returned to normal. The ads are a complete mess and make the site look even worse. Whoever came up with this layout should be removed from site layout work forever.

 

[michail71]

The ads were just as much of a mess on the previous design. The only sites with worse ads are those top 100 type lists that make you click through for each item.

I don't think they are any different. Somehow they made them not slow the site down as much.

 

[Daniel Rubino]

The new site is terrible and should be returned to normal. The ads are a complete mess and make the site look even worse. Whoever came up with this layout should be removed from site layout work forever.

​I have good news! None of what you have requested is happening

 

[CobaltDragon]

I know it's just me. I came from a desktop publishing world and the way the articles, popular discussions, store injection and the other articles that have larger images with indented teaser for some reason hurts the eye (eyes are bouncing all over the place) reading through the page. There's no symmetry where as the previous incarnation of the site flowed nice.

It is absolutely NOT just you. I don't mean to be rude, but this is one of the worst redesigns I've ever seen. The header that takes up 1/3 of the viewing area is tolerable, but the flow of articles (with varying image sizes and location in relation to the article title) is very jarring and hard to look at. The injection of forums, ads, and store stuff makes it even harder to know what you are looking at. This is not user-friendly design. I pretty much use the app exclusively now, this just hurts my eyes.

That is a big problem, but an even larger problem in my eyes (as a software engineer), is that performance is really bad. I can't scroll the site for a good 10-15 seconds upon first coming to it, and if I get far enough down it tries to load in more which again freezes the entire site for several seconds.

It's just not a good experience. Go for simple, neat, clean, and fast.

 

[michail71]

It could use a loading indicator when it starts pulling more page. When you hit the bottom is does feel as if it gets stuck without that feedback. And some visual cues to separate out the flow of articles and forum posts a little better. Little tweaks is all it needs.

 

[frylock]

Ironic that another well known tech site just did a relaunch with bigger graphics and slightly updated layout, yet they are consistent in terms of ads, forum messages, news, etc... They are much larger in traffic, but somehow this design is better?

 

[Marcus Adolfsson]

Frylock, which site would love to take a look?

I am working with our design team to incorporate some of the feedback from this thread into the next revision.