Without Verizon support, is WM10 DOA?

[afripino]

As a Verizon user still holding onto his discontinued Lumia Icon, I definitely found it unfortunate that Verizon doesn't want to "play ball" and continue supporting WM10. As one of the largest carriers in the US, I think WM10 doesn't stand a chance if it can't get adoption on VZW. I hope they can make a deal, but things are looking pretty bleak at this time. The problem is, both users AND devs will have to switch to AT&T in order for WM10 to thrive and that's just wishing for a miracle.

 

[Jeddic]

Windows has been able to sustain a user base without carrier any real carrier support for years. Over the last few years, carrier support ranged from phones being carried in stores, but tucked away in a corner, to phones being carried, but salespeople doing everything they can to dissuade people from buying them. When you consider this situation, along with no flagships in some time, the update situation, and the stiff competition, the fact that WP has held onto 3% in the US is pretty good. If they can just bring feature parity in some major features, and fix the update issues with these new flagships, they'll be in a better situation than they have been.

As far as W10M dying goes though, nothing can kill it but Microsoft. MS is committed to having a mobile OS, so even if no one used it, they would support it as part of their business strategy.

 

[Tumultus]

Well, the world doesn't stop on the US borders, so, as sad as it may be for US customers, 1 single US network provider doesn't make nor break a mobile platform on a global scale. Windows Phone is more popular outside of North America anyway.

 

[theefman]

Yeah right, without Verizon W10M is doomed, DOOMED I tell ya! rly:

 

[bo_woods]

No, because Verizon alone (the most expensive US carrier there is to my knowledge) doesn't determine the fate of an entire OS.

The new Lumia 950 & 950 XL devices have Unlocked versions that will work on any other GSM carrier. Which is what I believe most carriers use outside of the U.S. One single U.S carrier being uninvolved is a small percentage of potential users being left out when compared to the many global GSM carriers there are. As for these other GSM carriers who aren't carrying the devices, the 950 & 950 XL can once agian eb bought unlocked. For those of us who dont want to pay full up front price of a Smartphoen and instead like a small downpayment with monthly installments, we can only hope Microsoft will one day add that addition to our methods of purchase. Verizon never treated WP nicely anyway. They would just carry the phone, slap their logo on it, rarely push updates and never advertise it. Their so called "support" won't be missed by anyone but the very few Verizon users wanting WP that there are.

Now onto my second point. LUMIA IS JUST ONE PRODUCT FAMILY!! just because these two Lumia's aren't supported by Big Red doesn't mean Samsung, HTC, or Huawei can't get a WP10 device on their network. WP10 is an OS and I'm pretty sure other OEM's will jump in and spread the availability of W10 mobile.

Lastly these phones are Flagships. They are Top Notch and High Quality. Although high spec'd high quality flagship phones may be very common in the U.S, in other countries apparently cheap phones are the thing. The cheap phones that come are going to sell more anyway as many parts of the world can't afford these jewels of tech. For people who want a cheap W10 mobile device, there will be options and for people who want an expensive high quality W10 mobile device, there will be options (even on Verizon... eventually)

 

[tuxedo323]

3rd party manufacturers should fill in the void.

 

[bo_woods]

Why are people analyzing their reasonably small scale issues with the predicament of the situation and concluding that it will lead to the fall of the entire cause?

 

[Rose640]

After the Lumia 640 launch, more and more people are getting interested in these phones and the platform. Lumia 640 ads are on about 150 out of 200 channels i have, including Fox, Nat Geo and similar. So, i think they're going in the right direction. As far as i can see they have a great carrier support here in Balcan, all major ones have their phones on sale at incredibly affordable prices, for our region at least.
I think they can do well without the Verizon when we look at the greater picture.

 

[afripino]

Why are people analyzing their reasonably small scale issues with the predicament of the situation and concluding that it will lead to the fall of the entire cause?

Because Verizon's numbers are nothing to overlook. 3% of the US is still larger than 11.9% marketshare in GB and other smaller countries. With VZW being THE LARGEST carrier in the US with 133 million subscribers, you can pretty much count out any marketshare growth which will probably lead to marketshare drop as some VZW WM10 users will upgrade their antiquated Icons to iPhone/Android devices rather than switch carrier and you can bet that will not help dev incentive for creating apps that truly help grow the market. It's not a small scale issue. The US is a major market and VZW is a major carrier.

 

[Tumultus]

Because Verizon's numbers are nothing to overlook. 3% of the US is still larger than 11.9% marketshare in GB and other smaller countries. With VZW being THE LARGEST carrier in the US with 133 million subscribers, you can pretty much count out any marketshare growth which will probably lead to marketshare drop as some VZW WM10 users will upgrade their antiquated Icons to iPhone/Android devices rather than switch carrier and you can bet that will not help dev incentive for creating apps that truly help grow the market. It's not a small scale issue. The US is a major market and VZW is a major carrier.

Except, those Verizon numbers are dwarfed when looking at the Asian market. I know it is difficult because people only see their own little world. For the US, it probably has a huge impact when the largest provider doesn't put Windows devices on the shelf, however, even Verizon can't keep that up forever if there is increasing customer demand. So, let's all be glad that at least AT&T is carrying the 950 and that Microsoft will sell the devices unlocked to be used with any other carrier.

 

[afripino]

So we're comparing a country to a continent now? Name one mobile OS that is successful without a US user base.

 

[Tumultus]

So we're comparing a country to a continent now?

If you're referring to my post, then, yeah, I have to because you compared the United States to GB and other smaller countries. If you want equality, you would have to compare, say, Texas to GB or Arkansas to Germany. Otherwise, you should compare the US to the European Union. If you don't follow your own rules, I'll compare the US to the Asian market - as simple as that!

 

[Krystianpants]

There's actually good information that ms may be waiting for full production units on an rtm w10 mobile before it certifies on Verizon network. They are required to do by a third party and FCC rules mandate Verizon can't block once certified. So cdma band may be enabled either at launch or shortly after with firmware update.

 

[afripino]

Ok...so we'll go with the Asian market. What are the marketshare figures for Asia? 2.3% in China. I'm sure with those figures we can just forget about VZW in the US then and still bank on success. /s

 

[Tumultus]

Ok...so we'll go with the Asian market. What are the marketshare figures for Asia? 2.3% in China. I'm sure with those figures we can just forget about VZW in the US then and still bank on success. /s

Except for the fact that 2.3% in China is far more users than 3% in the US. Boy! Have a look at the population count before you dismiss small percentages!

 

[afripino]

I'm not dismissing China, you're dismissing the US. The combination of small, single digit marketshares means they need to reach AS MANY people as they can.

 

[a5cent]

Name one mobile OS that is successful without a US user base.

Well, it's debatable, but we could count AOSP as such an OS.

It has 0% market share in the U.S. , yet it's extremely successful in Asia and Russia. It's the reason Android is counted as having 85% market share, because AOSP and Android are somewhat incorrectly counted as being the same thing. For every official Android device sold in the world, two are sold running AOSP.

As far as global market share is concerned, China is now more important than the U.S. WP having around 2% market share in China is by far the most significant contributor to WP's low world wide market share number.

 

[Tumultus]

I'm not dismissing China, you're dismissing the US. The combination of small, single digit marketshares means they need to reach AS MANY people as they can.

No, I am not dismissing the US. Just sticking to the topic starter's concern that not being on Verizon may kill the operating system.

 

[Tumultus]

Well, it's debatable, but we could count AOSP as such an OS.

It has 0% market share in the U.S. , yet it's extremely successful in Asia and Russia. It's the reason Android is counted as having 85% market share, because AOSP and Android are somewhat incorrectly counted as being the same thing. For every official Android device sold in the world, two are sold running Android AOSP.

As far as market share is concerned, China is now more important than the U.S. WP having 0% market share in China is by far the most significant contributor to WP's low world wide market share number.

Nokia's Symbian was such an operating system. Almost no traction in the US but market leader anywhere else.

 

[afripino]

WAS is the key word there.