Sharing Apps between two accounts

[ironsoulreaver]

Geeze... I wasn't trying to get all crazy up in here. I was just saying.

 

[rdubmu]

It is worth noting, especially for those giving the OP a difficult time, that the Windows Store (not to be confused with the Windows Phone store) allows users to install apps on up to 5 devices AND you don't have to use the same login. The store app in Windows 8 has its own account setting. Presumably this is because you don't have to login to Windows 8 with a Microsoft account and PCs are typically multi user devices. Either way, there is some precedent for the OPs question and it isn't entirely out of the question.

I don't think it is out of the question either. Windows 8, IOS do let you share apps. I honestly do not know how android works with apps and the google play TOS.

Hopefully microsoft can do something about this. The developers who don't want to just then have their apps revoked.

 

[SinisterDuck]

I don't think it is out of the question either. Windows 8, IOS do let you share apps. I honestly do not know how android works with apps and the google play TOS.

Hopefully microsoft can do something about this. The developers who don't want to just then have their apps revoked.

Microsoft won't "do something about this" -- it's not in their best interest. They get a cut of the apps sold. They also won't want developers "revoking" apps. They have enough trouble getting them on board in the first place.

There's complaints of not enough quality apps on WP, and folks who prefer not to purchase the ones that do exist don't exactly inspire developers to get on the bandwagon. And folks who want a backdoor to not legitimately pay for the apps they want will, in the end, only make things worse.

 

[-Scienide-]

Just to add something else to the mix. On Sony's PlayStation it is possible to buy a full copy of a digital game and then download it to two consoles in the same home using the same account.

Thats not theft. Thats the model Sony have allowed.

So, the OP has a vaild question and I see where he is coming from. I don't think it becomes illegal unless you start trading login details, fudging the system to get things to download.

 

[ironsoulreaver]

It's still tied to the original account though. It's not sharing between accounts, but no that's not theft. Psvita solved the ps3's problem by only allowing one account per device and the card has to be formatted to switch accounts. I for see this happening alot in the future.

 

[andrelamont]

Equating the intentional iTunes purchase models as hacks / thievery / killing your first child / grand theft / felonies and etc is complete hogwash.

Apple on purpose, decide to be customer friendly towards families. There's nothing more to read into it. Sensationalizing or taking extreme viewpoints to win a debate says something about the strength of the argument points.

The Apple model can be abused and probably has, but its the most customer friendly model.

For example,

I have wife and 3 kids, the old model would be to buy a single CD rip it, and allow all 5 members of my family to gain access to the song by syncing. This is not stealing, pirating, harming the music artist and his/her right to feed their starving kids. I would have never bought 5 copies of the same album for all 5 members pre-iPod era. Of course if I made, duplicate CD and passed them out that would have been questionable.

So, now with iTunes, my FAMILY can buy one Rihanna album w/ one itunes account and we all can listen to it on our various iPods,iPads and iPhones....no crime was committed and apple understands this is how families work. If this model didn't exists..we would be back to buying physical CDs and iTunes would get no sales from family members. We can now sync, purchases by using iTunes Match/ Purchase History.


The MS Way...
We have a family XBox Live account...so when the Gears of Wars extra maps came out I had to buy one for me and it could not be used on my son and daughter Xbox on the same network in the same household. This choice by MS has led to our family buying less items because our family cant share the same maps or apps. We buy less because, the three of us don't all have the same expansion maps.

This model existed with the Zune product where I ended up being the only one with the product because the store model wasn't family friendly ( and no I am not talking about sharing the zune pass feature )

With the Windows Store, the Windows Phone Store and Xbox Store, MS has chosen a model that is not family friendly and its their choice. As consumers, we have options. I know the amount of of apps I have bought no my phone is 30x less than what I bought/approved of on our iTunes account and its directly related to the fact that my family can legally have access to the same model. I can tell you as the head CFO of my family, I have strongly recommended that they get iPhones/iPods for this very reason.

The MS way is a barrier for adopting Windows 8 machines in the household as Apple model (sigh...) just works

p.s, it hard for me to vision the starving developer image / with a $99 develeper registration fee, smart phone, modern computer, dual 24" monitor setup and etc. There are some truly homeless people in the world and a windows phone developer is not one of them.

 

[palandri]

Some of these DRM, RIAA...etc.. laws are confusing. How can iTunes allow family sharing and other can't? I don't get it.

There's a tavern by me that got in trouble. Whenever there was a pay per view event, like a professional boxing match, concert...etc... The tavern would purchase it and show it on their main TV. They never charged their customers to watch it. The owner of the tavern made some good points. He bought a business Comcast account specifically for his tavern, in his taverns name. If he bought a pay per view event, obviously it was going to viewed in the tavern, but that wasn't legal for some reason. I guess it's like the DJ who buys music, but can't play it at an event without paying additional DRM fees.

So I guess if I purchase a pay per view event at my house and invite friends over to watch it, that would be illegal, I guess. I find some of these laws confusing.

 

[philxor]

Looking at the actual Terms of Use posted on the Windows Phone Marketplace it simply reads:

1. INSTALLATION AND USE RIGHTS. You may install and use one copy of the application on up to five (5) Windows Phone enabled devices that are affiliated with the Microsoft account you use to access the Windows Phone Store/Marketplace.

It doesn't say anything about you being the owner of the device, having it in your control, etc. Hopmedic posted the ToU from Live.com which is completely different than the Windows Phone Marketplace. It states you can't have someone else controlling your account which is standard for pretty much any account-based service in existence. The WP Marketplace ToU are actually less restrictive than the iOS ones, which stipulate you must either own or control the device in order to install an application. To say that iOS has "app sharing" would be wrong, it really doesn't have any more allowances than WP does.

Keep in mind the ToU for media content on itunes is much more relaxed and they even have home sharing as a feature.

 

[msdugn]

hopmedic. For the sake of this community, please stop beating a dead horse with your personal interpretation that's anything but the sacrosanct truth you believe it to be.

If there are mods here, can we kill this thread for the sake of this forum and the Windows Phone community at large?

 

[rdubmu]

I think this is an important thread. I mean this is one restriction that may prevent many people from going to windows phone.

 

[ironsoulreaver]

So I guess if I purchase a pay per view even at my house and invite friends over to watch it, that would be illegal, I guess. I find some of these laws confusing.

Actually yes, technically it is illegal. I just took a law class on media and copyright and it's the way it's worded. It's intended to prevent people from running "public viewings" with consumer goods. The only legal way around it is using commercial license from the owning company. I think all this DRM and account locking is a bunch of crap and when you buy something you should get to do whatever you want with your property as long as your not making copies and giving it away to a bunch of other people. Unfortunately every single bit if digital content you purchase does not even belong to you and you only purchase the right to use it and is not transferable. We're backed into a corner and they wonder why so many people steal.

 

[rdubmu]

Microsoft won't "do something about this" -- it's not in their best interest. They get a cut of the apps sold. They also won't want developers "revoking" apps. They have enough trouble getting them on board in the first place.

I do see your point, I think the most important thing is to get windows phone into more hands, when this happens developers will come because there are a lot more customers. Something like a home sharing for apps I think would bring more people to this ecosystem, which would be better for the developer. Currently my wife is holding out because of this, I know it is just one person but that is probably for a lot of others as well.

 

[palandri]

hopmedic. For the sake of this community, please stop beating a dead horse with your personal interpretation that's anything but the sacrosanct truth you believe it to be.

If there are mods here, can we kill this thread for the sake of this forum and the Windows Phone community at large?

I understand your point and I also underderstand what hopmedic is saying. I just don't take it as personal as you or hopmedic do. I always purchase any software or music. If I am going to upgrade my wife's laptop from Win7 to Win8, I'll buy another Win8 upgrade. I won't try to use the one I purchased for my laptop. That's just the way it is with windows.

 

[palandri]

Actually yes, technically it is illegal. I just took a law class on media and copyright and it's the way it's worded. It's intended to prevent people from running "public viewings" with consumer goods. The only legal way around it is using commercial license from the owning company. I think all this DRM and account locking is a bunch of crap and when you buy something you should get to do whatever you want with your property as long as your not making copies and giving it away to a bunch of other people. Unfortunately every single bit if digital content you purchase does not even belong to you and you only purchase the right to use it and is not transferable. Were backed into a corner and they wonder why so many people steal.

Thanks for that. That's what I thought.

 

[ironsoulreaver]

How can iTunes allow family sharing and other can't?

I forgot about this one... Apple does not allow family sharing... your simply logging in to your iTunes account and downloading software. Technically your not sharing anything with anyone because your using your account to access the goods. It's a proper design on account management. One account for iCloud, one for synching your phone, one account for e-mail, and one for iTunes. Everything is it's own system. Apple just did a good job of making it an easy one step setup and you can log out of each service individually except syncing because your phones Serial is your account. With Windows Phone everything has to be under one account and that's where everything changes.

 

[philxor]

Apple allows family sharing of apps using the Home Sharing feature of iTunes but it works over local Wifi and when apps get updated it requires the original owner of the app to update and then re-sync the app so it's somewhat of a pain.

Most families share the same iTunes account so everyone just has the same apps, gets updates, etc.

There was a lot of fear Apple would make your iCloud account the same as your iTunes account but they didn't, if they had we'd have the same issues people are running into now with WP where so much is tied to a single login.

 

[ironsoulreaver]

Apple allows family sharing of apps using the Home Sharing feature of iTunes but it works over local Wifi and when apps get updated it requires the original owner of the app to update and then re-sync the app so it's somewhat of a pain.

Most families share the same iTunes account so everyone just has the same apps, gets updates, etc.

There was a lot of fear Apple would make your iCloud account the same as your iTunes account but they didn't, if they had we'd have the same issues people are running into now with WP where so much is tied to a single login.

home sharing just allows you to sync your idevice on multiple computers. You still need your account information. ITunes works just like on the phone. You login to your account and dl whatever app and then whoever syncs to that computer can install it.

 

[WPenvy]

Support the developers dammit. I've been to events by Microsoft and talked with these folks. What they do is quite challenging, and a pain at times. At least appreciate the fact that they're able to do stuff that you can't even come up with ideas for

 

[willied]

All I have to say is no one is stealing from a developer by account sharing if they aren't going to pay for it in the first place.

 

[tgp]

Support the developers dammit. I've been to events by Microsoft and talked with these folks. What they do is quite challenging, and a pain at times. At least appreciate the fact that they're able to do stuff that you can't even come up with ideas for

I agree with this, but yet I have to wonder why we aren't having the same conversation about iOS & Android developers. iOS & Android seem to have much more liberal sharing policies; if that's the problem, they should be the "unsupported" developers, not WP's.