Windows 8.1 vs Lollipop or Kit Kat

[Wam1q]

you call brick-heavy phones and crappy post-processing slow-as-a-snail camera software innovation?

Blame that slow-as-a-snail camera to the Nokia Camera app. I have plenty of alternatives which are fast on my aging Lumia 1020, too. And newer phones will get the updated Lumia Camera soon with lots of impressive camera improvements.

 

[thesachd]

FHD display at 6" is sharp and consumes lesser battery and resources than 2K. That's an advantage to the 1520, I guess.

Lumia Denim with the updated Lumia Camera (v5) will get all the good Camera-centric features to the 1520 soon (along with passive listening--Hey Cortana). And resuming occurs in 8.0-specific apps. 8.1-optimised apps don't have that issue.

Get your own facts correct, too.

Actually I've seen resuming occur on apps optimised for Windows Phone 8.1 quite a bit. I know there is FAS but resuming is an issue Windows Phone has not been able to resolve.

Hey...Android resumes apps as well when they we're opened a while but they don't take nearly as long as they do on Windows Phone.

And in my experience the DSP on the Snapdragon 800 requires quite a bit of battery to listen and process voice commands. The Nexus 6 has a dedicated Motorola voice chip that is much more accurate and fast and consumes less battery.

Maybe 1520 and 930 will get this feature soon, but we don't know yet how it'll work.

Also you haven't been able to discredit the fact that Adreno 420 > Adreno 330.

And also the Nexus 6 is cheaper than a 1520, at least in my country.

what???? dude i just saw this and decided to "educate" you
all snapdragon 800 Lumias are getting cortana voice activation when the display is on standby/off
if im not mistaken the Nexus 5 wouldnt be getting "ok google" voice activation when the display is off,itll only work when the display is on
also the "resuming" screen ensures your battery life is top notch
i have yet to see an android device which lasts a day of heavy usage and yet to see a windows phone which dies out in less than a day
also the "high and mighty" display wont make sense on a screen that small,before you "judge" this, the human eye only sees upto a certain resolution so anything above that is wasted and on a 6 inch screen,its even a bigger waste

theoretically if you want to make the best of the higher resolution of say a 4k laptop or a 2k 6 inch screen,the only way is to keep it very far away from yourself
which on a phone display is wasted and is still plausable on a laptop screen where the extra pixels are often needed by film editors etc
android 5.0 doesnt have bloat(yet) because only the stock android devices have got updates right now,so id expect bloat when more devices get updates
it also depends on how one defines bloat,id define bloat as some unneccessary google apps such as hangouts which is a pathetic and unreliable app and alot of smses just disappear within a few hours etc

also since you like to feel android is not bloated
its actually the only phone OS with bloat,unnecessary resource usage,only OS with antivirus,only OS which needs high specs to run etc etc

Nexus 5 is irrelevant here, the primary reason for why it might not have received passive voice detection yet is because it consumes battery(even despite that DSP) and the Nexus 5 doesn't have the best battery life as is. But passive voice detection does work on the Nexus 5 when the phone is on charging and screen is off.

Also there are tons of Android devices that could even last you for 2 days, so even if you have yet to seen one doesn't mean such an Android device doesn't exist.

Also an interesting fact I would like to share with you, about when you said higher resolution screen matters for video editing. Android supports some pretty advanced video features.

Also 2K display on a 5 inch screen may not entirely have a point. But having a 6 inch 2K display definitely matters. A difference from 368 to 495 PPI is pretty huge and though most would have you believe that your eyes can't see beyond 326 PPI, that's not entirely true.

Once your are used to watching 2K content, on apps like YouTube I'm pretty sure you won't feel the need to go back to 1080p, especially if you have a 6 inch screen so it does matter.

Also many phones are now getting 2K and 4K recording, it helps when you have a portable 2K screen to watch them on.

Moto G gets OK Google because it has a special voice coprocessor. Snapdragon 8xx already has the coprocessor built-in. No other Lumia devices have the coprocessor except Lumia 930/1520. If a cheap Lumia had that coprocessor, even that WP device could get Hey Cortana. It is hardware dependent. Not all KitKat devices have OK Google, either.

You took the specific example of a tiny phone with a tiny battery to compare with a giant phone with an enormous battery. Fair caparison... I beg to differ. I have a Lumia 1020 and get a full day out of it with moderate use. I got my Android friend to try WP by getting him a Lumia 530. The next week the first thing he said was that the battery life is excellent. He says he gets 2.5 days from a single charge with moderate use. So your allegations are false.

Moto G doesn't have a special voice coprocessor, get your facts right please.

 

[thesachd]

unneccessary google apps such as hangouts which is a pathetic and unreliable app and alot of smses just disappear within a few hours etc

also since you like to feel android is not bloated
its actually the only phone OS with bloat,unnecessary resource usage,only OS with antivirus,only OS which needs high specs to run etc etc

Also about the stock Google apps. Are there no pre installed Microsoft apps on Windows Phone?

Google apps are generally not considered bloat and they serve a function.

About your Hangouts bug, I genuinely sometimes doubt whether you've had the phones you claim to own because here's a message from my Hangouts back in 2012:



(I restored messages from an older app).

Also Hangouts wasn't bloat, it was an SMS app. Can you uninstall the stock SMS app on Windows Phone?

But at least Android let's you change the default SMS app, can Windows Phone do that?

 

[Karthik Naik]

^^why do you still come to windowscentral to spread nonsensical misinformation etc?
also hangouts is a pathetic app just like google+
also ms's preloaded apps can be uninstalled and the sms app works perfectly unlike lame hangouts
hangouts and google+ is bloat
also i own 10x more stuff than you,all from various brands and OS's etc
i doubt you own a non-android device

 

[thesachd]

^^why do you still come to windowscentral to spread nonsensical misinformation etc?
also hangouts is a pathetic app just like google+
also ms's preloaded apps can be uninstalled and the sms app works perfectly unlike lame hangouts
hangouts and google+ is bloat
also i own 10x more stuff than you,all from various brands and OS's etc
i doubt you own a non-android device

If you don't like Hangouts, switch to Messenger(also made by Google). I personally didn't find Hangouts latest redesign pretty visually appealing either so I switched my SMS app, wish I could do that on Windows Phone.

I thought that Google+ was bad too, but it's actually a pretty nice place but you won't find yourself at home there because there are very few(if any) Windows Phone supporters in there.

In many of the countries I've visited YouTube has been banned and I had to use proxies each time I accessed it. Google+ provided me with conversations in the comments section of YouTube videos without needing a proxy. So Google+ isn't bloat, at least for me and it can be easily disabled.

It's only logical for Google to promote it's own services on it's own platform, that's something Microsoft should do as well maybe Windows Phone gets somewhere then.

 

[Karthik Naik]

If you don't like Hangouts, switch to Messenger(also made by Google). I personally didn't find Hangouts latest redesign pretty visually appealing either so I switched my SMS app, wish I could do that on Windows Phone.

I thought that Google+ was bad too, but it's actually a pretty nice place but you won't find yourself at home there because there are very few(if any) Windows Phone supporters in there.

In many of the countries I've visited YouTube has been banned and I had to use proxies each time I accessed it. Google+ provided me with conversations in the comments section of YouTube videos without needing a proxy. So Google+ isn't bloat, at least for me and it can be easily disabled.

It's only logical for Google to promote it's own services on it's own platform, that's something Microsoft should do as well maybe Windows Phone gets somewhere then.

but why force users to use such services by default
why not let them uninstall it without root
why force them to sign up for google+ and hangouts,some of us like our privacy without such services
microsoft doesnt force you to use skype,Lync etc
Apple doesnt force you to use imessage,facetime etc
why should google

 

[Wam1q]

Hey...Android resumes apps as well when they we're opened a while but they don't take nearly as long as they do on Windows Phone.

Maybe 1520 and 930 will get this feature soon, but we don't know yet how it'll work.

Also an interesting fact I would like to share with you, about when you said higher resolution screen matters for video editing. Android supports some pretty advanced video features.

Also 2K display on a 5 inch screen may not entirely have a point. But having a 6 inch 2K display definitely matters. A difference from 368 to 495 PPI is pretty huge and though most would have you believe that your eyes can't see beyond 326 PPI, that's not entirely true.

Once your are used to watching 2K content, on apps like YouTube I'm pretty sure you won't feel the need to go back to 1080p, especially if you have a 6 inch screen so it does matter.

Also many phones are now getting 2K and 4K recording, it helps when you have a portable 2K screen to watch them on.

Moto G doesn't have a special voice coprocessor, get your facts right please.

I haven't used a Nexus with Lollipop yet, but since the latest preview builds for WP and the app updates, the Resuming... issue is gone on my 1020. Even the dreaded Skype app resumes instantly now. I assume it is up to par with Android (Somehow the Tapatalk app got the resuming... issue too. It was fixed in a recent update--that shows it is up to the devs to fix it).

Didn't you watch the Berlin event where they announced Lumia Denim? He demonstrated the feature with a Lumia 930. The phone screen was off and he said Hey Cortana and Cortana came up ready to take commands... So it works really nicely.

WP has got some really impressive video editing apps, too.

Most likely it is a placebo. You expect that 2K/4K is sharper than FHD and even if you cannot see the difference, your brain makes you think there is a difference though you cannot perceive it. I think anything greater than FHD on a phone screen is a waste of resources. And watching 2K/4K videos can be easily done on an FHD display without any loss of sharpness since your eye cannot (due to a physical design limitation--regardless of what you think) see that added sharpness.

Moto G has a coprocessor of some sort. The main processor can NEVER handle such a thing as passive listening. This is from experience. I have an Intel i5 laptop. I activated passive listening for voice commands once. Guess what? The processor got burning hot and the fan went out like crazy... If an Intel processor has so much trouble handling voice, how can an ARM processor handle it so easily? This means one thing: The Moto G has a coprocessor of some sort for sure. No software trick could get the functionality.

 

[Wam1q]

but why force users to use such services by default
why not let them uninstall it without root
why force them to sign up for google+ and hangouts,some of us like our privacy without such services
microsoft doesnt force you to use skype,Lync etc
Apple doesnt force you to use imessage,facetime etc
why should google

Apple sells you iDevices. Microsoft sells you Windows/Lumias. Google sells ads. And to do that, they need you using Google services. That's the basic difference.

That's why Google is trying to improve Android... They want people to keep on using Google services, so that Google keeps getting user data to profit from. Creepy model...

 

[thesachd]

but why force users to use such services by default
why not let them uninstall it without root
why force them to sign up for google+ and hangouts,some of us like our privacy without such services
microsoft doesnt force you to use skype,Lync etc
Apple doesnt force you to use imessage,facetime etc
why should google

To the best of my knowledge, and I've been using Android for over 4 years now Google has never really forced me to sign up for a service anymore than Microsoft has(with maybe one exception).

Google doesn't force you to make a Google account, you can even skip that in the startup. Also it doesn't force you to use Google+, it just remains as a service you can try out.

Google oftens itself makes phones cheaper and even goes as far as to subsidise them, for example GPE devices or the last gen Nexus series. Google makes it's money through advertisement so you can't really blame it for just showing you it's own apps or services, especially when it provides people with great devices.

If Google was going as far as to display ads on the home screen or throughout the UI, that would be going too far but me and probably a million other people are fine with the rest.

I haven't used a Nexus with Lollipop yet, but since the latest preview builds for WP and the app updates, the Resuming... issue is gone on my 1020. Even the dreaded Skype app resumes instantly now. I assume it is up to par with Android (Somehow the Tapatalk app got the resuming... issue too. It was fixed in a recent update--that shows it is up to the devs to fix it).

Didn't you watch the Berlin event where they announced Lumia Denim? He demonstrated the feature with a Lumia 930. The phone screen was off and he said Hey Cortana and Cortana came up ready to take commands... So it works really nicely.

WP has got some really impressive video editing apps, too.

Most likely it is a placebo. You expect that 2K/4K is sharper than FHD and even if you cannot see the difference, your brain makes you think there is a difference though you cannot perceive it. I think anything greater than FHD on a phone screen is a waste of resources. And watching 2K/4K videos can be easily done on an FHD display without any loss of sharpness since your eye cannot (due to a physical limitation--regardless of what you think) see that added sharpness.

Moto G has a coprocessor of some sort. The main processor can NEVER handle such a thing as passive listening. This is from experience. I have an Intel i5 laptop. I activated passive listening for voice commands once. Guess what? The processor got burning hot and the fan went out like crazy... If an Intel processor has so much trouble handling voice, how can an ARM processor handle it so easily? This means one thing: It has a coprocessor.

Apart from just perceived sharpness of a display a 2K panel provides for more real estate to view smaller text and get better out of a phone display.

Android allows for low power voice processing and video editing is great already, so in the future we might start seeing PC grade video/audio editing softwares in which a 2K display will prove very useful.

Sharpness or not higher resolution has other benefits.

And apart from this Snapdragon 800's DSP is pretty good but it isn't as good as Motorola's inbuilt solution voice detection system. It can detect some hot words pretty nicely but it can't differentiate between many different between different hot words or accents pretty easily.

Motorola's voice detection chip, used in the Moto X and Nexus 6 is much better. In fact on the Moto X it offers custom hotwords and the like...and it works from pretty far away as well.

I'm pretty sure Moto G doesn't have a voice coprocessor because Motorola's site doesn't list it in the specifications. But maybe it works well because the "OK Google" functionality is pretty well optimised and battery friendly.

I'm pretty active on the XDA community and OK Google actually worked well with some older Snapdragon S1 devices, on the home screen at least.

 

[Wam1q]

If you don't like Hangouts, switch to Messenger(also made by Google). I personally didn't find Hangouts latest redesign pretty visually appealing either so I switched my SMS app, wish I could do that on Windows Phone.

Disable the notifications from the default messaging app and use whatever app you want for messaging... Is it that difficult?

 

[thesachd]

Apple sells you iDevices. Microsoft sells you Windows/Lumias. Google sells ads. And to do that, they need you using Google services. That's the basic difference.

That's why Google is trying to improve Android... They want people to keep on using Google services, so that Google keeps getting user data to profit from. Creepy model...

They don't sell your personal data to consumers, only help in providing details for tailored advertisement. It's not creepy.

 

[thesachd]

Disable the notifications from the default messaging app and use whatever app you want for messaging... Is it that difficult?

What apps are there for SMS on Windows Phone?

It's a genuine question btw, I'm not making fun of WP.

 

[Wam1q]

They don't sell your personal data to consumers, only help in providing details for tailored advertisement. It's not creepy.

When did I say they sell my data? The use my data to build a profile of me and my personality and based on that, sell ads. This is creepy. Why should a company know my personality and make predictions on that when I wouldn't even want a stranger to know that?

E.g. I am a Nokia fan and used Chrome with Google search in the past. I frequently visit Nokia/WP sites. Now all ads I see in websites I run in Chrome are for the latest Lumias... :/

My cousin uses gmail and she applied for a job and sent her CV to the company and had an email conversation with the company. She told me that from the very next day, the ads were of job-finding websites... :/

Another cousin of mine told me he was working on a University project about cooling towers used in industries. He browsed the web a lot about that. He says that most of the ads are now related to cooling towers made by this company or that company... :/

 

[Wam1q]

What apps are there for SMS on Windows Phone?

It's a genuine question btw, I'm not making fun of WP.

I don't really know, but since you said you wanted to set an app as the default and couldn't, I gave you a suggestion. I assumed you had such an app already.

Edit: I guess GroupMe is similar to iMessage/Hangouts.
http://www.windowsphone.com/s?appid=4116f88c-ad1b-464a-b12d-c5f52b2e16e2

 

[link68759]

Efficiently or not, there are things the Nexus can do which the 1520 can't because of the newer specifications. For one thing it supports voice commands even when the phone is off.

It has a 2K display coupled with a Snapdragon 805 processor which allows for faster shot processing and tons of other improvements, and despite graphics already being better on Android the Adreno 420 will also provide a massive boost in graphics quality and speed.

And Android doesn't experience "resuming" and usually gets apps to open up and multitask faster than Windows Phone but still the Nexus 6 will be able to multitask even better because of 3GB RAM.

And lastly your notion about every Android update adds bloat, that is false. Every Android update released in the past few years focuses entirely on making performance better, and this year with 5.0 they have absolutely killed it. It's so smooth and silky, with very few things that they need to iron out, 4.4 was also a major step up in performance from 4.3 and previous versions of Android have done the same.

Also about the bloatware, Android 5.0 actually makes bloatware less of an issue: http://bgr.com/2014/10/29/android-5-0-lollipop-feature/

Also go ask anyone still rocking a Nexus 4 how their phone is running two years later on Android 5.0 and I'm sure they'll tell you how much faster it has gotten compared to the original 4.2

Please for gods sakes educate yourself before spewing out what you consider "facts".

Those would be some very good points if they had any relation to what I said.

 

[thesachd]

When did I say they sell my data? The use my data to build a profile of me and my personality and based on that, sell ads. This is creepy. Why should a company know my personality and make predictions on that when I wouldn't even want a stranger to know that?

E.g. I am a Nokia fan and used Chrome with Google search in the past. I frequently visit Nokia/WP sites. Now all ads I see in websites I run in Chrome are for the latest Lumias... :/

My cousin uses gmail and she applied for a job and sent her CV to the company and had an email conversation with the company. She told me that from the very next day, the ads were of job-finding websites... :/

Another cousin of mine told me he was working on a University project about cooling towers used in industries. He browsed the web a lot about that. He says that most of the ads are now related to cooling towers made by this company or that company... :/

I assumed you we're many of the people that believed Google sells the data of consumers. Sorry for that.

Anyways many of Google's policies may seem a bit strange at first however they usually serve a pretty useful purpose for most of the people.

StreetView was a highly criticised thing in the beginning, and still is, but such features have proved useful.

Also Google provides many of it's amazing services free of cost, what's wrong with watching a few ads here and there? Especially when they are catered towards your needs.

I only see ads on YouTube and I like watching YouTube ads because they not only make money for Google but also for the person that made the video, it's called monetisation(I think so)

 

[thesachd]

Those would be some very good points if they had any relation to what I said.

Did you not say that Android updates added bloatware which made phones slower?

 

[Wam1q]

I assumed you we're many of the people that believed Google sells the data of consumers. Sorry for that.

Anyways many of Google's policies may seem a bit strange at first however they usually serve a pretty useful purpose for most of the people.

StreetView was a highly criticised thing in the beginning, and still is, but such features have proved useful.

Also Google provides many of it's amazing services free of cost, what's wrong with watching a few ads here and there? Especially when they are catered towards your needs.

I only see ads on YouTube and I like watching YouTube ads because they not only make money for Google but also for the person that made the video, it's called monetisation(I think so)

You might be comfortable with the targeted ad model, but I am not. I have no problem with TV ads, billboards, etc., though, since they aren't targeted. My problem is the targeted ad model and since it is the primary way Google makes money, I avoid them as much as I can now.

 

[Wam1q]

Apart from just perceived sharpness of a display a 2K panel provides for more real estate to view smaller text and get better out of a phone display.

Android allows for low power voice processing and video editing is great already, so in the future we might start seeing PC grade video/audio editing softwares in which a 2K display will prove very useful.

And apart from this Snapdragon 800's DSP is pretty good but it isn't as good as Motorola's inbuilt solution voice detection system. It can detect some hot words pretty nicely but it can't differentiate between many different between different hot words or accents pretty easily.

Motorola's voice detection chip, used in the Moto X and Nexus 6 is much better. In fact on the Moto X it offers custom hotwords and the like...and it works from pretty far away as well.

I'm pretty sure Moto G doesn't have a voice coprocessor because Motorola's site doesn't list it in the specifications. But maybe it works well because the "OK Google" functionality is pretty well optimised and battery friendly.

I'm pretty active on the XDA community and OK Google actually worked well with some older Snapdragon S1 devices, on the home screen at least.

When the text gets so tiny, what's the use of cramming more into the display? I think text on an FHD display can stay crisp and provide enough real estate to work. 2K on 6" will probably make the text even smaller than the text on a 480p 4" display...

Editing 2K videos doesn't require a 2K display. You should be able to edit them fine with an FHD display and the right optimisation (I can edit FHD videos on my 1020's HD+ display--768p--fine).

If I remember correctly, Lumia 930/1520 are going to support custom hotwords, too.

If Moto G's voice recognition is good and it is always listening, it needs a coprocessor. Only if it isn't always listening, it can go without the coprocessor (like the example you quote about Snapdragon S1).

 

[Visa Declined]

I've been using Lollipop for a while now, and it's amazing. I'm still finding cool little things that are new, and I couldn't be happier with it.

The back and forth Android vs Windows Phone arguments I keep reading here are dumb, and it's the same points being made over and over. At the end of the day, just use whatever makes you happy, and stop trying to convince people otherwise.

After using Lollipop on my Nexus 5, I've decided to get the Nexus 6 next week when it lands on T-Mobile. I love that it uses an Amoled display, and has a Glance "type" feature. Also, being able to activate Google Now while the screen is off is pretty neat.

Neither Windows Phone or Lollipop is perfect, you guys can argue back and forth all week about it, but nobody is listening to anyone, and the whole thing is pointless.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pEDQ1z1-PvU