12-02-2015 11:33 PM
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  1. ajj3085's Avatar
    I'm in the Boston area and spend lots of time in the woods. There are places within 1 hr of the city with one or no carrier signals. AT&T had a bunk signal in the TD Garden where Bruins and Celtics play up until a couple of years ago. Did Verizon pay to have the only signal inside?
    Those areas are probably too lightly populated to justify building and maintaining a tower. Its the same in the Adirondacks. As for the stadium, possibly. They need to install special equipment or you'd have no signal in a subway. Maybe the stadium itself blocks (due to it being concrete and steel) the signals and required special equipment to compensate.
    10-11-2015 07:44 PM
  2. thatotherdude24's Avatar
    Unfortunately one of the best phones of the year is going to be dead before arrival whether any of us want to admit it or not. Windows Phone doesn't stand a chance with carrier exclusives.

    I would hands down buy the 950XL but I am on Verizon and that's all that works in my area.
    scolab and Frank Kajtazi like this.
    10-11-2015 08:33 PM
  3. oldpueblo's Avatar
    Can't wait to use my dead phone! I guess that makes me a necrophoniac.
    10-11-2015 08:50 PM
  4. tangledW's Avatar
    Let me sum this up...

    Microsoft is stupid...
    Microsoft doesn't care...
    Windows 10 mobile is doomed...

    ...because MY carrier won't be carrying it. Never mind their lack of support and down right hostile nature towards Windows phone and even Nokia for years.
    10-11-2015 09:03 PM
  5. DavidinCT's Avatar
    Let me sum this up...

    Microsoft is stupid...
    Microsoft doesn't care...
    Windows 10 mobile is doomed...

    ...because MY carrier won't be carrying it. Never mind their lack of support and down right hostile nature towards Windows phone and even Nokia for years.
    And your post does what to help this thread ? This is what is defined as being a Tro.....Oh, wait, I cant say it as you will get a warning on this site for it.

    I try to call them as I see em'
    aximtreo and chasvs like this.
    10-11-2015 09:10 PM
  6. bo_woods's Avatar
    Let me sum this up...

    Microsoft is stupid...
    Microsoft doesn't care...
    Windows 10 mobile is doomed...

    ...because MY carrier won't be carrying it. Never mind their lack of support and down right hostile nature towards Windows phone and even Nokia for years.
    You've summed up exactly how many ppl upset about the lack of Verizon support have been responding.... Their written temper tantrums mean nothing
    10-11-2015 09:17 PM
  7. bo_woods's Avatar
    And your post does what to help this thread ? This is what is defined as being a Tro.....Oh, wait, I cant say it as you will get a warning on this site for it.

    I try to call them as I see em'
    Seriously? Saying the word "T..,...r....,0...11" on this site gets you a warning? I never knew that :\
    DavidinCT likes this.
    10-11-2015 09:19 PM
  8. falconrap's Avatar
    T-Mobile started this push to carrier agnosticism by breaking the contracts up. It's time for all of us who are po'd about this to leave carriers like Verizon, if you can, and make sure they know why. As freedom to change becomes more common, eventually Verizon will be forced to reconcile itself to this new truth. They will need to start making sure they support the phones that people want, not just what they are willing to carry.

    If you are stuck with them, you can still vehemently voice your displeasure. They need to hear it often.
    10-11-2015 10:42 PM
  9. Jim_MAY's Avatar
    Screw Verizon anyways they'd find some way to botch their end of the support deal. I'd rather them not **** around this time if they do. Time for them to change face and ditch the monotonous villain undertones.
    Let’s ask who the real villain is, Microsoft or Verizon?

    If Microsoft did not make the phones CMDA ready wouldn’t that make them the ones cheating Verizon customers since they are the ones that developed the phone?

    This discussion is just all preliminary until Microsoft or Verizon confirms.
    10-11-2015 11:08 PM
  10. ArtificiallyYours's Avatar
    Gonna wait and see if the higher ups at Verizon dish out sensationalist lip like Marcelo of Sprint, and Legere of T-mobile.

    I'll love to read that bile.
    10-11-2015 11:25 PM
  11. PepperdotNet's Avatar
    My theory. I have no factual information to back this up, it's just a gut feeling.

    1. Microsoft designed and built a true "world phone" that supports every carrier.
    2. FCC certification for CDMA requires some level of cooperation from Verizon.
    3a. At some point, if MS and Verizon can reach an agreement, the necessary paperwork will be filed, and CDMA will be enabled via a firmware update pushed out by Microsoft to every 950 and 950XL.
    -or-
    3b. At some point, if MS and Verizon can reach an agreement, we will see an announcement of a Lumia 951 or 951XL with a big ugly Verizon logo on it. And that one will be unlocked, but AT&T and T-Mobile LTE bands will be disabled. There will be an additional monthly fee to enable continuum. Verizon will have full control of updates. You will be able to special-order it during a two-month window beginning no earlier than 9 months after the announcement. Then it will be discontinued.

    I'm hoping for 3a, but the pessimist in me says 3b is more likely.
    Last edited by PepperdotNet; 10-11-2015 at 11:48 PM.
    MikeSo, TK2011, oldpueblo and 4 others like this.
    10-11-2015 11:35 PM
  12. TK2011's Avatar
    My theory. I have no factual information to back this up, it's just a gut feeling.

    1. Microsoft designed and built a true "world phone" that supports every carrier.
    2. FCC certification for CDMA requires some level of cooperation from Verizon.
    3a. At some point, if MS and Verizon can reach an agreement, the necessary paperwork will be filed, and CDMA will be enabled via a firmware update pushed out by Microsoft to every 950 and 950XL.
    -or-
    3b. At some point, if MS and Verizon can reach an agreement, we will see an announcement of a Lumia 951 or 951XL with a big ugly Verizon logo on it. And that one will be unlocked, but AT&T and T-Mobile LTE bands will be disabled. There will be an additional monthly fee to enable continuum. Verizon will have full control of updates. You will be able to special-order it during a two-month window beginning no earlier than 9 months after the announcement. Then it will be discontinued.

    I'm hoping for 3a, but the pessimist in me says 3b is more likely.
    Or 3c: There would be no agreement at all.

    I actually suspect the software is probably just not ready for CDMA yet. It's barely ready for GSM deployment and usually CDMA takes backseat to GSM in terms of priority.
    10-12-2015 01:20 AM
  13. Bobvfr's Avatar
    Unfortunately one of the best phones of the year is going to be dead before arrival whether any of us want to admit it or not. Windows Phone doesn't stand a chance with carrier exclusives.

    I would hands down buy the 950XL but I am on Verizon and that's all that works in my area.
    It is not a carrier exclusive, more a "We cannot waste our time and effort doing business with companies that end up hurting us". MS have not gone to AT&T and said here is our new phone, you can have it and no one else will get it, more like here is our new phone, do you want, and although we don't know the details of the conversations with Verizon, it probably went badly.....
    10-12-2015 03:42 AM
  14. muddytoad's Avatar
    The 950 shows WCDMA, not CDMA. They are different.
    Yes I'm well aware of that. Here are the VERIZON Lumia 735 specs.
    Networks3
    GSM network: 850MHz, 900MHz, 1800MHz, 1900MHz
    GSM max data speed DL: EGPRS 296.0kbps
    GSM max data speed UL: EGPRS 236.8kbps
    WCDMA Band 1 (2100 MHz), Band 5 (850 MHz), Band 8 (900 MHz)
    WCDMA max data speed DL: 42.2Mbps (Cat 24)
    WCDMA max data speed UL: 5.76Mbps (Cat 6)
    LTE FDD network: Band 20 (800MHz), Band 3 (1800 MHz), Band 7 (2600 MHz)
    LTE max data speed DL: 150 Mbps (Cat 4)
    LTE max data speed UL: 50 Mbps (Cat 4)
    10-12-2015 04:53 AM
  15. falconrap's Avatar
    Yes I'm well aware of that. Here are the VERIZON Lumia 735 specs.
    Networks3
    GSM network: 850MHz, 900MHz, 1800MHz, 1900MHz
    GSM max data speed DL: EGPRS 296.0kbps
    GSM max data speed UL: EGPRS 236.8kbps
    WCDMA Band 1 (2100 MHz), Band 5 (850 MHz), Band 8 (900 MHz)
    WCDMA max data speed DL: 42.2Mbps (Cat 24)
    WCDMA max data speed UL: 5.76Mbps (Cat 6)
    LTE FDD network: Band 20 (800MHz), Band 3 (1800 MHz), Band 7 (2600 MHz)
    LTE max data speed DL: 150 Mbps (Cat 4)
    LTE max data speed UL: 50 Mbps (Cat 4)

    This has been answered numerous times on this thread. These are not the full specs of the 735. Here's the specs straight from their site:
    Cellular connectivity4
    • GSM network: 850 MHz, 900 MHz, 1800 MHz, 1900 MHz
    • GSM max data speed DL: EGPRS 296.0 kbps
    • GSM max data speed UL: EGPRS 236.8 kbps
    • WCDMA network: Band 1 (2100 MHz), Band 2 (1900 MHz), Band 5 (850 MHz), Band 8 (900 MHz)
    • WCDMA max data speed DL: 21.1 Mbps (Cat 14), 42.2 Mbps (Cat 24)
    • WCDMA max data speed UL: 5.76 Mbps (Cat 6)
    • LTE FDD network: Band 2 (1900 MHz), Band 3 (1800 MHz), Band 4 (1700/2100 MHz), Band 7 (2600 MHz), Band 13 (700MHz), Band 20 (800MHz)
    • LTE max data speed DL: 150 Mbps (Cat 4)
    • LTE max data speed UL: 50 Mbps (Cat 4)
    • CDMA network bands: BC1 (1900 MHz), BC0 (850 MHz)
    • CDMA max data speed DL: Rev 0 /A 2.4 Mbps /3.1 Mbps
    • CDMA max data speed UL: Rev 0 /A 153.2 kbps /1.8 Mbps


    Notice what is missing from your list that is in red? Verizon's LTE Band 13 (the high bandwidth 700MHz frequency that required VZW to offer all phones unlocked) and the CDMA bands BC1 and BC0.

    The phone physically supports the bands (Snapdragons have the support built in), but the firmware has these bands locked out. Unless Verizon starts allowing phones to authenticate over LTE, the phone won't work. Furthermore, without the 700MHz band, you likely won't get the LTE signal strength and bandwidth that Band 13 gives.

    10-12-2015 06:02 AM
  16. emigrating's Avatar
    Windows Phone doesn't stand a chance with carrier exclusives.

    I would hands down buy the 950XL but I am on Verizon and that's all that works in my area.
    It's not exclusive to any carrier - Microsoft are selling these, unlocked, to anyone who wants to buy it. They can then "activate" the phone on any network they choose. Hell, they're not even activating it, they're sticking a SIM card in it and the phone works.

    The problem is that Verizon is an old dinosaur, using old stone age technology. CDMA? Really? The world moved on well over a decade ago. Parts of the world moved on well over two decades ago. Sure, the phone's hardware may support CDMA but it's not enabled, and my thoughts on this is below.

    Lets ask who the real villain is, Microsoft or Verizon?
    My take on this is; Verizon has historically been bad for Microsoft. Look at how they have treated Windows Phone in the past, they've historically taken all and every opportunity to screw Windows Phone users or force them into using a new phone.

    The fact the 950's aren't supporting Verizon is Microsoft throwing a tantrum and purposely blocking CDMA in the Qualcomm SoC. The marketshare held by Windows Phone^W 10 Mobile is tiny in the US in the first place which means that Microsoft can easily afford to either, a) force Verizon subscribers to move to a different network or b) use a different phone/platform. It wont affect Microsoft's mobile marketshare either way, but it may "stick it to Verizon" like how they've done to MSFT in the past.

    Yes I'm well aware of that. Here are the VERIZON Lumia 735 specs.
    You might want to look up the specs again, because the CDMA specific ones are missing from your listing.
    10-12-2015 07:23 AM
  17. DavidinCT's Avatar
    Someone should make a sticky, the 950XL will NOT work on Verizon. Every 2-3 pages here we get someone posting the bands of the 735 to compare to the 950XL and missing the CDMA bands on the 735.

    The 950XL DOES NOT HAVE THE BANDS for Verizon, Period, it will not work, Close thread and create a sticky on this.
    libra89 and maevinj like this.
    10-12-2015 08:49 AM
  18. DavidinCT's Avatar
    Seriously? Saying the word "T..,...r....,0...11" on this site gets you a warning? I never knew that :\
    Yes, you will get a warning on this site for flaming someone and in the terms, calling someone a "Troll" is on that list. I called someone out at one point, and I got a warning on this site for it.

    read the terms of the site and you will see that..

    You learn something new every day :)
    10-12-2015 09:02 AM
  19. Charles Brown8's Avatar
    It's not exclusive to any carrier - Microsoft are selling these, unlocked, to anyone who wants to buy it. They can then "activate" the phone on any network they choose. Hell, they're not even activating it, they're sticking a SIM card in it and the phone works.

    The problem is that Verizon is an old dinosaur, using old stone age technology. CDMA? Really? The world moved on well over a decade ago. Parts of the world moved on well over two decades ago. Sure, the phone's hardware may support CDMA but it's not enabled, and my thoughts on this is below.


    My take on this is; Verizon has historically been bad for Microsoft. Look at how they have treated Windows Phone in the past, they've historically taken all and every opportunity to screw Windows Phone users or force them into using a new phone.

    The fact the 950's aren't supporting Verizon is Microsoft throwing a tantrum and purposely blocking CDMA in the Qualcomm SoC. The marketshare held by Windows Phone^W 10 Mobile is tiny in the US in the first place which means that Microsoft can easily afford to either, a) force Verizon subscribers to move to a different network or b) use a different phone/platform. It wont affect Microsoft's mobile marketshare either way, but it may "stick it to Verizon" like how they've done to MSFT in the past.


    You might want to look up the specs again, because the CDMA specific ones are missing from your listing.
    Verizon may be using outdated tech but when current GSM tech covers where I need it to and i can make a phone call I will switch. Switching to gsm is not always a acceptable answer..

    I also do not agree Microsoft can afford to shut out windows phone users new or existing due to a temper tantrum because they have low market share.. That's silly if you want to grow your market share. You cater to all potential customers if you want to grow, not just a select few because it's "that time of month"
    aximtreo likes this.
    10-12-2015 09:29 AM
  20. emigrating's Avatar
    Verizon may be using outdated tech but when current GSM tech covers where I need it to and i can make a phone call I will switch. Switching to gsm is not always a acceptable answer..

    I also do not agree Microsoft can afford to shut out windows phone users new or existing due to a temper tantrum because they have low market share.. That's silly if you want to grow your market share. You cater to all potential customers if you want to grow, not just a select few because it's "that time of month"
    It's still not Microsoft's fault Verizon is the operator of choice in some areas though. There are plenty of opportunity to dethrone Verizon, smaller communal GSM networks for example. The point is, it's down to Verizon to offer phones their customers want - if enough people threaten to leave stating the lack of a 950XL as the reason, you will get a 950XL.

    While it may be silly to "block" Verizon customers, it's pretty much a win-win for Microsoft. Sure, they lose out on some phone revenue, but they also "lose out" on support costs for the same. And since Microsoft is more and more turning into a services company, they'll be happy to provide you OneDrive, Outlook, OneNote, Office, Whatever services on any platform Verizon may carry.
    Charles Brown8 likes this.
    10-12-2015 09:50 AM
  21. psiu_glen's Avatar
    Here's my issue with that article. It conveniently leaves out carrier responsibility. Like how Verizon took forever to update the Icon, when they finally did they removed double-tap-to-wake, and THEN they just flat out discontinued it. -Mobile was probably the quickest to orphan support for their Windows Phones over the last few years. Neither carrier really cares about Windows Phone. Sure AT&T hasn't been perfect, but they are definitely in the lead when it comes to supporting Windows Phone. So yeah it makes sense for MS to keep a narrow focus while still giving us a decent amount of choice (unlocked).
    The Icon never had DTTW. So it never got removed.

    The Icon had Denim before anything on AT&T.

    AT&T neutered their 1520, still hasn't updated their 830 to support the latest Lumia camera features iirc.

    How does it make sense to narrow your customer base that you're trying to grow by taking the extra effort to cut some of them out?
    10-12-2015 10:05 AM
  22. Charles Brown8's Avatar
    It's still not Microsoft's fault Verizon is the operator of choice in some areas though. There are plenty of opportunity to dethrone Verizon, smaller communal GSM networks for example. The point is, it's down to Verizon to offer phones their customers want - if enough people threaten to leave stating the lack of a 950XL as the reason, you will get a 950XL.

    While it may be silly to "block" Verizon customers, it's pretty much a win-win for Microsoft. Sure, they lose out on some phone revenue, but they also "lose out" on support costs for the same. And since Microsoft is more and more turning into a services company, they'll be happy to provide you OneDrive, Outlook, OneNote, Office, Whatever services on any platform Verizon may carry.
    Oh iI understand what you saying but for some Verizon is not a operator of "choice" they are the operator that "works" and that's a big difference.
    10-12-2015 10:13 AM
  23. garak0410's Avatar
    Bottom Line - There needs to be a firm YES or NO on Verizon. The specs say NO. Microsoft and Verizon have no comment as of yet, which leaves a lot of speculation for us fans. As a Verizon user, this phone is sitting in my cart on Microsoft Store, ready to purchase if a firm YES is said by either Microsoft or Verizon. Sure, the market share is low and Verizon's history with Windows Phone is not good but there may be enough of a unified voice for something to be done for us fans...and no, not the Lumia 550
    10-12-2015 10:14 AM
  24. msft_tinkering's Avatar
    Let’s ask who the real villain is, Microsoft or Verizon?

    If Microsoft did not make the phones CMDA ready wouldn’t that make them the ones cheating Verizon customers since they are the ones that developed the phone?

    This discussion is just all preliminary until Microsoft or Verizon confirms.
    No, it's not. How do I know this? Because I waited 7 months after the release of WP7 before the HTC Trophy finally showed up on VZW, not to mention the temper tantrum VZW threw because VZW Navigator, Voice Mail, NFL Network, VZW Backup weren't baked into the Lumia Denim firmware so MSFT put them back in just so VZW Windows Phone users could uninstall that crapware at first boot up.

    VZW has a limited number of people to do testing and validation. It's obviously more important to VZW to have the next 6 android devices validated before they get around to doing so for Windows Phone\Mobile.

    It's a sucky situation because they do have the best coverage, so YOU have to make the choice between the device / mobile OS YOU want or coverage. No, I don't like having to make that choice either.
    10-12-2015 10:24 AM
  25. HoosierDaddy's Avatar
    I try to call them as I see em'
    Wait. You just called someone a troll for doing that. Confused.
    10-12-2015 11:02 AM
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